Sarkozy demands border shifted to Britain

[Bookaboo]

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/08/28/nicolas-sarkozy-demands-border-controls-for-thousands-of-migrant/

...but, if many of the migrants don't have a passport, how will they be allowed to Britain anyway? And presumably they would need a ticket for the ferry or the train.

Do you know anything about thanet or have you bothered to think for 5 minutes about why London might find it easier to integrate immigrants than thanet does?

There are challenges to population growth anywhere.

I accept Thanet is a quiet area - part rural part seaside towns. Small communities, un-used to immigrants seem to find it harder to accept them than other areas.

But immigration levels in Kent are nothing like as high as in London. And Thanet doesn't have the highest immigration level in Kent at 9%, compared to Gravesham which is the highest at 17% followed by Ashford 13%, Dartford, Maidstone 11% etc.

If immigration was a justification for UKIP then the whole of London would be UKIP where some boroughs have immigrant levels of 50%.

ONS UK migration map

Immigration and refugees are two separate matters. Even though the matter has been confused by hatred of anyone who isn't obviously white English being stoked by Farage.

I believe Kent CC has to bear the brunt of settling refugees, (as the Italians do) because that is where the refugees usually land, or are discovered.

9% of the population means Thanet has about 12,600 immigrants, in total not just EU, out of a population of 134,000.

Its not a lot.

NeonRainbow mentioned both 'immigrants' and 'asylum seekers'.

Kent mainly has Eastern European immigrants - Romanians, Bulgarians and Poles etc.

Most Syrian refugees were sent north - Glasgow, Coventry, Bradford, Birmingham, Liverpool and also Cardiff. London is a common preference for ME refugees in general due to its large ME population.

Currently my area of London is homing 42 Syrian asylum seekers, Lewisham 93, Southwark 89. Thanet has 0, Dover has 0, Canterbury has 3. But Ashford agreed to take more in 2015.

One thing that Kent does specifically have to deal with is unaccompanied child and teenage refugees and that does put pressure on their child services. As of July 2016 the Home Office has organised a dispersal scheme as Kent said they couldn't take any more.

Gloria The London Assembly election returned around 2.3m votes. UKIP were 171k, so about 8%. Assuming your 50% immigrant figure is correct and immigrants do not vote UKIP, that is 16% of the non-immigrant population.
In the GE, UKIP polled about 13%, so this suggests non-immigrant Londoners are more likely to vote UKIP than other parts of the country.

7.4 %.,

UKIP won 12.4% of the vote in the GE. So London as a whole votes for UKIP lower than average, playing about with assumptions is facile.

Some immigrants may vote for UKIP especially as they include people here for generations.

London voted overwhelmingly for remain - as much as 80% in some areas. And that's despite having a large immigrant population, many of whom do not have the right to vote.

To return to the subject of the Dover-Calais border, Macron has just resigned as finance minister, which means he intends to run for president.

Those with an interest in French politics will recall that some months ago, he floated the idea of moving the border back to Dover, and was slapped down by interior minister Cazeneuve at the time.

That makes three presidential candidates who are likely to support this policy - Le Pen, the right wing candidate (most likely Juppé) and Macron.

Carol I said that some boroughs have immigrant levels of 50%.

In fact UKIP has some of the lowest support in London of the whole country.

UKIP voting map

Scroll down to first map and click on UKIP.

Those pale areas in London is show this. You can see from the map the heartlands in the SE are mainly Essex and parts of Kent.

That's intersting Misti, in France it could be vote winner.
Of course one of the Brexit mantras was 'taking back control of our borders'.

Can't really blame France on this one.

"You want control of your borders? Right you are. That's your border, along those big white lumpy things over there."

in France it could be vote winner

The idea is very definitely a vote winner, as it scores on several fronts: it appeals to the racists, who would prefer the refugees to be somewhere else, to the pro-EU centrists who think the British need to be taught a lesson, and to those on the left who think that the UK's stance (particularly on child migrants) has been outrageous.

The main argument against it has been that such a policy would pull more migrants into northern France. But IMO the wind has been taken out of the sails of that argument by the continued growth in the migrant population in the nord-pas de calais: the population of the Calais jungle and nearby camps is now estimated at around 10,000, despite juxtaposed controls and despite heavy-handed attempts to disperse them.

Gloria you are refusing to accept that large numbers of immigrants reduces UKIP voters because immigrants do not vote UKIP.
Under your assumptions, an area with 100% immigrants and 0% UKIP had perfectly assimilated those immigrants.

There won't be a 'jungle' in the UK as no-one will be waiting to leave. They'll have arrived... The French will use the convenience of Brexit to stop this arrangement I'm sure of it, and who in Europe would argue for our side?

who in Europe would argue for our side?

Nobody. Because there is no argument:

UK: "let's take back control of our borders!"
France: "yes, great, we agree!"
UK: "Aarrgghhh"

Other countries are positively salivating at the prospect of trade negotiations with the UK

Carol, you are failing to understand London's culture.

UKIP support is very low in London because it's a multicultural city and
racism does not win support here, even among whites. UKIP itself knows perfectly well why they have poor support from Londoners whom they find to be 'media savvy and educated' 'cultured elite'. Goldsmith bombed in the mayoral election precisely because he tried to stoke racism and anti-immigrant feeling.

I think you may be conflating ethnic minorities and immigrants. Immigrants were born abroad. There are a handful of boroughs where the immigrant population is over 50% - Westminister for example, has a high proportion of ME immigrants, and in Kensington and Chelsea the majority of immigrants are French. But a significant proportion of the ethnic minority population are second or third generation - born here. White British still form the majority of Londoners - roughly 60% and they don't vote UKIP either.

It's not true that ethnic minorities don't support UKIP, some do. One of the two UKIP candidates elected to the London Assembly is mixed race.

Farage and his United Colours of Kipper.

There won't be a 'jungle' in the UK as no-one will be waiting to leave. They'll have arrived...

No, but they will be hauled off the ferries, or from under the trains, and banged in detention centres. This will no doubt be old RAF/Army bases.

Gloria You are failing to understand. I have no idea of the view of an average Londoner and neither do you.
However, voting statistics are flawed because it is easy to argue that places with higher numbers of ethnic groups will have a lower turnout for a racist party. That doesn't mean the white population are less racist, just less of them.
London has 12.3 racist crimes per year per 1,000 people compared to a UK average of 11. This would suggest an above average problem, not a hugely succesful multi-cultural city

I do because I am one. I get around.

I've explained to you that the white population in London don't vote for UKIP any more than the non-whites. I've also explained that UKIP are themselves aware of this.

You're obsessed with the idea that the only reason for lower UKIP support is lower volume of white voters and I can't be bothered to argue with your ignorance.

I have not said there is no racism in London simply that it's far less racist and more tolerant than many parts of the country. How many other areas of the country have such a large number of ethic minorities? That is the reason for the race crimes.

Gloria

I think Birmingham, Manchester have large ethnic populations. London voters do vote for UKIP, they have seats in the London assembly.
I am not saying the only reason is a lower volume of white voters, i am saying that London has the same mix of racists as the rest of the country, but they have a lower % because of the ethnic mix.
Please carry on believing you live in a perfect Utopian capital, but you are wrong.

I do because I am one. I get around.

Glad to see you regularly take the private political temperature of several million people on a regular basis. maybe you should hire yourself out to polling firms.

Quite a lot of London voted 'leave' actually...

Carol, aren't you assuming that immigrants (a) are able to and (b) do vote in the same proportion as the non-immigrant population for your argument to hold water (even if we are to ignore vastly different turnout patterns in local v general elections)?