Westminstenders: The Bill Cash Appreciation Society

[RedToothBrush]

We've had a new thread pretty much everyday for the last week or so, so I'm short on inspiration.

There haven't been too many new developments today. There have been two ministerial resignations. Both were ministers close to Boris Johnson.

We had a vote to add an extension if we still have no deal agreed at the end of next week to the Withdrawal Bill. May has said she will do this anyway; this would merely tie her hands. It passed by 5 votes. It now is fast tracked to the committee stage and third reading.

A business of the house amendment by Benn to secure a debate and Indicative Vote 3 next week failed after a speakers vote. Bercow followed convention and didn't create a majority where there was not one (though under Erskine May he is free to do the opposite at his discretion).

Corbyn has met May for talks which have been described as construction, though we have no further details though curiously Emily Thornberry put out a statement demanding a ref on whatever was decided which suggests Corbyn isn't keen on the idea. Rumours are of Schrodingers Customs Union: somehow being in a union but not a union. It can't be called a customs union. And Liam Fox has said Corbyn can't have his union. Though he may have a vested interest as he loses his job if Corbyn gets his way.

Oh and the Commons photocopier broke so no one knows what is currently supposed to be happening.

Otherwise it's been a quiet day, all things considered. Too quiet?

I expect that the use of NDAs is going to be a very hot political and legal topic in the medium term: there are a lot of concerns about their use generally, but am afraid I don't know if it's going to be something the Law Commission will be invited to look at.

i don't understand how they can apparently (with the caveat IANAL) be used to cloak criminal behaviour ?????

I thought it was a point of law that a contract for an illegal act cannot be enforced in English courts ?

Majority in all Labour seats back second referendum

Opinion has changed sharply since the Ref

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/nov/02/majority-in-all-labour-seats-back-second-referendum-study-says

Support for a second referendum is largest in Corbyn’s seat of Islington North at 80%
with the number falling back to 53% in Ashfield, the east Midlands seat held by Gloria De Piero.

www.politico.eu/article/uk-considers-no-deal-brexit-supply-trains-for-medicines/amp/?__twitter_impression=true
UK considers no-deal Brexit supply trains for medicines
Government contract sought advice on how to bring in necessary supplies in a cliff-edge scenario.

Trains for essential drugs.

What possibly could go wrong with this?!

Why do people keep saying this. members - yes most likely, but voters, certainly not.

Oh for Christ's sake. Are you people totally incapable of understanding basic logic and primary school arithmetic? And you complain that we think you're stupid? Lol. Stop saying stupid shit then.

A large majority of labour voters voted to remain (65%).

Yes, a majority of labour constituencies voted leave, but the leave voters in those constituencies were not all labour voters.

DG There would need to be sufficient evidence of criminal behvaiour to invalidate NDAs,
not just gross incompetence

Even then, we've seen how individual whistleblowers suffer and probably the equivalent would happen for firms - not getting future govt contracts etc

Mislaying 36 ministers in a year is rather careless. Yes a couple went for other reasons. Surely this is a record

1. Amber Rudd, home secretary, 29 April 2018 – Windrush scandal

1. Phillip Lee, justice minister, 12 June 2018 – opposition to government’s Brexit approach

1. Greg Hands, trade minister, 21 June 2018 – opposition to Heathrow expansion

1. David Davis, Brexit secretary, 8 July 2018 – opposition to Theresa May’s Brexit plan

1. Steve Baker, Brexit minister, 8 July 2018 – opposition to Theresa May’s Brexit plan

1. Boris Johnson, foreign secretary, 9 July 2018 – opposition to Theresa May’s Brexit plan

1. Conor Burns, parliamentary private secretary at Foreign Office, 9 July 2018 – opposition to Theresa May’s Brexit plan

1. Chris Green, parliamentary private secretary at Department for Transport, 9 July 2018 – opposition to Theresa May’s Brexit plan

1. Andrew Griffiths, business minister, 13 July 2018 – sexual misconduct allegations

10. Robert Courts, parliamentary private secretary at Foreign Office, 15 July 2018 – opposition to Theresa May’s Brexit plan

11. Scott Mann, parliamentary private secretary at Treasury, 16 July 2018 – opposition to Theresa May’s Brexit plan

12. Guto Bebb, defence minister, 16 July 2018 – voted against Government on EU customs legislation

13. Tracey Crouch, sports minister, 1 November 2018 – in protest at delay in cutting maximum stake for fixed-odds betting terminals

14. Jo Johnson, transport minister, 9 November 2018 – to support second referendum

15. Shailesh Vara, Northern Ireland minister, 15 November 2018 – to oppose Theresa May’s draft Brexit deal

16. Dominic Raab, Brexit secretary, 15 November 2018 – to oppose Theresa May’s draft Brexit deal

17. Esther McVey, work and pensions secretary,15 November 2018 – to oppose Theresa May’s draft Brexit deal

18. Suella Braverman, Brexit minister, 15 November 2018 – to oppose Theresa May’s draft Brexit deal

19. Anne-Marie Trevelyan, parliamentary private secretary at Department for Education, 15 November 2018 – to oppose Theresa May’s draft Brexit deal

20. Ranil Jayawardena, parliamentary private secretary at Ministry of Justice, 15 November 2018 – to oppose Theresa May’s draft Brexit deal

21. Rehman Chishti, government trade envoy to Pakistan, 15 November 2018 – to oppose Theresa May’s draft Brexit deal

22. Sam Gyimah, universities minister, 30 November 2018 – to oppose Theresa May’s Brexit deal

23. Will Quince, parliamentary private secretary at Ministry of Defence, 8 December 2018 – to oppose Theresa May’s Brexit deal

24. James O’Shaughnessy, government whip in House of Lords, 20 December 2018 – family reasons

25. Gareth Johnson, government whip, 14 January 2019 – to oppose Theresa May’s Brexit deal

26. Craig Tracey, parliamentary private secretary at Department for International Development, 15 January 2019 – to oppose Theresa May’s Brexit deal

27. Eddie Hughes, parliamentary private secretary at Brexit department, 15 January 2019 – to oppose Theresa May’s Brexit deal

28. Alberto Costa, parliamentary private secretary at Scotland Office, 27 February 2019 – tabled amendment to protect rights of EU citizens

29. George Eustice, agriculture minister, 28 February 2019 – in protest at government allowing vote on delaying Brexit

30. Paul Masterton, parliamentary private secretary at Home Office, 13 March 2019 – to vote to rule out no-deal Brexit under all circumstances

31. Sarah Newton, work and pensions minister, 13 March 2019 – to vote to rule out no-deal Brexit under all circumstances

32. Richard Harrington, business minister, 25 March 2019 – to vote in favour of indicative votes

33. Alistair Burt, Middle East minister, 25 March 2019 – to vote in favour of indicative votes

34. Steve Brine, health minister, 25 March 2019 – to vote in favour of indicative votes

35. Nigel Adams, Wales minister, 3 April 2019 – in protest at Theresa May’s decision to hold talks with Jeremy Corbyn

36. Chris Heaton-Harris, Brexit minister, 3 April 2019 – in protest at Theresa May’s decision to ask for a further Article 50 extension

Read more at: inews.co.uk/news/cabinet-resignations-list-ministers-resigned-last-12-months

Trains for essential drugs.

Southern Rail ?

red "What possibly could go wrong with this?!"

You probably also read "Graylings department", early in the article and needed no further answer

DG There would need to be sufficient evidence of criminal behvaiour to invalidate NDAs, not just gross incompetence

I was thinking more of NDAs that have been stapled to settlement payments on the condition the recipient does not provide evidence against . As was suggested to be the case in a recent well reported legal action concerning claims of sexual assault.

Majority in all Labour seats back second referendum

Why is this message not getting through to Corbyn? Surely coming out as the pro-Remain party would give Labour the best chance of winning a GE? Or does he care more about leaving the EU than being PM? Or is it that a pro-Remain stance is only of benefit if we have a GE before we leave the EU so he can’t risk adopting that policy if there’s to be no election pre-Brexit?

Or does he care more about leaving the EU than being PM?
Yes, is my opinion!

Why is this message not getting through to Corbyn?

Maybe ... just maybe ... it is ?

(thinks to self, how would I play it ?)

with that information at his disposal, it's possible Corbyn can see a PV as being a game-changer if played right. The right-playing being to act ambivalent, maybe dismissive even ... until the time is right.

I'm thinking the "danger" of Labour seizing on a PV as an election winner could see the Tories have a sudden epiphany and nick the policy. After all, they've got form.

But if Corbyn has to be seen to be bludgeoned into acceptance ??

I really need to get back to quantum effects in zero dimensional space - something I can make sense of, rather than this confusion

Wrt the police telling MPs to think of their tone, I think there is a sub section of MPs who have been thrust into the media limelight and are enjoying it a bit too much. I mean who would have been able to tell you Mark Francois was an MP let alone pick him out of a line up before brexit?

Some of them have gone a bit big brother and need reminding they are not there to increase their TV coverage.

Oh for Christ's sake. Are you people totally incapable of understanding basic logic and primary school arithmetic

Hang about. Who are ‘you people’ and why be so rude?

I’m a staunch remainer, trying as everyone is, to unpick the party politicking from the facts and options.

I understand the anger, im a grey too, but there is no need to be so reactionary and unkind.

Tbf it's irrelevant what % support a ref in Labour constitutencies in terms of Corbyn.

May is apparently refusing to discuss a customs union at all.

People are becoming much more personally aggressive and threatening, especially on facebook & twitter. I blame rhetoric in the media and among extreme politicians.

It doesn't matter what side of any argument you are on, there is no excuse for threats. Worrying times.

May is apparently refusing to discuss a customs union at all.

I wonder if there is any plan at all.

I know this issue had been mentioned in the last or one before that thread re NI and those who identify as Irish and their rights as EU citizens.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-47808490

Re NDA and criminal behaviour - May has conflict of interest via her husband. She stopped investigations into Banks...I feel it could be argued this is connected to the NDA to profit a select few with assets.

I hate that Francois is now a go-to ‘personality’ who rips up letters on live TV, talks bollocks about WWII, and does a good line in outraged apoplexy. It’s the same thing that happened with JRM and look where that has got us. News channels need to stop promoting these people when they don't deserve it.

Oh for Christ's sake. Are you people totally incapable of understanding basic logic and primary school arithmetic

I also want to re-make point that I was also talki g about Labour target seats ie the swing needed for them to win an election.

If their 45 target seats, 78% voted leave - I do understand thatnot everyone voting was leave though. Couple that with the 16 of the seats they currently hold bing leave and vulnerable (not won by big amounts), I still maintain that l
Labour are struggling with the politicking around BREXIT due to having more leave in their voting population /targeted voters than we Remainers like to admit.

Anyhow, I appreciate this doesn’t really matter to the current debate in this thread, but think pp was unnecessarily rude.

Sos I am responding to you in this forum as you requested.

These are your posts that really got to me that you posted in a very short time of each other a couple of days ago. I sent you the message shortly after you posted.

If TM can't get Berkow to allow vote on WA4 ( which he can't unless some drastic change) then there will be no revoke as TM has said no PV it will be no deal. It really will be no deal. No deal. No deal. No deal. No deal. Tick tock, tick tock, tick tock

I'm off to Cambridge on the 13th as dgd has a masterclass on physiology and neuroscience. I'm looking forward to it. I no longer hold any hope out for remain or a soft brexit so I shall just resign myself quietly to a not very bright future I.e no deal and a raving brexiteer PM. Hopefully my dgd has enough resilience to survive.
[ inference in last sentence is “I won’t survive “ , something you have alluded to many times before]

There are 2 cabinet meetings back to back. The first for 3 hours then an hour for lunch and then another for 2 hours. No deal. No deal. No deal. Tick tock tick tock

Barnier did say they had a little patience left and no deal can still be avoided. Hahaha haha haha haha
I'm feeling vindictive and want to blame someone for all this. Trouble is there is sooooo many

Your writing “tick tock no deal no deal” was in my view aggressive, mocking, vindictive and unnecessary. Revelling and enjoying the awfulness of all of this. You seemed to want to blame everyone posting on this board as much as anybody else.

So maybe you have given up on your life and don’t care anymore,, well good for you if that is the case but that does not give you the right to be so mocking to everyone else. I have not given up and would like to carry on living.

Maybe you too are really hurting too deep down and this “ I could not care less if I die “ is your way of coping. Well find a better way on here.

You admitted in that last post you were feeling vindictive, well in my opinion you were and directing it at anyone on here too. Who ironically generally have similar opinions to you about this situation.

Have you no idea how hurtful you sometimes appear and how your posts effect other people?

If I knew a way to block all of your posts, I would.

Most of their 2017 constituency wins went leave and a clear majority of the seats they would need to swing if they were to be elected are leave.

Not in my borough. 75% Remain, Tory marginal. MP voted against he Tory government. If Labour want it they would have to go Remain.

Labour could lose their own marginals if disgusted Remainers stay home, or vote for someone else

May is apparently refusing to discuss a customs union at all

Of course she won't, all theatre!

A CU negates leaving at all, it's a stupid idea, ask Turkey!
How it has becomes Labours answer to brexit is a mystery to me and shows the complete lack of intellect in the HoC...
e.g a brexitier MP who thinks embedding GPS into knife handles is the answer to the spate of stabbings across the country or Mark F ? as my DD said to me "Is Francois french for Fuckwit?"