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Brexit

Leavers rejoice

999 replies

Coppersulphate · 13/05/2019 11:01

The Brexit Party are doing really well in the polls. I just hope they do as well in the election.
I think their slogan should be "Tell them again".
I would like to see a clean sweep of Brexiteers but I know that is not going to happen.
I have sent off my postal vote.

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11
Thefatcatssleeping · 14/05/2019 12:49

As the subject regarding Ireland has been touched upon. I thought this was an interesting watch
www.facebook.com/IrexitFreetoProsper/videos/2547757288780877/
This is the 2nd Party I’ve seen expressing the possibility of Ireland leaving the EU.

DorisDaysDadsDogsDead · 14/05/2019 13:00

Given Ireland's recent 88% approval rating of being in the EU, I suspect anyone still pushing the Irexit bullshit is either dishonest or stupid. Or, possibly, both.

DorisDaysDadsDogsDead · 14/05/2019 13:06

Fartage showing his popularity again...

Leavers rejoice
1tisILeClerc · 14/05/2019 13:09

Thefatcatssleeping
Anybody can pick a couple of headlines and then make a claim things would be better but you have to consider the whole 'package'.
The claim of greater 'sovereignty' is one such. NO ONE on the planet is totally 'sovereign' as interaction at any level with anyone else erodes it.
You can't demand that anyone trades or negotiate entirely on your terms.
There will always be dissenters, but they have to come up with a credible and ACHIEVABLE plan, something the UK government has totally failed to do.

Coppersulphate · 14/05/2019 13:13

You all keep referring to the GFA.
The GFA does not mention anything about borders. It does not specify what sort of border, or no border that there will be.
I am not saying that we should have a hard border. In fact I have not commented on what, if any, sort of border there should be. What I am saying is:
THE GFA DOES NOT SAY ANYTHING ABOUT BORDERS.
So please stop saying that Brexit will tear up the GFA.
And Leo Varadaker can say what he likes, but if the UK were to establish a hard border,(and I not not saying we should) there would be nothing he could do about it.

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DorisDaysDadsDogsDead · 14/05/2019 13:18

"And Leo Varadaker can say what he likes, but if the UK were to establish a hard border,(and I not not saying we should) there would be nothing he could do about it."

And we're back to the Empire spouting sense of exceptionalism...

Peregrina · 14/05/2019 13:19

And Leo Varadaker can say what he likes, but if the UK were to establish a hard border,(and I not not saying we should) there would be nothing he could do about it.

And if the UK were to do so, then it would be extremely unlikely if hostilities didn't recommence.

Coppersulphate · 14/05/2019 13:21

Doris and Peregrina, I am not suggesting we have a hard border.
I am just referring you to reality.

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DorisDaysDadsDogsDead · 14/05/2019 13:24

The reality is that the UK would then immediately be considered a pariah state, and any Quitlings "ideas" of wonderful trade deals would be instantly scuppered.

But I'm not expecting Quitlings to start thinking further than their noses any time soon...

Isthisafreename · 14/05/2019 13:29

@Coppersulphate - The GFA does not mention anything about borders. It does not specify what sort of border, or no border that there will be.

No, it doesn't. But is does have a lot of detail on cross-community and cross-border co-operation, much of which would be difficult, if not impossible, without an open border.

Isthisafreename · 14/05/2019 13:32

@Coppersulphate - And Leo Varadaker ( sic ) can say what he likes, but if the UK were to establish a hard border,(and I not not saying we should) there would be nothing he could do about it.

Ah yes, here comes the jackboot of British imperialism again.

It won't be quite so easy this time round.

Peregrina · 14/05/2019 13:36

It won't be quite so easy this time round.

As with Hong Kong being given back to China - the British Government knew that the game was up, and that the Chinese were more powerful than them.

1tisILeClerc · 14/05/2019 13:42

The EU doesn't want to put up a border across Ireland but in reality it would need one the same as EU members have that border Russia.
Those that trade across those borders simply accept that is the way things are, with controls of people and goods.
The 'backstop' is to treat all of the Island of Ireland as one for customs and single market. It is the UK that is leaving and has created the problem, therefore the UK has to sort it out with whatever compromise OF THE UK is necessary.

Isthisafreename · 14/05/2019 13:44

@Sycamorish - I'm sorry, but this university doom and gloom is just the academic branch of Project Fear.

Really? Do you have data to back that up?

I was reading an article in Times Higher Education about some of the impacts already being felt in the university sector. www.timeshighereducation.com/news/uk-universities-lose-grants-and-staff-brexit-uncertainty-grows?utm_source=THE+Website+Users&utm_campaign=310ef8bab3-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2019_04_08_12_43&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_daa7e51487-310ef8bab3-62248513

You need to register to read it so I'll quote some of the highlights:

Leading professors have warned that uncertainty over the UK’s future access to European Union research funding is already undermining grant applications and forcing academics overseas.

professor of primary care health sciences at the University of Oxford, said that she had been shortlisted for a €10 million (£8.6 million) ERC grant but felt that she was “unlikely to get it now”, given the uncertainty about whether the project could be completed. “If I were to win the grant, and we left Europe without a deal, there’s no question I’d lose the funding,” she said.

Another UK academic, who asked not to be named, said that she and her colleagues had been excluded from opportunities to work with longstanding collaborators on the Continent who feared the consequences of having British scholars on grant applications.

“They’ve been good to us and understanding for so long, but we are beginning to see a breakdown in collegiality,” she warned. “There is no doubt collaborations will crumble and we will be left out in the cold.”

Dorothy Bishop, professor of developmental neuropsychology at Oxford, said that her ERC grant, which is 18 months in, covers her salary and that of several staff. “If there was hard Brexit and the government did not cover the lost funds, there would be many redundancies,” she said.

Growing numbers of researchers have indicated that the uncertainty over access to EU funding has driven them to move abroad.

Earlier this year Catherine Heymans, professor of astrophysics at the University of Edinburgh, told Times Higher Education that she was moving to the University of Bonn after winning a €1.5 million grant backed by the German government.

“It’s Brexit. The day after the referendum I started looking for alternative funding, because over my career about 90 per cent of my funding has come from the EU,” she said.

Isthisafreename · 14/05/2019 13:46

Another article on research funding in Nature magazine: www.nature.com/articles/d41586-018-07423-9. It mentions the £1 billion a year the UK currently gets for research from the EU

bellinisurge · 14/05/2019 13:55

Everyone is going on about GFA @Coppersulphate because that is the only thing stopping Brexit.
Spoiler Alert: wishing it away doesn't make it go away.
WA kind of made Brexit work with GFA. That's why it should have passed.
There's even a Commons majority for WA but, foolishly, there's only a Commons majority if there is an"alternative arrangement " to the backstop- which is only in the WA because of the border. Tbe backstop might not even have been necessary if a technological solution turned.
And no one has come up with an alternative arrangement. NO ONE.

And so, it will be No Deal or No Brexit come the end of October.
I supported WA. I will never support No Deal.
What have you got ?

Isthisafreename · 14/05/2019 14:26

@bellinisurge - There's even a Commons majority for WA but, foolishly, there's only a Commons majority if there is an"alternative arrangement " to the backstop

An alternative, unspecified, arrangement to the backstop.

Having been told surgery is necessary for my broken wrist, I would like an alternative, unspecified, solution but unfortunately, if I can't specify, I need to go with the surgery or end up with a deformed wrist as I can't figure out what I want.

lonelyplanetmum · 14/05/2019 14:29

I'm sorry, but this university doom and gloom is just the academic branch of Project Fear.

Ah is it really. The economist etc must be wrong again then.

Try saying it's fake news to my DDs boyfriend who had his year long placement pulled completely ( and with it his job prospects.)

Aeronautical engineering you see was dependent on movement of skilled workers, access to engineering resources and the freedom to trade with customers, group companies and suppliers across the EU.

Yes let's rejoice - If she stays with her boyf my DD will try and move abroad so he can get work. If he can get a visa to go anywhere, and if he can get a job having lost the chance of a vocational placement. But hey let's rejoice.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.economist.com/britain/2019/03/04/what-would-a-no-deal-brexit-mean-for-universities-and-research

sciencebusiness.net/news/brief-reminder-how-brexit-will-affect-eu-and-uk-science

theferret.scot/brexit-impact-university-research-will-take-decade-to-recover/

www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-46748512

www.theguardian.com/education/2019/jan/04/universities-raise-alarm-over-no-deal-brexit-and-eu-student-enrolment

foreignpolicy.com/2018/12/07/the-brexit-fueled-death-of-the-british-university/

Peregrina · 14/05/2019 14:44

Indeed let's rejoice that the Oxford hospitals, teaching hospitals with a good reputation, are now struggling to get staff. Never mind that a three year nursing, midwifery or 5 or 6 year medical qualification is required - we can pull a few people off the streets to do the work and plug the gaps. Who needs experts?

Coppersulphate · 14/05/2019 14:55

According to the latest poll of polls the Brexit party are on 30%
Yay, now that is really good news.

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bellinisurge · 14/05/2019 14:57

Precisely @Isthisafreename . This current mess is all the fault of Leave MPs wanting to have their cake and eat it. This is not the fault of people fighting for an even softer Brexit or no Brexit at all - Leave MPs have just created this vacuum into which people with bigger balls have stepped.

bellinisurge · 14/05/2019 14:58

Then if we Leave with No Deal, @Coppersulphate , any hope of bringing people like me onside gets flushed down the toilet.

Sycamorish · 14/05/2019 15:07

Peregrina. We need to train more nurses here. Nicking trained people from the EU 27 was always a shit strategy and an immoral one. Meanwhile of course they are still welcome to come and always will be.

Talking of experts, nobody has commented on James Wells Head of UK Trade at the ONS standing for the Brexit Party ... or indeed John Longworth formerly Director-general of the British Chambers of Commerce. Don't they have expertise?

Coppersulphate · 14/05/2019 15:15

Bellini,
And if we do not Leave what hope is there of getting people like me on board. It works both ways.

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BackInTime · 14/05/2019 15:19

According to the latest poll of polls the Brexit party are on 30%
Yay, now that is really good news

Why, what do you hope anti EU MEPs will achieve?

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