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Brexit

Westminstenders: What The Hell Happens Next?!

996 replies

RedToothBrush · 09/01/2019 14:14

John Bercow has just spent over at an hour dealing with a Points of Order, in which he has argued that he is defending the soverignty of the House of Commons and that is his duty, not to simply to be a cheerleader for the executive.

Taking back control seems to have rather upset ERG Brexiteers.

As Jess Phillips astutely pointed out:
"People only care about procedures, and protecting and conserving the procedures, when they don't like the outcome of the thing that is about to happen and never when it is going in their favour."

And given what we have seen the Executive do over the last few months in terms of trying to use procedure for its own political gain, this is quite a fair point.

There are however certain constitutional questions this is all raising. And we have a very real constitutional crisis here.

Bercow has ruled that he CAN allow an amendment (because the previous vote had prevented only a motion and a debate) put forward by Grieve to go to a vote.

This amendment would - if it is passed by the house - require May to report to the house within 3 days if the WA fails to pass next week.

This would be a significant victory, if it passed because at present the position is where May can delay reporting back to the house until it start to get to the point where politically the opposition can't influence things, and a 'meaningful vote' will in practice be more like a gun to the head by the Executive, rather than the House of Commons acting in a sovereign manner and being free to make its own decisions rather than be forced into a corner by Parliamentary Procedure and the politicking of Parliamentary Procedure to undermine the independence of the HoC.

Allowing more time for the opposition to hold the government to account, does not necessarily change anything. It just means the executive can not just run down the clock in the way it perhaps has been intending.

The HoC could of course, vote against the amendment.

The WA is to come to the HoC next week.

And we have no idea what the hell is going to happen next.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
34
Ta1kinPeace · 09/01/2019 21:06

Pretzel
The OP posted and ran. Hopefully the thread will go soon.

RTB
Luckily none of my family work for the government, but the shutdown is horrific and Trump gives less of a shit than any of our politicians

DGRossetti · 09/01/2019 21:08

they have to work regardless of whether they get paid.

And the US supposedly abolished slavery ?

QueenieIsLost · 09/01/2019 21:22

A really good explaination About what has happened today and yesterday by Ian Dunt

Parliament is now at war with government - and it's winning
www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2019/01/09/parliament-is-now-at-war-with-government-and-it-s-winning

RedToothBrush · 09/01/2019 21:24

Not in Trump's USA.

SouthPaw @ nycsouthpaw
This also needs context. More people are harmed by a federal government shutdown than federal employees. Native American communities, in particular, are immediately adversely affected. As the shutdown continues, the harms expand and multiply throughout the country’s population.

There are businesses that rely on the federal government as a customer—contractors of all sorts and sizes—and as a landlord—e.g. vendors at national parks. People who own and work for those businesses are harmed by the interruption of their income.

Scientists missing their grant funds, journalists who can’t access public records, inventors who can’t get their patents, entrepreneurs who can’t get business licenses ... This bit of context is, in all likelihood, barely scratching the surface of harms flowing from the shutdown.

Diane Yentel @ dianeyentel
The longer #shutdown2018 goes on, the more low income seniors, people with disabilities, families and others will be hard hit, & the more the housing crisis will be exacerbated. Here's what we know about impacts on tenants in subsidized housing. 1/

~1,150 contracts for existing affordable housing are under suspension - HUD doesn’t have $ to renew. This puts about 80,000 low income people - mostly seniors or people w/disabilities w/ income less than $13,000 per year, at risk of losing their homes. 2/

Another 500 contracts (w/ another 30,000-40,000 households) will expire later in January & another 550 in Feb. Without additional funding, HUD cannot renew these contracts, putting tenants at risk of losing their homes. 3/

Nearly 10,000 of the total 17,723 PBRA properties are FHA insured. This represents an estimated $13.5 billion in unpaid balance of FHA insured debt. 4/

Public housing agencies don’t have access to much needed capital repair $, leaving them without money to make critical public housing repairs or upgrades, putting public housing residents at risk. 5/

Even if PHAs have prior-year capital funds available or have sufficient operating reserves, HUD can’t provide the manual approval needed for some public housing repairs to move forward when the government is shut down. 6/

PHAs have $ for Jan & Feb payments for S8 vouchers. If shutdown continues beyond then, PHAs won’t make timely payments to landlords. At that point either landlords will have to absorb losses, or tenants will have to try to pay the rent hike or be evicted. 7/

In the meantime, given shutdown uncertainty, PHAs are less able to approve families on voucher waiting lists. Instead, PHAs will hold any available vouchers until Congress reaches a final spending agreement and they can be sure they can honor payments. 8/

In rural America, the USDA direct loan programs will not issue any additional funds. Banks are unlikely to close on loans until the government shutdown ends, delaying homeownership at best and possibly forcing sellers to look elsewhere. 9/

The shutdown can also cause construction delays and increase fees/interest paid for developers participating in USDA programs due to lack of inspectors and mortgage funds, further delaying or disincenting much needed affordable homes. 10/

It is not yet clear whether USDA can continue paying rental assistance or vouchers for low- and very low-income tenants. 11/

Bottom line: HUD and USDA programs house some of our country’s poorest & most vulnerable seniors, people with disabilities and families with children. It’s incredibly reckless to risk their homes as perceived leverage for a border wall. 12/12

This is No Deal US style. Coming soon to a place near you too.

OP posts:
MangoSplit · 09/01/2019 21:25

Place marking

Icantreachthepretzels · 09/01/2019 21:26

The OP posted and ran. Hopefully the thread will go soon.

As I suspected. I'm always suspicious of someone with a 2 digit number after their name - especially if it's a real name. I'm sure there might be the occasional Gemma72 who isn't a troll but... generally speaking...

Glad to see most people there disagreeing. But there are some scary posters on there!
I wonder if MNHQ will pull the thread. It isn't actually breaking any rules - unless the OP is a PBP.

QueenieIsLost · 09/01/2019 21:27

when they ticked the leave box, they were voting for things that were not on the ballot paper.
That’s the case for most referendum which is the reason why they are a very bad way of actually directing the country. In most cases, people are voting not for what is on the paper but but against the government, to express their discontent etc etc
(But apparently it doesnt matter and the result still stands according to some Leavers I know)
Which is also why brexit is such a bad idea. This is not what people have been voting for (or against).
But not getting Brexit will now equate to proving to people that when voicing their discontent, they will ignored (with all the dangers coming wíth it)

TatianaLarina · 09/01/2019 21:30

thecatfromjapan To go back a couple of pages I totally agree with your analysis of the consequences of the WA.

I also think that the events of this week show the strength of feeling against No Deal. I don’t think there’s any reason to panic atm, there’s a range of options after the vote.

prettybird · 09/01/2019 21:30

Our two boys (2 years old) are brilliant mousers and birders. We think they hunt in pairs which makes them more effective.

We've had at least 2 mice already this year Hmm They've brought live pigeons and magpies into the house and numerous small birds and fledglings sssshhhh, don't tell our downstairs neighbour who feeds the small birds Shock We might not try to rescue the woodies if/when a No Deal Brexit leads to food shortages Wink

Ta1kinPeace · 09/01/2019 21:34

Brexiters want the UK Parliament to take back control
until it does Grin

bellinisurge · 09/01/2019 21:36

I see you

Westminstenders: What The Hell Happens Next?!
QueenieIsLost · 09/01/2019 21:48

The far right within the EU and how they are determined to destroy the EU from within.

Make no mistakes. The ERG and the likes wouod have no issue doing exactly the same if the U.K. was to stay in the EU.
www.politico.eu/article/populist-attitude-to-eu-matteo-salvini-far-right/?fbclid=IwAR0PaT87mYLzhH1wKXlx4MyvR2Onf4_5PZG6aFQvHMahDbyV2wIY-j781i4

prettybird · 09/01/2019 21:51

DGR - re the federal employees being forced to work without pay during the Trump Shutdown : I made the same point to dh.

I thought slavery had been abolished SadAngryConfused

nicoala1 · 09/01/2019 21:57

I love this topic and thread. I contribute rarely, but the information is invaluable and so up to date too. Better than any media outlet really. Thank you to all contributers.

But I hope it will not be derailed into a cat lovers convention either. Not everyone is cat mad. Just saying. Hope you don't mind.

Ta1kinPeace · 09/01/2019 22:00

nicoala1
The carpet shark pictures are to reduce our communal blood pressure.
Happy to swap for the aura of the linens department of John Lewis Smile

2beesornot2beesthatisthehoney · 09/01/2019 22:02

My beauty.

Westminstenders: What The Hell Happens Next?!
2beesornot2beesthatisthehoney · 09/01/2019 22:03

Sorry nicoala1

TatianaLarina · 09/01/2019 22:05

£75m Brexit contracts facing investigation

Govt has quietly awarded £75m of Brexit contracts to some of the world's biggest consultancies, without publicly announcing the deals or revealing what they’re being paid to do.

1tisILeClerc · 09/01/2019 22:06

nicoala1
Hi
The cats are just a diversion when real news is running slow.
Pictures and a bit of 'randomness' keep the mind alert, it would be boring if it were ALL Brexit.

Butterymuffin · 09/01/2019 22:08

@LouiseCollins28 I wanted to ask:

if Labour fail to support the delivery of the Brexit they committed to in 2017, they will lose my support, that is a certainty

Who in this situation will you vote for instead?

Ta1kinPeace · 09/01/2019 22:09

2bees
Gorgeous. Maine Coon ?

And yes, the cats are light relief ....
then again

A few years ago the Saudi government brought in web censorship software.
For months nobody noticed ~ then one day a popular cat site got blocked ~ and there was uproar ~ and the censorship had to be rolled back

so cat pictures prve we are safe Grin

1tisILeClerc · 09/01/2019 22:11

{Happy to swap for the aura of the linens department of John Lewis}
That's beginning to head towards the 'pervy' side surely?
Tatiana.
I put that up earlier on, no comments from other s so far.
Which minister can make a panic out of some immigrants escaping from a lorry on M6, Is that Javid again?
There will be serious anger about it now as some MEN have missed the footie!

2beesornot2beesthatisthehoney · 09/01/2019 22:15

Ta1kinPeace well spotted!

nicoala1 · 09/01/2019 22:18

OK I get it now. Cats are a diversion when things go quiet.

What about the poooooor little turtles, hamsters, doggies, birdies, and so on though, they must feel so left out!

Love the thread. Thank you all.

LouiseCollins28 · 09/01/2019 22:21

@Butterymuffin, thanks for that, actually a very good question and one I can’t really give an answer to I’m afraid because I really don’t know. I have supported 3 different parties once or more in the several Westminster elections I have voted in. Currently. I wouldn’t feel confident in voting for any of those 3. I will certainly vote, I never wouldn’t, but for whom, I really don’t know.