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Brexit

Westminstenders: It couldn't get any worse... Until today

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 09/07/2019 22:02

We are trapped in the tailspin of the end of the UK. Firmly headed downward and getting more and more frenzied and desperate.

Even the most sensible of types like David Allen Green have finally noticed that Brexit isn't about leaving the EU it's about the frenzied and wilful destruction of our state instutions and structure. The collapse of the civil service, of our justice system, our democratic institutions and social order. All in the name of rule Britannia, a warped sense of taking back control to preserve an ideal that never existed and an idea of sovereignity that simply was a fantasy.

We move ever closer to Johnson becoming Prime Minister and a life under President Trump.

Joy.

Ode to Joy really isn't that bad.

OP posts:
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MmeBufo · 10/07/2019 22:52

www.inbrief.co.uk/media-law/journalists-sources/ Forgot to add link from tweet

BigChocFrenzy · 10/07/2019 23:04

Civil service are not paying competitive salaries for the level of responsibility

Of course the average worker on 20-30k doesn't have that responsibility, hence the average pay

Those senior civil service jobs should be several multiples of average pay

People in private firms who are managing multi-million projects get paid far more

People in IT at junior / mid management level get paid more

BigChocFrenzy · 10/07/2019 23:07

I was just wondering if BJ - or more likely his SPAD - had downloaded the cables,
but I see part of that leak is v recent - the Iran bit - so I don't see how it could be him

BigChocFrenzy · 10/07/2019 23:12

imo, the leak enquiry will be squashed, as the culprt can only be a Brexiter, almost certainly a Tory

It would have been interesting to see if Isabel Oakeshott would be willing to go to jail for her principles: a rightwing Brexit, that is, not press freedom

MmeBufo · 10/07/2019 23:16

you are almost certainly right BigChoc, would be par for the course. I'm always one for gripping a bit of false hope.

Motheroffourdragons · 10/07/2019 23:28

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

Motheroffourdragons · 10/07/2019 23:29

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

PigeonofDoom · 10/07/2019 23:41

Pay is not competitive in general across the public sector bigchoc, it’s why you have weaknesses in any areas where staff could more easily get high paying jobs in the private sector (eg IT). There are perks though- job stability, good annual leave, family friendly working (lots of part time jobs), good redundancy and pensions packages. It’s not all about pay. I could get paid more in the private sector but I’d struggle to find the same level of flexibility, for example.

BigChocFrenzy · 10/07/2019 23:56

I've had great flexibility for 20 years now - it's the norm in tech and science
e.g. my current place (in Germany) allows us to work 4-10 hours between 6am and 8pm, genuine 35-hr week, flexitime days off at wish etc

BigChocFrenzy · 11/07/2019 00:02

and people can go pt quite easily, for family reasons or just to spend more time chilling , reduced days or shorter ones
I chose to go pt for my final year before retirement in Jan, but I could have done so before

BigChocFrenzy · 11/07/2019 00:03

Holidays quite good, 32 days+public holidays

BigChocFrenzy · 11/07/2019 00:14

Johnson has thrown US ambassador under the bus, say top Tories

Well, your lot selected him for the final 2, knowing he'd almost certainly be PM Hmm

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/jul/10/kim-darroch-resigns-as-uk-ambassador-to-us-after-leaked-trump-comment

he concluded he could not go on after he watched Tuesday’s Conservative leadership TV debate,
where Johnson repeatedly dodged questions about whether he would sack the ambassador if he became PM.
.....
A broad political consensus has emerged that Johnson’s refusal to back Darroch had made the diplomat’s position untenable.

Senior Conservative MPs joined the direct criticism of the leadership contender, describing his conduct as “unedifying” and “contemptible”.

Tom Tugendhat, the chair of the foreign affairs select committee, asked:
“If you do not support those you put into very difficult positions, what do you think is going to happen?”

In language that will be viewed as an implicit rebuke of Johnson, Theresa May told MPs:
"I hope the house will reflect on the importance of defending our values and principles, particularly when they are under pressure.”
....
Sir Alan Duncan, a Foreign Office minister, attacked Johnson’s role in the affair.
“For someone who wants to lead, let alone unite, the country, that was contemptible negligence on his part,” Duncan told the BBC.
“He has basically thrown this fantastic diplomat under the bus to serve his own personal interests.”

The Conservative MP Sir Patrick McLoughlin agreed, saying:
“It is unedifying to see someone who wants to be prime minister failing to stand up for hard-working civil servants, who have done nothing wrong, under attack from foreign governments.
Leadership involves standing up for your team.”
...
Jeremy Corbyn called the treatment of Darroch “beyond unfair and wrong” and said he had given “honourable and good service”.

BigChocFrenzy · 11/07/2019 00:20

Kim Darroch: effectively sacked by Johnson on the orders of Trump

www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jul/10/kim-darroch-effectively-sacked-by-johnson-on-the-orders-of-trump

There is now shock and contempt across the Foreign Office and in parliament, not just towards the leaker and Trump but also towards Johnson.

Whatever sanctimonious expressions of regret Johnson mouths and however much he blames the leaker,

the Foreign Office knows he effectively sacked Darroch,
believing he was carrying out the orders of Donald Trump

Icantreachthepretzels · 11/07/2019 00:53

Can BJ still back out of the leadership contest - now that the ballots have gone out - can he still say 'oh - I made a terrible mistake not supporting our ambassador and realise it's not right for me to PM' - and weasel out of owning his shit that way? Or are both candidates locked in tight, now the voting has started?
All these tories publicly denouncing him sort of makes his position untenable before it even starts. Add in the fact the job is a poisoned chalice (into which he personally spilled the cyanide) - he might make less of a fool of himself if he bows out of the running than if he tries and fails miserably. But does he still have time to back out?

BigChocFrenzy · 11/07/2019 01:17

The quickest ever buyers' remorse - from Tory MPs !🤦🏻‍♀️

They should have known what he would be like

Of course he can technically stand down,
but he has no sense of shame
and the Brexshit fanatics that dominate the Tory party membership think he has done no wrong

BigChocFrenzy · 11/07/2019 01:21

How many of these Tory critics will actually vote against him in an NC vote ?

imo, no more than would have before this leak

So, why stand down - unless he decides it's all too difficult and not the piffling fun he expected

BestIsWest · 11/07/2019 06:00

A relative who is a Heo in civil service on around 30k in an operational role has 90 staff. G7 is 2 grades above that.

NoWordForFluffy · 11/07/2019 06:18

I don't know actually. I think that Johnson would find that more Tories would vote against him in a VoNC.

But...Labour now has its own godawful mess which it has to absolutely deal with after (disgracefully) dodging it for years. Will they even dare to go for the NC vote?

Politics is fucked. We're fucked.

Mistigri · 11/07/2019 06:26

There are perks though- job stability, good annual leave, family friendly working (lots of part time jobs), good redundancy and pensions packages

I think these might have been advantages in the past but is that still true? A lot of big private sector companies - the ones who are competing to employ experience, senior strategy people - offer flexible working, decent pensions, job stability. My employer has embraced Skype with enthusiasm, these days I can only tell if U.K. colleagues are working from home if they tell me they are.

Mistigri · 11/07/2019 06:27

As for Brexit and Johnson, as Steve Bullock on Twitter just posted, have the soft coup people overplayed their hand? (Mind you, I've thought this before and it's come to nothing).

There does seem to be genuine outrage at Trump and Johnson conniving to sack a diplomat.

NoWordForFluffy · 11/07/2019 06:30

Other parts of the private sector are trying to drag themselves into modern life and giving their flexibility and benefits an overhaul. It'll take some time for them to catch up at SME level though due to cost.

RHTawneyonabus · 11/07/2019 07:21

I’ve really never known outrage like this about the ambassador. Apparently there was an all staff meeting in FCO to show him support and it was the best attended ever.

Someone had been planning this for a while and had saved up two years worth of diptels to do it. Perfectly timed soMay had to take the flack but most of the postal votes had already been returned.

BigChocFrenzy · 11/07/2019 07:53

Outrage is not among the True Believers in the Tory & Brexit parties

They just support BJ even more, for getting rid of a "traitor"

PigeonofDoom · 11/07/2019 07:53

I think it depends on your field bigchoc and misti. In the biosciences, a lot of companies are still pretty traditional eg the big employer locally in my field has a terrible reputation for treating staff poorly and mainly employs people in their 20s for this reason. I’m in the public sector and we get a lot of staff from them! Long hours, zero flexibility, part time only if you have been in post a long time and are senior- these are all fairly normal in my industry (pharma). Lots of takeovers and following redundancies. Of course, there are companies that do better but they’re all based in the southeast, and not everyone lives there Wink

BigChocFrenzy · 11/07/2019 07:56

Also, misti and I probably know furrrin conditions better than UK ones - well, I do