Westminstenders: And so it begins

[RedToothBrush]

Promises made that can not be kept.

We have already fallen at the first stumbling block: the desire for parallel talks on exit and future relationship that May wanted has been rejected. Not that this is a surprise seeing as we were told this.

This isn't two years of negotiations for a good deal. Forget any suggestions that it is. It's two years of damage limitation and domestic pr.

For both the UK and EU.

I do believe that May's attitude - which seemed to be more friendly in her speech and letter yesterday - has burnt all our bridges.

This talk of the world needing the EU's 'liberal democracy' isn't aimed at the EU though. Her use of the words that produced uproar in the HoC yesterday was deliberate. Why use it? It was always going to produce a reaction.

When May says she will have a consensus at home to achieve this goal one of two things must happen: to prove just how much we need the EU to make a political reversal possible at the expense of her head or to vilify the EU to a point that Remainers suddenly change their mind.

To get a good deal for the UK she can not satisfy her hard line Brexiteers. It is impossible purely because to do otherwise is like breaking the laws of physics. Trade is done mostly with who you are closest too. This is the inescapable truth. We are leaving the EU but not Europe as keeps being pointed out.

If we want to trade we have to accept EU regulations. If we do not, we do not trade. Rules we can now no longer influence by must obey.

We can not reduce immigration. We have had control of non-Eu immigration and that is not going down due to skills shortages. To combat this schools are getting less money.

In terms of sovereignty and British parliament we just gave that away. The 'Great' Repeal Act is a power grab by the executive. It seems to give the powers of the monarch to Mrs May and take them away from parliamentary scrutiny. At the same time we are forced to become beholden to Trump's America. A man who screws people for a living and has not a shred of honour.

Using security as our bargaining chip misses the obvious. If we do not cooperate we endanger Brits abroad and ourselves domestically. Are we really prepared to stop?

The opportunities of Brexit Britain are bleak. This will be normalised.

Good luck folks. We are gonna need it.

the party would lose most of the 27 gains they made from the Lib Dems in 2015, including all those in south London, all those in Cornwall and most of those in Devon.

Really? Not been saying that for months...

I've been saying that too. Its also likely that in large remain seats the younger remain voters, and some labour would switch to lib dem.

The lib dem swing won the tories the last election, if it swings back they lose the majority.

Lib/Lab coalition ahead.

I'm wondering if the Lynton Crosby stuff is behind the new noises towards softer Brexit.

Or maybe May is just as slow to latch on as people say she is.

Theresa May softens stance on Brexit roadblocks

Perhaps reality did eventually bite even at no.10.

Perhaps it was always impossible to unite Great Britain with the continent. Naive to reconcile the legal system of Napoleon with the common law of the British empire

Well Ireland inherited the Common Law at independence and it has worked well alongside the Napoleonic model. Amazing what can be done when the spirit is willing.

I understood 'macabre' too from LH's comment, and also saw there the insinuation that the PLP and the rest of the party has disappeared so far up its own arse that it has lost touch with reality and is more interested in staking out ideological positions and maintaining purity of doctrine than actually addressing real events and real concerns.

...the leadership is not the party as a whole. It's not even the PLP as a whole. But that, really, is part of the problem. [TheCatFromJapan]

This^^

woman12345 Wed 05-Apr-17 14:18:53

Great post on Israel imo.

The anti Israel lobby is the one KL speaks for and it is the ideological position Corbyn is pandering to.

LH Ideally we need a synthesis of left and right policies, based on evidence, not dogma.

What you need is Fianna Fáil.

Thanks math there comes a time, when one has to speak up.
No one wanted to end up there, but it is less heady choppy off and chemical warfarey than its neighbours. Particularly for women.
I'll take Fianna Fail if we can have a quota of Irish writers (bags Anne Annewright and Neil Jordan), and I've always found a certain type of Irish man rather easy on the eye, and the ear.

First job for Fiana Fail British branch to sort out:
Stop unemployed immigrant's son from nicking people's planes:
^Theresa May has to take costly charter jet due to royal schedule clash
Prime minister was forced to give up use of official plane for her Middle East tour as it was already in use by Prince Charles
The Labour MP Paul Flynn said: “This just shows that we are subjects, not citizens. It does seem to me to be outrageous. Of course the prime minister should have the first call on the plane – she is the elected ruler – ahead of some unspecified journeys by the heir to the throne^

www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/apr/05/theresa-may-has-to-take-costly-charter-jet-due-to-royal-schedule-clash

More than half of Labour MPs support anti semitic Holocaust denier:

^Almost half of Labour’s 229 MPs have signed an open letter warning that the decision not to expel Ken Livingstone over allegedly anti-Semitic comments is a “betrayal” of the party’s values.

A total of 107 MPs, along with 48 Labour peers, put their name to the Jewish Labour Movement statement criticising the party’s National Constitutional Committee (NCC) for handing Mr Livingstone an additional one-year suspension from holding office in the party but re-instating him as a member^

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/ken-livingstone-labour-mps-letter-jewish-labour-movement-antisemitism-jeremy-corbyn-hitler-a7669256.html.

A Guardian comment re transport for TMay & Charles:

"As a matter of urgency, we need a second school minibus. To raise funds, we will be holding a weapons sale in the gymnasium."

Seriously, without any delusions about UK power, the RAF needs budget to make more than one plane available.
Trips to boost trade, trips for international chinwags, attending funerals (Cam's 100k to attend King Abdullah's sendoff) ... can't all be in sequence, especially allowing for maimtenance downtime.

Well done to the PLP for finding the courage to stand up and be counted.

All progressives should stand up against Holocaust denial and anti-semitism, just like we would against any other forms of racism.

BCF, I was being a bit sarcastic, like RTB suggested yesterday, it's interesting to see who has the courage to stand up and how very many do not. Labour's just chucked Jewish British under the bus along with trade unionists, women etc etc.

RTB that is a really interesting article on Con / Lib marginals. I think it is probably accurate as regards London. One of the problems for Labour of going after Remain in London is that they cannot outremain or go to the right of the LibDems and the Con seats at risk are mostly LibDem marginals anyway.

For the rest of the country I am sceptical about the analysis. I think the Copeland and Stoke by-elections are good indicators of how the chips could fall between Lab / LibDem / UKIP even in Devon and Cornwall. That seems to favour the Conservatives.

(Also worth noting that 50ish SNP MPs are unlikely to go into coalition with Lab / LibDem atm and I think any coalition based on the New Statesman analysis would need them).

I think it's great that so many MP have signed that letter against KL.
I do have an issue with the idea of a 'Jewish Labour Movement'. Why on earth is there some separation within the Labour Party according to religion (or race)?

Re the plane and Prince Charles
IS he not using that plane to go and do some PR exercise for the PM in Europe? Just like theyve send Prince Williams and Catherine to Paris?

A bit rich then to say that it shows we are all subjects to the Queen (well actually we are!) and the place should have been used by the elected PM (actually now she wasn't). And it shows how awful the Roayl family is (they are just doing what they are told)

I agree with you Green especially since according to wiki the total Jewish population in the UK is less than 300,000 and 70%+ of those eligible to vote, vote Conservative. The PLP is being played like a fiddle by the DM and co over this.

Also agree with you on Prince Charles - if anything it just demonstrates that we could do with another plane and since fossil fuel free planes are cutting edge and are in line with PC's agenda this would be an ideal investment opportunity for him and the "Firm".

The plane they use is dual roled - when it is used by ministers/royal family it takes a scarce resource away from a shockingly overstretched fleet.

It cost (and costs) a disgusting amount and should never have been utilised in such a way tbh.
It was initially conceived by Tony Blair who wanted a 'Blair Force One' (in keeping with his delusions of grandeur) and David Cameron pushed for it to be implemented (again, delusions of grandeur).

It makes much more financial sense to charter ac as and when they're needed.

The royal family never pushed for one btw - it was a completely political motivation.

Jewish population in the UK is less than 300,000 and 70%+ of those eligible to vote, vote Conservative. The PLP is being played like a fiddle by the DM and co over this.
So which bit of democracy covers Jews?

woman sometimes you have to question who is "standing up" for a minority and why.

The actual size of the Jewish population is irrelevant. There are lots of Labour Party supporters (and swing voters) who feel strongly about the issue. It's really bad PR for the Labour Party.

There a lots of subgroups within political parties, it's like student societies. They campaign for specific issues that are particularly relevant to their members. Anyone can belong to one or more of these groups. What's the problem?