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To be scrupulously fair, we are also being equal-opportunity Roolz Iz Roolz arses to white women with EU-national husbands:

www.theguardian.com/world/2017/feb/28/scottish-woman-and-french-husband-quit-uk-over-brexit?

A Scottish woman and her French scientist husband have decided to quit the UK because of Brexit after his application for permanent residency was rejected by the Home Office, despite him working in the country for more than 20 years.

...Bruno Pollet came to Britain in 1991 as part of an Erasmus programme when he was studying in Grenoble. He ended up staying, and married Emma six years ago.

Now a visiting professor of energy and environment at Ulster University and a researcher for a power company in Swansea, he told the Guardian last October that he felt like a second-class citizen, but had decided that in order to protect his family’s right to remain in the country he was reluctantly going to complete the 85-page application form for permanent residency.

He felt confident he would succeed in getting the residency card as he was scrupulous about paperwork and also had gone to the trouble of obtaining 100 pages of HMRC records of tax paid in the UK since he worked in a pub as a student.

On 4 February he received a letter from the Home Office telling him his application was rejected.

...The Home Office told her husband its decision was because during his 25 years in the UK he had spent three years in South Africa, as part of his professional development as a scientist.

They told him he qualified for permanent residency before he went to South Africa in 2012, but because he had stayed there for three years he was unable to show that he had “continuously resided in the United Kingdom without an absence exceeding two years since your qualification for permanent residence”.

Roolz Iz Roolz arses

But when we're told the EU won't allow us single market access without full FOM because Roolz Iz Roolz, then that's ok, right?

Surely the sainted EU couldn't be being Roolz Iz Roolz arses too, could they?

But when we're told the EU won't allow us single market access without full FOM because Roolz Iz Roolz, then that's ok, right?

EU citizen who moves to the UK, marries a UK citizen, lives and works here for years, all in good faith and in keeping with his rights to FOM - now told he will not qualify to remain under a massive change in circumstances outside his control.

We The People, voted "overwhelmingly" to Leave the EU with "clear-eyed resolve" knowing that the Four Freedoms are considered integral to the organisation, thus bringing about a massive change in circumstances allegedly entirely within our control and entirely foreseen by the people who voted for it.

Yup, absolutely no difference. In fact, We The 65 Million People are being Punishment Beaten and never knew any of this would happen, whilst individual EU citizen is a chancer who should have looked into his crystal ball and taken appropriate action 20 years ago.

Comfort You do understand the difference between a tactical rule and a principle / strategy for delivering a vision? Freedom of movement is part of a four pronged strategy for implementing free trade within the EU, it's overarching aim as an organisation. The rules just implement that strategy.

On the other hand the immigration rules are merely a tactic to reduce immigration at any cost as a result of the conservatives making it into a tactic to win votes. Supposedly Britain was an open tolerant society that welcomes people who contribute to society and that was exactly what was happening until Cameron needed a scapegoat for the effects of austerity. The result is set of rules that are racist, sexist, and brutal in terms of the impact on families.

That case of the French bloke married to the Scottish woman is a truly spectacular own goal. Anyone who can support that obviously has a vacuum between their ears.

Another scary thought is that is our kids won't be able to fall in love with any one from any where earning anything. What happens if your son or daughter falls in love while travelling round Europe this summer?

When the personal is politicised like this, something fascisty is afoot.

We have rules for being allowed to stay in the UK, if you don't follow the rules you should be deported. This has nothing to do with the EU, how many years did that person have to get citizenship, 30? If I married someone and wanted to move to their country I would make dam sure I had ticked all the boxes.

The right is always whinging about bureaucracy but when it comes to immigration you can never have enough red tape it seems.

How does splitting a family up reflect on this country? What does it achieve?

Re: French scientist expect more of that. And who would want to come to Brexit Britain? Britain will have to train up alot of call centre operatives as scientists to fill the void.

How does splitting a family up reflect on this country? What does it achieve?

This country didn't split up their family, the individual did for not following the rules.

It reflects that this country is a law abiding state.

It achieves the message that you cant migrate here illegally start a family and then live here forever against the rules.

Who came over illegally?

To return to the Guardian discussion, here is another example. Well, it's actually far worse, it's a clear misrepresentation of the facts.

The headline is

Poll shows 60% of European doctors are considering leaving UK

www.theguardian.com/society/2017/feb/28/gmc-poll-suggests-half-of-european-doctors-are-considering-quitting-uk

The article repeats the claim and then says

The GMC said 2,106 doctors from the EEA, about 10% of the total who are working in the UK, had responded to the survey

Of those who responded, 60% (1,280) said they were considering leaving the UK at some point in the future, and, of those doctors, 91% said the UK’s decision to leave the EU was a factor in their considerations

So despite the fact that 90% of EU doctors didn't reply to the survey, they manage to conclude that more than half are planning to leave the UK. No possibility that those doctors planning to leave might be more likely to respond? No?

The problem is this sort of talking in half-truths all the time just makes any sensible consideration or discussion of the realities of Brexit (or anything else) less likely, not more.

Who came over illegally?
Well self evidently the women referenced in this thread.

I may have to rescind my last post - I think it may be that the GMC surveyed 10% of EU doctors, rather than all were surveyed and 10% responded. I am just trying to find out which.

Irritatingly I have been unable to find an actual report on the GMC survey, so I can't find out how many doctors they actually surveyed.

So please ignore my post at 20.22. I may have been incorrect.

Well self evidently the women referenced in this thread.
It's not evident at all.

Anon That last comment sums up how informed you are. There is no suggestion that she entered the country illegally. Of course lots of illegal immigrants enter the country legally on a tourist visa but then overstay but they don't tend to turn up to immigration offices for an interview (where she was detained). They tend to keep their head down under the authorities radar working on the black market, and being exploited.

Up until five years ago she would have had the automatic right to remain as the spouse of a British citizen and she has been making applications from in and outside the UK ever since, and been open and honest, and probably naive. If the Home Office were sure of their ground why deport her before she had access to a decent lawyer? I strongly suspect her main problem was not having used a decent immigration lawyer or source of community support on immigration. They successfully navigate these "rulz" all the time.

The GMC said 2,106 doctors from the EEA, about 10% of the total who are working in the UK, had responded to the survey

Of those who responded, 60% (1,280) said they were considering leaving the UK at some point in the future, and, of those doctors, 91% said the UK’s decision to leave the EU was a factor in their considerations

We don't know how many were asked - usually surveys target a sample of the overall population. 2000 respondants represents a rather large sample of this type of population - certainly enough to provide statistically significant data if the sampling was done correctly. The sample may or may not be representative, but you'd have to look at who did the survey and how to know that (and you would also need to know something about sampling).

something fascisty is afoot.

Arron's Angels ;)

My family have fallen in love with people all over the world, had to wait for visas and jump through hoops. It's the norm for us.

Philandering foreigner has a breakdown:
“Things have never been better. We’re all living longer and we’ve got mobile phones.” That was about it.

I think the last time you were arguing they were reasonable enough....but now you're not happy with them.

I recall a previous occasion where a poll of 1000 people was taken as very strong evidence for a particular argument.

whatwouldrondo That last comment sums up how informed you are. I never suggested that she entered the country illegally. I implied she had remained in the country illegally (which is self evident).

achieves the message that you cant migrate here illegally start a family and then live here forever against the rules.