Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Brexit

Westministenders: Rebel Rebel Your Brexit is a Mess.

971 replies

RedToothBrush · 13/12/2017 19:46

Hot Tramp, I love you so!

The European Parliament have agreed to progress talks to the next stage. Despite Brexiteers saying its not legally binding, it is apparent that the EU certainly disagree.

Not only that, but the wording of the deal goes further. It binds us to not being able to agree and new trade deals for 2 years.

The All Important Amendment 7 to the Great Repel Bill has been successful. May’s power grab has a set back.

By just FOUR votes the government was defeated. How May will be regretting that pointless election tonight.

Parliament will have a meaningful vote on the exit terms.

But don’t be too excited. Brussels might not like this as May can not guarantee the UK will agree to a deal. It means the the EU are negotiating with parliament NOT May now.

There is also the suggestion that the mood of parliament is changing and is beginning to lean more towards a EFTA / EEA type deal.

But equally this could also send us to the brink with a deal from the EU that could be rejected by parliament.

The stakes just got higher.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
41
RedToothBrush · 18/12/2017 19:49

But Facebook could be in for a particular grilling

thebackbencher.co.uk/facebook-refuses-to-remove-kick-a-tory-day-event/
FACEBOOK REFUSES TO REMOVE ‘KICK A TORY DAY’ EVENT

James Bickerton‏ @JBickertonUK
So Facebook is refusing to remove a 'Kick a Tory Day' event - by me for @Backbencher

OP posts:
Butterymuffin · 18/12/2017 20:24

Shocking that it's taken this long and been left to Bercow to defend MPs' right to vote according to conscience without death threats.

mathanxiety · 18/12/2017 21:05

All the sanctimonious crap about the Referendum, and how the voice of the people must be honoured.

We all know the Referendum was called to settle a fight in the Tory party, and for no other reason.

mathanxiety · 18/12/2017 21:08

And the cabinet meeting on what the UK wants in a future relationship with the EU was apparently fruitless, so the Referendum was a total and complete waste of time.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 18/12/2017 21:37

Go bercow!

Westministenders: Rebel Rebel Your Brexit is a Mess.
Mistigri · 18/12/2017 21:50

LH I'm genuinely trying to think of any large/influential company that has worse software/ technology (I'm not talking about 30 years ago; I learned to use business software on an Apricot PC, which may give you a clue as to my age).

It's good news that parliament has finally woken up to abuse of MPs, particularly of women MPs. But it's funny how we only wake up to this when the people being abuse are white conservative women. I recently read that a large proportion of the abuse directed towards women MPs on twitter was directed at a single women - Diane Abbott. You don't have to be a fan of DA (I'm not) to find this depressing.

DentalDilemma · 19/12/2017 00:06

Some home truths from Michel Barnier for the thickos government who still think there'll be lots of cake made from specially picked cherries:

  • No Single Market = no passporting, there'll be no such thing as Canada +
  • No unilateral withdrawal of A50 (although of course that's just his opinion and for the ECJ to decide)
  • Follow all EU rules during transition
  • Brexit bill could well be > €45bn

www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/dec/18/uk-cannot-have-a-special-deal-for-the-city-says-eu-brexit-negotiator-barnier

Frankiestein401 · 19/12/2017 01:35

@mistigri - the Mumsnet forum software is not significantly better or worse than other non-commercial software out there.

it matters because a background of carping (as opposed to constructive suggestion) is all that is necessary to prepare the ground for takeover and "improvement" - whether Mumsnet or the BBC - if they weren't there in the format they are then we all lose.

the Westminstenders and trump threads on here at the moment are far more valuable than any of the commercial information feeds out there.

mathanxiety · 19/12/2017 02:22

www.irishnews.com/news/2017/11/24/loyalist-demand-the-removal-of-co-derry-christmas-tree-1195775/?ref=sh

Every now and then, you catch a glimpse of the true nature of the DUP.
They are happy to destroy literally anything for the sake of upholding the sacredness of their symbols and shoving those symbols down the necks of everyone else. You cannot separate those two objectives. They are equally important to them.

BiglyBadgers · 19/12/2017 07:59

Personally I like the mobile version of MN and find it works well on my android tablet. I don't see the need for the app and don't really know why people use it. The mobile site provides a good, clean responsive design with no bell and whistles. Just the way I like it. I rarely use the desktop site.

In over ten years working in web design I can assure you there are lots of far worse websites and pieces of software out there.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 19/12/2017 08:22

Jo Maugham QC
@JolyonMaugham
From a speech by Goebbels to the Press on the Establishment of a Reich Ministry for Popular Enlightenment and Propaganda (March 15, 1933), via @JMPSimor.

Westministenders: Rebel Rebel Your Brexit is a Mess.
Eeeeeowwwfftz · 19/12/2017 09:10

I don’t think this site comes anywhere close to the 'worst' in any meaningful sense. My energy supplier's is much worse.

Maryz · 19/12/2017 09:31

I know the Irish Times has a paywall, but I think you can see the first article every day for free, so this might be interesting for some of you.

The difference in press reporting on either side of the Irish Sea is marked.

mathanxiety, that article you linked sums up the DUP. They just want what they want, and don't care who they upset along the way. They represent fewer than 30% of NI voters, and yet are holding disproportionate power in both NI and the rest of the UK Hmm

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 19/12/2017 09:35

Whoops. Misrepresenting the situation? Surely Hannan wouldn't do something like that?

Brexit thinktank removes 'institute' from its name

www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/dec/18/brexit-thinktank-scrambles-to-remove-institute-from-its-name

A thinktank set up by Daniel Hannan, a pro-Brexit Conservative MEP, has changed its name and website after it faced a possible fine for describing itself as an “institute” without permission.

The Institute for Free Trade (IFT) was launched by Hannan in September. In a controversial decision, Boris Johnson, the foreign secretary, allowed the launch event to take place at a Foreign Office venue and attended alongside fellow cabinet Brexiters Michael Gove and Liam Fox.

The organisation faced an inquiry from Companies House over its name. The use of the word “institute” is protected by law and reserved for established organisations “that typically undertake research at the highest level, or are professional bodies of the highest standing”.

It can be used only after permission has been granted by Companies House and the business secretary.

The thinktank’s website previously cited its name throughout as the Institute for Free Trade, while Hannan’s Twitter biography said he was president of the organisation.

Both have now been changed. The thinktank now just calls itself the IFT, with no indication of what the initials stand for. Hannan’s Twitter profile says he is “president of @IFTtweets”, using the organisation’s own Twitter address.

Hannan is a vocal advocate of both Brexit and unfettered global free trade. He has called for the UK to mimic the low tax, low regulation model of Singapore after Brexit, albeit without the state-built flats in which 80% of Singaporeans live.

The thinktank is officially registered as the Initiative for International Trade Ltd, which does not need to be changed. Companies House told the Observer, which first reported on the investigation, that it was aware of the IFT’s use of the term and would be contacting it.

“It is an offence to use a sensitive word set out in regulations in a business name without the prior approval of the secretary of state,” a spokeswoman said. “The offence is committed by the company and every officer of the company. The person(s) guilty of an offence is liable to a fine.”

BiglyBadgers · 19/12/2017 09:39

So what does IFT stand for now? Do you think they needing suggestions?

Idiotic Flamming Turdbuckets is the first thing that springs to my mind...

BiglyBadgers · 19/12/2017 09:42

Invertebrate Fucking Tossers
Or if we need something more suitable for work how about International Fanclub for Trump or Independent Fascist Think-tank.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 19/12/2017 09:53

I'd vote for it to be rebranded Independent Fascist Think-tank.

Re: May's lacklustre rebuke of the hostile environment created by the press versus Bercow's more impassioned one, this is noteworthy (apologies if already posted on the thread)

Steve Bullock‏
@GuitarMoog
I think it is worth remembering that, just a few months after James Slack wrote the "Enemies of the People" article for the Mail, he was hired as @Number10press Secretary by May.

She saw his work and thought "I want that".

Motheroffourdragons · 19/12/2017 09:57

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

BigChocFrenzy · 19/12/2017 09:59

The alt-right racist DUP are using the completely spurious argument that Muslims living nearby would be offended by a Christmas tree Angry

  1. I have never heard of any Muslim being offended by a Christmas tree

Muslims, e.g. on Mumsnet, must be pretty tired of correcting this delusion whenever rightwing posters - and it always seems to be rightwing - post this slur.

  1. The DUP have never before shown the slightest interest in minorities, other than to oppress them. Like they are trying in this case, to punish Catholics over the earlier flag issue.
BigChocFrenzy · 19/12/2017 10:04

Reminds us again, how shameful that the Tory party are so unscrupulous about holding on to govt,
that they will ally themselves to what over the last 10 years or so has turned into a clearly fascist party

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 19/12/2017 10:09

Reader Paul Hollands spent a week on a pro-Brexit Facebook group to break out of the Remain social media ‘bubble’.

www.theneweuropean.co.uk/top-stories/facebook-turns-leavers-into-brexit-extremists-1-5322487

I have spent the last week in a pro-Brexit group on Facebook. I did this to try and break out of my ‘bubble’, but also I went in search of the reason why people voted for Brexit. I was looking for reasoned arguments for why Brexit is happening. I found none.

What I discovered was large groups of people being radicalised daily and hourly, by far-right and neo-Nazi propaganda and a ubiquitous belief in wild conspiracy theories such as the Kalergi Plan, Agenda 21 and George Soros and the new world order. Google’s algorithmic flaws ensure that they can easily find some hate speech site that confirms these darkly wild fantasies.

Anyone disagreeing with them is a libtard leftist who is an apologist for Muslim terrorism. Sadiq Khan is hated because he is both ‘liberal’ Labour and a Muslim. There is huge support for Donald Trump because he is a ‘truth speaker’.

Remainers are called lefty Nazis who have been brainwashed by EU propaganda. When asked ‘why Nazi?’, the response comes that Hitler was a socialist because his party were the National Socialists.

The most common theme and motivator (and the most frightening) is a toxic mix of ideas about Muslims. In the minds of these people, all Muslims are terrorists and child rapists, and all immigrants are Muslims.

They say that Angela Merkel let millions of them into Germany and gave them EU passports and our EU membership means that they can now come to the UK to commit acts of terrorism.

Everything from the housing crisis, lack of NHS funding and cuts to benefits, police funding and cuts to the armed forces are blamed on the hordes of people the ‘bullying and corrupt’ EU are sending to the UK.

In reality, all of these things are the fault of our own governments and well within the power of our leaders to address, but Brexiteers have accepted an essentially racist political explanation for these issues, egged on by the right-wing press.

Here is one typical comment: “Please start a petition to limit the berth (sic) rate for all, Immigrants are outbreeding us by 3 to 1, it will also reduce the population on our overcrowded island and save on child benefit Pay outs. And reduce NHS costs.”

These are groups of people whose Facebook feeds are full of bile, hatred and misery. I’m sure it makes them all deeply fearful, but it is also radicalising them. It is not too hard to imagine this degenerating into paramilitarism of the type that killed Jo Cox.

DentalDilemma · 19/12/2017 10:18

Oh, how lovely, a "No Polish, no Eastern Bloc" sign. Looks like it has been there since 2009 and nobody's really that bothered. Hmm

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/dec/18/fishery-could-face-legal-action-for-sign-banning-eastern-european-anglers

www.oxfordmail.co.uk/news/yourtown/bicester/4547768.Ban_to_stop_fish_takeaway_branded_racist/?ref=twtrec

Hasenstein · 19/12/2017 10:24

Pain

That is really terrifying, but it surely doesn't represent the thinking of the "mainstream" Leaver. Or maybe it does, at least in some parts.

At a party last weekend, I got talking to a Leaver (although he didn't want to admit it outright, just looked shamefaced when I asked him and wouldn't look me in the eye). On further questioning about the numerous issues and reasoned responses from me (I've become quite adept at this due to DW's experience with the Home Office!), the only thing he could come up with was "Do you really want an EU army?". When I pointed out that such suggestions were largely about standardisation of equipment between national armies and, anyway, every member state has a veto, he just subsided into incoherent muttering.

I was struck by how guilty he looked about having voted to leave and took his bluster as a symptom of his dawning realisation that he'd voted on gut instinct, rather than reason.

Mind you, he was pissed and I was sober Smile. There are some benefits to being the designated driver.

LurkingHusband · 19/12/2017 10:33

What a really stupid thing to do - drop the word but keep the initial

I give you: "ICI", "BP", "BT"

all dropped words but kept initials ....