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Brexit

Westminstenders: Break Up or Make Up?

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 28/02/2018 07:53

The next week or so appears to be yet another crunch point (not that any of these crunch points have actually resolved anything so far).

The EU is set to outline the plan for Ireland. Which everyone thought had already been outlined and agreed already. And it had been admitted was legally binding.

Except apparently we don't want to do that, and we are now crying about how the EU want to break up Britain (nothing to do with England wanting to leave the EU and Scotland and NI wanting to stay in it of course).

Jeremy Corbyn has now apparently decided that the customs union is a good idea. David Davis and Liam Fox have responded by saying that this would stop us making our own trade deals. Yes this has obviously stopped Turkey, and why aren't we doing as much trade with China etc as Germany anyway? A vote in the HoC looms before Easter. Will Tory rebels support.

Will Jeremy Corbyn bow to pressure over the single market too? The customs union alone does not stop the border issue in Ireland. Nor does it stop ridiculous queues at Dover. I'm not sure Corbyn is one for listening though. He's got a whiff of power and democracy and reality is just a hindrance to utopia.

As for the Great Repeal Bill. Word has it, its not going too clever in the HoL. The conservatives had something of a show of strength with an unusual number turning up for the debate. But few on the backbenches were willing to speak in favour of...

It all feels like we are making no progress at all. We are still bleating on about cherry picked deals as if this is a negotiation. Its not.

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OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 06/03/2018 14:12

Jack Maidment
‏*@jrmaidment*
David Davis, the Brexit Secretary, tells the European Scrutiny Committee that there are 11 areas of difference with the EU on the withdrawal legal text.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 06/03/2018 14:14

IF anyone can stomach watching Davis

www.parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/8b521a82-f4c5-434e-af04-106243f7d7ac

prettybird · 06/03/2018 14:42

....can't stomach watching it Wink

Does he give any clue indication in it as to when the UK Government will deliver its alternate proposed legal text? Confused

I look forward to reading in a full legal text how the UK Government proposes creating Schrödinger's a "no border" border using "innovative technology" still to be developed Wink

Cailleach1 · 06/03/2018 14:52

Ah jeez, Pain. I'll have to wait till later in the day for his sneering, smirking performance. Mind you the mutual bonhomie (not) in the room when Joanna Cherry fixes her eyes on him is always good entertainment.

That article about the US/ UK open skies future is worrying. Willie Walsh gave a very disingenuous performance to the Leaving the EU Committee. But talking the country up is a thing. At the expense of frankness.

Austin Martin were looking for something which I don't think is in the pipeline. Also before the Committee, and it was crucial for their future. I'll root around later to find what it was.

'In its opening stance the US side rolled back valuable elements of the US-EU agreement, the most liberal open skies deal ever agreed by Washington.'

Brexiteers have been going how the EU were terrible negotiators. That pooling and building up of the creme de la creme. Yeah Liam, your department would show them how it's done. Especially with you in the room.

I remember one Christmas, my parents each thought the other one had ordered the Turkey. We did get a Turkey, but were lucky. It looks like the UK will have to get lucky.

Cailleach1 · 06/03/2018 14:55

I'm not having a go at British negotiators. What I mean is they will be constrained by the huge liabilities and red lines of their gov't. And they don't have the years and years of recent experience.

mrsreynolds · 06/03/2018 14:57

Nope sorry can't do it 🤢
If anyone can precis it for me is be very grateful!
Ive made an appt with my MP to discuss self id.
I'm beyond pissed off with all the self ID bullshit and erosion of women's rights
I don't suppose it's going to go very well 😩
He's one of JRMs cronies

Cailleach1 · 06/03/2018 14:57

Funny you should say that, pretty. Everyone else is waiting on it too.

"What we want is not so much principles and aspirations and red lines," Mr Varadkar said.

"What we want is detail, written down in black and white that can be codified into law and that is what is required."

www.rte.ie/news/brexit/2018/0305/945119-brexit/

woman11017 · 06/03/2018 15:01

I can't remember a British shadow home secretary having to send a message of solidarity to British women citizens locked up in Britain and 2 weeks into a hunger strike to protest their conditions.

Or a HO which is deporting those on hunger strike before their cases have been heard.

@AyoCaesar
Yesterday, Diane Abbott recorded a message of solidarity for the #hungerforfreedom protestors at Yarl’s Wood. Share it widely, so the detainees know just how much support they have on the outside ✊🏾✊🏾✊🏾 @detainedvoices

This is now a rogue government.

There is no law.

I like this tweet today:

Never, EVER, open the door to the jackboot. Not even a crack

Once that foot is inside, it is a hell of a fight to force it back out. Because they don't obey the rules

They'll just use your own rules against you, then throw them away

Cailleach1 · 06/03/2018 15:15

There was an article by Nesrine Malik in the Guardian yesterday. She said how her becoming a citizen had been 'marred by and extractive, dishonest and punitive system.' How the system had become one of degradation. May brought some of that.

I think this mo of degradation has been brought into the Welfare state too. You'd think the disabled or sick would at least have been spared vilification. I really don't like what IDS brought to this area.

Cailleach1 · 06/03/2018 15:17

The Cons have sunk so low. They make everything feel dirty.

woman11017 · 06/03/2018 15:34

They make everything feel dirty.That's true Caileach1 .

TheElementsSong · 06/03/2018 16:15

The Cons have sunk so low. They make everything feel dirty.

Hear, hear!

TheElementsSong · 06/03/2018 16:24

A useful flowchart.

Westminstenders: Break Up or Make Up?
OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 06/03/2018 16:39

Boris Johnson warned that his violent Brexit rhetoric risks undermining EU talks and ruining Britain's reputation

Personally I think the headline is a bit verbose and could be altered to

Boris Johnson warned that his violent Brexit rhetoric risks undermining EU talks and he’s ruining Britain's reputation

<a class="break-all" href="http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-brexit-war-words-uk-image-british-meps-brexiteers-a8242541.html?amp#click=t.co/LX1VD4pCSU" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-brexit-war-words-uk-image-british-meps-brexiteers-a8242541.html?amp#click=t.co/LX1VD4pCSU

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 06/03/2018 16:52

Or even just

Boris Johnson is ruining Britain’s reputation

AgnesSkinner · 06/03/2018 17:41

Or just:

Boris Johnson is ruining Britain

DGRossetti · 06/03/2018 17:44

Boris Johnson is ruining Britain

Britain is bigger than Boris Johnson, thankfully.

MichaelBendfaster · 06/03/2018 17:49

Britain is bigger than Boris Johnson, thankfully.

I'm not sure about that, actually. Or, rather, I'm not sure Theresa May believes that (if you add in also JRM and the rest of the swivel-eyed righters), judging by the way she's constantly running scared of them.

DGRossetti · 06/03/2018 17:53

Anyone see the BrexitBriefing posted on "the other place" ?

briefingsforbrexit.com/eus-demands-northern-ireland-violate-peoples-human-rights/

TalkinPeace · 06/03/2018 17:57

On my LInkedin today was an ad by the UK Govt encouraging people to start exporting
my comment was HOW !

DGRossetti · 06/03/2018 17:59

On my LinkedIn today was an ad by the UK Govt encouraging people to start exporting

Suddenly I feel an awful lot better for using an adblocker ....

mrsreynolds · 06/03/2018 18:41

Export?

Um...

How??

Peregrina · 06/03/2018 19:17

Yep saw the BrexitBriefing in the 'other place' where I refuse to post, (although I did once by accident). In fact, it's a valid question, that the NI - Irish identifying citizens do need to be represented. I believe the Republic is already aware of this problem. A solution might be like Gibralter where they are represented by MEPs from the South West of England. As for the DUP bleating - the GFA, which they don't agree with, already makes NI different from the rest of the UK; and like it though they don't, it still is an international treaty. I don't pity May, but if she'd not squandered her majority she could have happily thrown the whole of NI under a bus, and washed her hands of them.

BigChocFrenzy · 06/03/2018 19:31

MAJOR implications for any Irish passport holder married to an non-EU citizen

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/feb/12/derry-woman-us-born-husband-uk-emma-de-souza

A Derry woman at the centre of the case has spoken of her joy after a Belfast court rejected the Home Office’s bid to appeal against a recent ruling that her American husband should be allowed to live in the UK,
without going through immigration procedures because she carried an Irish passport.

The Home Office initially rejected his application on the grounds that his wife was British, even though she never carried a British passport

They said as she was born in Northern Ireland, under the British Nationality Act 1981 she was automatically deemed British Hmm
and would have to apply through the normal routes for third country citizens.

The Home Office told Mr De Souza the only way they could deal with his case was for his wife to “renounce her status as a British citizen” Angry

De Souza challenged that decision on the grounds that
his wife had the right to be treated as an Irish citizen under the Good Friday agreement
and was therefore an EU citizen exercising her freedom of movement rights.

The first-tier tribunal ruled in his favour
< The court refused the Home Office appeal, but HO considering whether to appeal to a higher court >

RedToothBrush · 06/03/2018 19:31

Ooo I've got a Brexit Diagram too!

Paul Bernal @PaulbernalUK
The ‘smart’ solution to the Irish border: a Venn Diagram. #Brexit

Westminstenders: Break Up or Make Up?
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