Westminstenders: Throwing Boomerangs

[RedToothBrush]

British politics and media in a nutshell.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boomerang_effect_(psychology)#Political_beliefs

No EU progress, no discussion. Just this. Keep everyone in line by bouncing boomerangs.

Disaster capitalism looms, they just have to get us to the edge of the cliff before the centre reforms. That's it.

If the legal roads to stop Brexit are closed as David Allen Green says, then how do you force the political flood gates to open, especially with both the far left and the far right using micro-aggression against the public to keep the centre ground weak?

Answers on a ballot paper on 3rd May.

Re the Windrush generation: my dad was pondering last night whether he would get challenged to prove his right to be here, given that we arrived in 1964 using the 4 year "grace period" that had been awarded to South African citizens to be continued to be treated as Commonwealth citizens (after being kicked out of the Commonwealth because of the apartheid regime) (I learnt something new last night: I thought we'd come in on my mum's British passport - but she only applied for that later).

I pointed out that we were ok as he'd made sure to get us all British passports, naturalising as soon as we could. But what would've happened if we hadn't wanted/needed passports so that we could go on holidays abroad?

My dad is a highly organised person who a) is still alive and b) has kept all his old passports and paperwork in a neat pile. What happens to those whose parents, once they arrived here, never travelled, have died, or with whom they lost contact..... Or there was a fire or flood and everything was lost? (Who still has their parents papers, let alone their own, from 50+ years ago? unless they're my dad )

And as has been pointed out, many of the Windrush generation were British at the time they arrived and for many years after. It was the UK which changed the goalposts

I listened to the immigration minister on Sky News saying that "those affected should reach out to their local communities for help" - I may gave shouted a few sweary words at the TV at this point and that the biometric card that they would eventually be issued would solve all their problems Adam Boulton rightly challenged her on this - as why should they, as legitimate British citizens, have to have a biometric card to prove this? ....but didn't go further to point out that this is either ID cards through the back door (in which case at least be open about it) or blatantly racist, as who is going to be asked to "prove" their Britishness and therefore their right to be here?

It doesn't bode well for EU citizens post-Brexit

This is the inevitable consequence of making landlords and employers the front line of the "hostile environment for immigrants" that Theresa May wants

Hopefully a small step in the right direction - PM to meet Commonwealth leaders to discuss Windrush generation.

True Driven

Also - how do you prove a negative It may not be easy to "prove" you'd not been abroad for 2 years if the Jobsworth you are dealing with doesn't want to believe you. If you weren't working (eg a SAHP), just having a bank account with a UK address wouldn't necessarily be enough. Always assuming you have a bank account (there's me making a middle class assumption ). Or if you were employed by an overseas company for a period?

What about the homeless? What proof would they have? It's unfortunately so easy to think of examples of where there could/would be difficulties

I know people who've asked to see the records kept of their exits/entries from/to the UK. The records were not all complete, for example more exits than entries or vice versa - so there might be a an exit not accompanied by the entry a few weeks later after the holiday. A Jobsworth could claim that that "proved" you were out of the country for longer than you were allowed

The Grenfall house price crash does not surprise me in the slightest. I think I speculated that privately owned buildings would have a particular problem with residents stuffed with huge bills. And whilst council properties still haven't been sorted, there is some sort of pressure politically to do that eventually. Private owners are left on their own as they don't get the same sort of sympathy and they exist in isolation across the country without anything to connect them to people in similar situations because communities don't exist in the same way.

Re: cladding. I know someone who deals with it on the private side. After a few months they stopped accepting cladding samples for testing because every type failed (it's not an inherent cladding fault but the method of testing them and passing as safe was faulty, newer testing methods are now failing previously assumed safe types). They're telling clients now to assume it's all unsafe.

So, like red, that news doesn't surprise me at all.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/16/theresa-may-caribbean-representatives-windrush-immigration?CMP=share_btn_tw
Some Windrush immigrants wrongly deported, UK admits
Immigration minister concedes errors as PM appears likely to make U-turn on issue

After 140 MPs signed a letter expressing concern.

amelia gentleman @ameliagentleman
THIS A BIT ODD SINCE I PHONED THEM ABOUT IT ON SAT NIGHT #WINDRUSH “Downing St said May had only become aware of the request on Monday morning and confirmed that she would be holding a meeting “at the earliest possible opportunity” with Caribbean leaders.”

I bet they make people fight for compensation too.

Or will they just pass a law removing the right to compensation ?

All of this is happening while the UK is signed up to the ECHR. Imagine how bad things could be if we weren't (Actually don't bother. You can't).

It seems to me like the Daily Vile pulls the puppet strings.

No 10 initially rejects a formal diplomatic request from the 12 Commonwealth heads to discuss Windrush.

Then... after the Mail speaks and a petition also appears to rapidly gain momentum, then today May appears to be taking the problem more seriously.

It is outrageous and Trumpesque to treat any people in this way. Especially those who are elderly and have faithfully contributed to society for decades.

DriventoDespair

My DW has spent the past year going through the naturalisation process. The amount of documentation we've had to provide has been crazy and to my mind illogical. A certificate from HMRC showing her NI contributions for the past 40 years was dismissed as unsuitable evidence that she's been resident here. So were our joint bank statements, although we only have joint accounts.

She's just passed the Life in the UK test. The people at the test centre were incredibly rude and intimidating. When she spoke to another candidate in the waiting room, one of the staff charged in and screamed at her to be quiet - no talking allowed. Afterwards, the chap next to her said it felt like being in a prison camp being shouted at by the guards. The test itself is daft enough and not easy (judging by the number of failures), without such added pressure from the wardens, sorry staff.

Last week, she called our local medical centre asking for a letter confirming how long she'd been registered there (since 1985). The receptionist insisted she set up a telephone appointment with a doctor to discuss it. Why waste the doctor's valuable time which could be used for someone actually ill, asked my DW, surely it's all on her records and just needs printing out. Apparently you need to speak to the doctor to see if he/she is willing to sign the letter! No doubt the 25 quid bung helped to sway his/her mind.

Almost at the final hurdle now, but it's felt like a long haul, handing out money at every turn. And why does no-one ever smile or act half-way human? The only friendly face she's mentioned was at the oral English Proficiency test and that belonged to the young Dutch guy who was administering the tests.

One also has to bear in mind that the Home Office has outsourced all these tests to Learn Direct Ltd., who will naturally be eager to make a profit. One lady at the Life in the UK test had made a mistake on the application form (2 digits transposed in her passport no.) and was sent away and told to reapply. That'll be another £50, then.

It really seems as though the general approach is to make it as difficult, unpleasant and expensive as possible. You could almost say hostile

*Hansenstein
*
I have never met you or your DW. However I hope I speak for all regular posters to say thank you so much to your DW for bothering and for putting up with the rudeness and absurdities.

Each person like your DW cancels out one horrid small minded person, so that's a ( small) positive.

With regard to the mail's influence, why would they do that now, if its all about power over the direction of policy?

This has been rumbling for what 4 or 5 years by the sound of it. Why now? When precisely when immigration as an issue is right there on the table with May apparently stuck in a deadlock over which direction to go with EU migration and the inclusion of students in immigration figures and the whole thing of Brexit taking back control of immigration.

Why would the Mail, suddenly go against years of vilifying immigrants?

Some food for thought:

Lisa Mutteridge @ lisamutteridge3
There is only so long you can strip institutions of their primary output and gear them towards winning tabloid hate points. DWP and Home Office share striking patterns of institutional failure right now. Way beyond malice.
I know everyone wants a scalp but system failure caused by erosion and distortion of a system over a long period is way worse than malicious policy. Seems to me that is where we are. #WindrushGeneration

Notjarvis @ notjarvis
Seems to me, there is almost always a Lag between Policy and major effects in Government policy.

We are now seeing the effects of Government's decisions in the Coalition parliament, which is why the NHS is suffering along with Social Care etc.

And the later:

Lisa Mutteridge @ lisamutteridge3
Syria coverage is weird. Its just people taking up entrenched positions held in 1997 in the hope if they talk loud enough this situation wont be mind bogglingly complex with nothing but terrible as far as the eye can see in every direction.
I increasingly feel like Westminster debate is displacement activity. Really I do. Maybe I am becoming detached from it or something but it just looks like endless displacement activity before we acknowledge how serious the shit they have created is.
We are heading into the middle of something really really big. Not just Syria.

Add in Brexit. Add in stuff relating to women's rights. Add in closing down of free speech.

Still can't see it?

We seem to be at least twelve months ahead of the curve on Westminstenders between stuff being firmly on the radar and it then appearing to grab the headlines on Brexit stuff. I don't think that these threads are reflecting whats happening in reality without delay by any means. Loads of issues, people caught up in, have been seeing way before they start to cause ripples.

Local government clearly has major issues. I was looking at the 2013 local councillor survey today (there's not been one for 5 years and since 1997 they had previously been every 2-3 years). Women made up only a third, under 45s only made up 12.5% and there had been a marked decline in participation of people in full time work which I can only imagine has continued. Whilst those in retirement were over represented and were increasingly represented. Its a marked difference from national politics where we are told how representation is improving. With so much of significant decision making happening at local level this is important. We talk of the Westminster bubble, but there is a distinct Boomer bubble at local level.

Northamptonshire council has gone bust. More will follow.

The effects of poor representation and consultation over policy making and the effect of out sourcing really are the foundation of so many of these problems. A total blindness to reality.

Esther McVey has just today done this:

Andy Philip @ andydphilip
Rarely can you hear the sound of jaws dropping - but Esther McVey just said rape survivors might welcome the 'opportunity to talk' about their ordeal to a stranger to access benefits.

- "it's potentially double support"

And there's just Rees Mogg's entire existence. (Speaking of which if you haven't read the replies he got to his last tweet where he posted a newspaper article about Enoch Powell's Rivers of Blood Speech and his father's condemnation of it, you have to see it to believe it. Its a bunch of people moaning that Mogg isn't the 'true Englishman' or 'proper conservative' they thought he was and no one is, and how he and his father are wrong and Powell was right. He's not far right enough for any of them).

Its staggering when reality means politicians, and their total blindness to it all.

If Brexit and total system failure hit at the same time, which in all honesty is how its shaping up, then we are in big trouble. Its debateable at this point, whether even if Brexit was stopped, how you can stop the disaster capitalists winning, such is the direction we are headed.

With regard to the mail's influence, why would they do that now, if its all about power over the direction of policy?

First thoughts. Well either:

1. It's a direction from our high in the govt - unlikely. Or

1. Trends show that there's no profit, sales from playing the xenophobic card any more. Or

1. Something more sinister I can't quite think through yet.

I do think the Prime Minster uses the DM to get a feel for the electorate though. I can see her dropping her broadsheet education to a few minutes light relief slumming it with the Fail.

• on high (not 'our' high)

The Beeb has had some slight signs of changes of tack too.Odd.

Not a coincidence, but can't quite figure it all out.

2. Yes. What age is the readership of the Mail?

3. One suggestion: what's May's Achilles Heel? May is obsessed about getting immigration down and her legacy with the Home Office. She place Rudd their to continue her work and has frequently directly intervened with the department since becoming PM. Plus there is the car crash of the students v the Home Office court cases which May was responsible for as Home Secretary.

If you wanted to throw a few boomerangs to put pressure on May's leadership, what would you go for? What's not been done before by the right wing press? (has to be the right wing as its about turning her own against her not wider public support).

There is the ongoing child abuse inquiry too, but that ongoing so has legal issues, plus you can throw a lot of that blame around at local level (Rochdale and Rotherham and several of the other well known scandals tend to be more associated in the pressure with Labour councils).

Otherwise, what else do you try to rattle May with? You are trying to rattle the support of more liberal conservatives here too.

And weirdly this is two weeks out from the local elections.

Just trying to rationalise motivation and timing here.

Its jarringly not in line with 'Daily Mail thinking' and the Daily Mail comments section.

Hasenstein to your DW for battling through the system.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/apr/15/brexit-mps-from-four-parties-jointly-launch-push-for-peoples-vote

"A major push for a “people’s vote” on the final Brexit deal between Britain and the EU has been launched by MPs, celebrities and business leaders. A cross-party lineup of MPs took to the stage at the Electric Ballroom in Camden, north London, on Sunday. They have been at pains to avoid the term “second referendum”.

The MPs included Conservative Anna Soubry, Labour’s Chuka Umunna, the Greens’ Caroline Lucas and Liberal Democrat Layla Moran."

The sun is shining and I am ever hopeful that something will halt the nonsense of Brexit.

3. An alternative explanation: how do you end a 'Brexit mandate' on restrictions to immigration when you know that free movement isn't going to be possible to end because of health care service provision, food in the fields and EU red lines?

Enrage people enough to get a significant incident which proves the HO will never be able to process the 3 million and public opinion on immigration isn't the same as it was in 2016.

RTB- that's it!

Enrage people enough to get a significant incident which proves the HO will never be able to process the 3 million and public opinion on immigration isn't the same as it was in 2016.

That's what it is! But it doesn't quite fit with May's personal anti immigrant stance. Also is it the Fail being led by their readership? Or is the govt directing the content of the Fail ?

Also the slight signs of a welcome change of direction is all very well, but it only takes a batch of refugee arrivals or heaven forbid a terrorist attack for the wind to change again.

One aspect always was that it was home grown terrorists that many were voting to keep out anyway.

Whatever's going on with Windrush, and the Fail. There are tiny signs of a change of direction- so especially in the run up to the locals people must keep on! More signing petitions, writing to PMs, posting on News websites, demonstrating etc etc. Just 10 minutes a day!

Danny Shaw @ dannyshawbbc
Amber Rudd says she will find out from the High Commissioners at the Commonwealth Heads of Government summit if anyone has been wrongly deported from UK but says the way some people have been treated is "wrong and appalling".

I refer you to this tweet earlier today:
Colin Yeo @ColinYeo1
Long term resident in the UK since childhood wrongly deported to Jamaica? The Home Office has some useful advice for you in their “Coming Home To Jamaica” guide to being deported.

www.gov.uk/government/publications/coming-home-to-jamaica-guide
Which dates to 2013/5

Also Rudd is doing a certain amount of distancing herself from the toxicity of the department here. Essential for her political survival in her constituency and essential if she ever has ambition to be PM as she's a liberal conservative option.

In many respects Rudd has few options personally here in the long run. And thus little to lose too.

Just heard a clip of David Lammy addressing Amber Rudd in the house of commons. I had a tear in my eye. He said if you lie down with dogs you get fleas, referring to the pandering of the government to the right wing.

My ex is south African and has IRL. The home office messed up his visa process badly. We actually ended up going to Croydon twice to try and sort things in person. There was a guy in front of us in the queue. The official was demanding a piece of paperwork. The paperwork had already been given to the home office but they had lost it. Apparently this was the guys problem not theirs. When the guy asked for a manager and refused to go away until he had spoken to someone they pulled the curtain across the booth window and ignored him. So I don't have much faith in the home office.

Jonn Elledge
‏*@JonnElledge*

Apparently we can't get rid of the Prime Minister because - and I am not making this up - she has a cat.

Just listening on the news to Amber Rudd blaming the Home Office for sometimes focussing too much on "policy and strategy" rather than the individual

That seemed to be an acceptable apology*
*
What I heard was Amber Rudd admitting that this had been deliberate Home Office policy