Westminstenders: Waiting for Sanity

[RedToothBrush]

We could be waiting a long time, but that's what we have to wait for as that's what the EU is waiting for.

The EU has requested we expand on our plans for 'alternative arrangements' with regard to the backstop.

We need to do so before the next HoC vote on 14th Feb. The EU see no point in shifting their position before than. And the UK will struggle to provide the info the EU want before then. So there is now some doubt as to whether the vote will go ahead as planned.

About a third of the Cabinet now believe that Brexit will have to be delayed due to legislation not being ready for exit date. However we don't have power over this and we might still exit without it.

There is no Brexit related business next week in the HoC to prevent pesky amendments. The recess has been cancelled but MPs have been told its OK to go on their ski holidays so it's just a PR stunt.

Meanwhile No Deal is in full effect as businesses trigger their exit strategy in the absence of certainty. No Deal is reality for many even if we do have a last minute deal...

We are all about to get poorer. As that's what we voted for.

Yes I am Mistigri. They are good in the Lycée ut very variable elsewhere.

But not ut

English will always be the language of business and diplomacy
About 150 years it was French that was the language of business and diplomacy (also the reason why there are so many French words in English btw)
Th8ngs change. Always.
It’s nit because English is THE communication language atm that it will always be.

Agree queenie

I know a large number of 4/5/6/7/8/9 year old Dutch children who speak English so fluently, it's embarrassing that the most I can manage in their language is yes / no / thank you

many Brits feel like they can't/daren't make the leap to moving abroad, because of their lack of other languages. Hence this resentful perception of an "unfair" pincer movement in which they see foreigners freely moving here, and think that "we" can't move there.

I don’t get that. British people ARE known to be immigrating everywhere. They DID and DO emigrate very easily.
The percentage of people who have family abroad is scary. You just have to go to the post office around Christmas to realise that. You wouldnt see that in most other countries.

It’s like when people get annoyed at the number of Polish people in the uk, grumble at the number of Polish shops. But they marvel at how you have entire villages that have been taken over by Brits in France and how plumbers and bakers now all have signs in English because of that. And how great it is that they do that because it’s clearly good for (their) business.
And do not see how incompatible these two statements are.

If you counter that with Germans at the very least (I did an exchange trip in the 4th year / Year 10 as is now) they're taught to speak and read English properly from a very young age.

We had a German student stay with us last year and his English was excellent (his French was terrible though lol).

There are a lot more opportunities for young people to learn a MFL here (France) vs the UK. DD did a double diploma programme and speaks fluent Spanish.

Probably very simple because the people moaning are living in the uk the others you talk or are not

And my Dutch hairdresser speaks the best English I have ever heard anyone speak who hasn't lived in an English speaking country. Her English is amazing, almost unaccented.

French was traditionally supposed to be the language of diplomacy

That idea hung on for decades and was the reason I heard later for having to do French at school in 1970, when I wanted German instead of , not as well as, French

That idea died about 20 years ago, much to the indignation of the French

Even in conferences, 20 years ago French scientists were always very grumpy if they had to speak English and some couldn't (allegedly)
Now they assume they will speak English

DGR Remember this as drawn thread work, I think - seems to fit

Wikipedia via Google:
Drawn thread work
Description
Drawn thread work is a form of counted-thread embroidery based on removing threads from the warp and/or the weft of a piece of even-weave fabric. The remaining threads are grouped or bundled together into a variety of patterns. Wikipedia

I don’t get that. British people ARE known to be immigrating everywhere.

It would be very interesting to find out what % of the populations of various countries are living abroad. I bet there's a "league table" out there.

Brits proportionately use FOM more than the EU average:

There are over a million Brits - out of a population of 66 million - who are now living in the E27
And only 3 million from the E27 - population 450 million - in the UK

French scientists were always very grumpy if they had to speak English and some couldn't (allegedly)

All my friends of my age (50s) and younger who have been to engineering school in France have very good English and usually another language too. So it may well be a generational thing.

Elements I believe that the UK is the EU country with the most citizens living abroad.

I needed an official translation English to French, so went to see a lady to do this for me, who is Dutch.
The nearby French tutor who does lessons is German.

So impressed with everyone’s crafting. Have serious jumper-envy Prettybird and your gorgeous cross stitches Fluffy made me think of my DM. She was a great knitter, chrocheter and cross-stitcher. It’s interesting that so many of you are turning to crafting to ease Brexit stress. I’ve found I just can’t turn my settle to anything these days - that’s been my response to Brexit. I’m even finding it hard to read a book. It’s like my brain is going ‘Nope. Sorry can’t do any of that stuff. Just going to sit here and watch all the shit that’s happening’. Very bad for my mental health...

Loved Can Any Mother Help Me MissClimpson.

And only 3 million from the E27 - population 450 million - in the UK

Ah yes, but (sorry I'm still on my tangent which is taking us away from Brexit) how many from each country living in all other countries put together, IYSWIM? I'm going to have to Google to satisfy my curiosity now instead of derailing, but I might come back with the numbers if I find them.

TheElementsSong
Someone posted a table or graph about this probably 6 months ago on MN.

There’s an infographic (what a nice new word that is)
www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2016/01/15/the-countries-with-the-most-native-born-people-living-abroad-infographic/#36609f3c7924

Brexiters include a disproportionate number of people who tend to think they are always victims

• of the "mc elite", of those who read too many books, of foreigners.

Even when they've prospered. it's still not as much as they think they deserved.

Victims and authoritarians can easily segue into each other.

Authoritarians tend to be less flexible and adaptable than average - possibly why they are authoritarians:
to force order on everyone else because they can't cope unless their life runs on rigid paths.

That often goes with resentment of those who can adapt and take up new opportunities....
and soon turns in a wish to deny others the opportunities they can't or don't dare to go for themselves.

Misti I have very much noticed the generational shift in continental Europe since the late 1980s wrt using English

imo though, British attitudes and enterprise haven't kept up

Turn myself or settle! Either will do!

born Haha, thanks, I just found that very infographic from Googling, and was about to come back and post it!

Sorry. Weird post. Correcting typo in previous post but it had all moved on!