The Brexit Arms. Please drink ( & post ) responsibly.

[surferjet]

I don't want to say anything inflammatory but it was the less educated people below middle class that voted en mass for it

*Thank you op, when I read stuff like this - I get on my knees and kiss the ground that the vote went the correct way and we voted LEAVE.

Because as repugnant as that sentiment is - there are many in the EU hierarchy who feel the same as you op. They want to inflict an un voted for political ideology on the EU and they don't care what is in their way, they will proceed at literally all costs. They care nothing for the poor and un educated people across the EU, collateral damage - fodder in the face of the Great EU Egoistical Juggernaut.

So thanks for reminding me what we voted against. And thank the good folk of the UK for voting to get the hell out of it.*

Just read this on another thread really puts into words how I feel can't work out who to credit it to shame it's too long for a t-shirt

So would leavers be happy if it transpires that Brexit make us all worse off? Seems not, but what do you leavers think? I believe we will all be much worse off, so I will keep remoaning in the hope that the government come to their senses before it's too late.
www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/politics/2016/dec/10/poll-public-will-not-accept-brexit-worse-off-tim-farron-ukip-lib-dem-yougov?client=safari

Why do some people on this thread refer to Farage as Nige ?

Yes, NF is far more appropriate.

Marmite changes to UC and the in-works benefits freeze legislated by GO, prior to any talk of Brexit, will cost many working families with children on the lowest incomes in excess of £1,000. I suspect they are just glad to be rid of him punishment budget or not. Who is this "we" who will be worse off. Even DC appears to be admitting it was never the case that "we are all in this together".

The article doesn't actually appear to be saying anything other than the fairly obvious that most people have no desire to be worse off and quite reasonably most are undecided about how Brexit will affect them economically. Even the conclusion that the margin in favour of Brexit may have fallen is suspect as all the polling prior to the referendum predicted a win for Remain and this poll now indicates a tie? I tend to look at who is commissioning the polling when assessing the outcome and given it is the pro-remain pressure group and there is no analysis of the actual questions asked and who was asked the article is pretty unilluminating (someone should tell my spellchecker unilluminating is an actual word, cos I am fed up double checking and my spelling aptitude is diabolical).

I call him Njge why shouldn't I?

Hmm I don't call him Njge

Why do they call him Nige? Well he's a man of the people isn't he?

Yes I think he is a man of the people that's probably why I call him Nige at times. I think he's honest, he wants what's best for the country and despite dreadful harassment of both himself and his family he hasn't given up on his/our dreams. Thank you for clearing that up Kaj

What in earth would make you think he's interested in your dreams?

Because he almost single candidly achieved UK independence what on earth makes you think he isn't ? You need to start looking at facts and stop reading gutter journalism, it's not a very intelligent way of forming opinions Kaj

*handedly obviously but candidly is a very apt word for Nige too. Btw I'm never calling him anything else now I quite like it; affectionate, wry and just kind of nice

It's all in his own words. He couldn't make it much plainer.

Why do some people on this thread refer to Farage as Nige ?

Why not?
Why do people refer to people as anything?

Should I call him Mr Farage?
It's not a formal space btw - it's a MN thread.

Or...
Did you actually mean to imply (in a faux confused way) that it means posters who use 'Nige' are fan girls of him, and therefore are not worthy of being taken seriously about anything.
The pathetic deliberate goading & trolling on these threads is so fucking tedious now.

£85,000 a year is a poor salary compared to a bankers, being sick of the low-grade I take to mean those who harassed and threatened his family whilst he was UKIP leader. You are putting your own spin on his words try to be a bit more open minded you might find some peace 're the Referendum.

Infinite, I'm starting to think that certain pockets of people are so determined to be miserable/unhappy/angry/outraged etc etc that they are in some respects the architects of their own misery.

It's like a form of self harm.

I think you have put some of your own spin on those words there infinite

So would leavers be happy if it transpires that Brexit make us all worse off?

It really isn't this simple is it? Will we all be worse off? Or will some be worse off and some better off? If we moved away from measuring wealth as income and actually looked at people's standard of living, the picture would look very different. If house prices are huge and two parent families both have to work fulltime to pay the mortgage, in theory they are "better off" than if house prices were lower and one could chose to be a SAHP. But of course they are not.

Working class people have become massively less "well off" (as measured by quality of life rather than number of £ in pocket) in recent years - many unable to buy a house, zhc, insecure jobs, costs of university, stagnant wages, final salary pensions being phased out etc etc. Inequality has increased massively in recent years, all the growth in the economy has gone to the rich. We are not all in this together and it just isn't that simple.

I do find it perplexing when, after years of all the growth in the economy going to the rich, we suddenly start talking as if we share it all out equally and the people who were responsible for the falls in living standards for the less well off are suddenly all concerned about them. Colour me sceptical.

Obviously people are entitled to their own views about whether or not "independence" has been achieved via the referendum. My view is that leaving the EU is a mistake and that this country has never not been independent.

I'd say that "Nige" implies affectionate familiarity with a friend, and that Farage is a friend to no one except himself and the likes of Trump, Banks and the people at Breitbart. He is planning a possible relocation to the US as we speak, so is not going to stick around to help realise the "dream" which he relentlessly sold for so many years.

It's one thing voting Leave - it's another thinking that Farage is anything other than an opportunist with white supremacist tendencies (evidenced by Breitbart affiliation and his refugee poster during the referendum campaign, amongst many other things). He has also used his job as MEP to do nothing but try to damage the EU, while at the same time taking a salary and claiming masses of expenses.

I would say that there are many Leavers who hopefully want nothing to do with Farage. And yes NF would be more apt.

So would leavers be happy if it transpires that Brexit make us all worse off?

Marmite - good soundbite, but please clarify.

In what way do you define or measure:

Brexit
All
Worse off

Brexit: hard Brexit or soft Brexit; or interfered with, frustrated, subverted, continually challenged & unnecessarily drawn out Brexit?

All: Every person in uk? every socioeconomic grouping?

Worse off: worse off in what respect? Monetarily, or otherwise? If otherwise, please be more specific.

I find it difficult to reply to a soundbite tbh.
I prefer better clarity & context as to what the question actually seeks to address.

And I think he has done and continues to do real damage to our country. It is not only the 17 million who voted to leave whose views matter. The UK is also home to the rest of us.

"It really isn't this simple is it? Will we all be worse off?"

No we won't all be worse off. Those at the top who can move their money around internationally will most likely be fine. Many have already made huge sums from the currency volatility resulting from the vote. But anyone who relies on schools, hospitals, social care or indeed any service funded by tax revenue, and anyone on a normal income who has to absorb the coming price rises is likely to be a lot worse off.

But there are choices to be made about tax revenue and funding of social services and, in all honesty, I think these have and will in the future have much more effect on people's living standards than whether we leave the EU. So take Osbourne's £3,400 per household figure. My family's financial situation is fairly secure and comfortable but we have lost huge sums in recent years due to Tory policies - we will now have to find the full cost of university fees and living expenses for 2 children if we want to give them the opportunities we had (when the DC were born we did not have to plan for this - our costs would have been much smaller.) So that's a loss of £54,000 on fees alone.

Every time house prices increase, that is a cost to us. The government could do something to control house prices but they don't because some people are doing very nicely out of them. When I have to pay for a private health appt because I can't wait 3 months for an appt for a very serious condition, because the gov is dismantling the NHS, that is a cost to my household.

And, as I say, we are fine, in secure jobs. For someone in a less fortunate position, the costs if the last few years of gov policy must be huge.

So the £3,400 needs to be considered against that. Even for my household, if we left the EU and "lost" £3,400, the gov could choose to mitigate that just by reversing the policies of the last few years. For households which have lost a lot more (benefit cuts etc) this would be even more the case.

What I mean is pretty much what Kaija said above. I believe that leaving the single market will be very damaging to our economy and GDP will go down as our debt rises. As a result public services will come under more and more pressure as less money is available to fund them. This suits the torrid agenda of reducing benefits and privatising the NHS. Yes some people will gain from this scenario but I think only the super rich who have the flexibility to ride it out and indeed make money out of the effects e.g. Increased volatility in the stock markets/currency markets. For the average family though, I can't see how it can be good news?