My feed
Premium

Please
or
to access all these features

Brexit

Westministenders Continues. The one where are being grateful for having a Boris rather than a Trump and UKIP show Labour how it’s done.

985 replies

RedToothBrush · 04/08/2016 22:18

THE BREXIT FALLOUT CONTINUES - THREAD TWELVE

The calm of the eye of the storm is upon us. The signs are there that more trouble is ahead. What now for Brexit, the blank cheque for our future?

May’s honeymoon can only last the Summer, until she has to do some proper graft. Her Cabinet have all gone on holiday and to swat up on their new specialised subject, and by god have they got some homework to do.

Well, all of them apart from Liam Fox, who has bugger all to do for some time.

Johnson needs to… well we all know what Boris needs to do. Bend over and take it like a good boy.

Davies needs to learn the entire structure and workings of the EU and its variations of trade agreements and relationships with other nations. Juncker has the FUKD in his little black book of people who have crossed him (yes, he actually has one of these) and has put Brit Hating Barnier in charge of the EU Brexit team. Davies must somehow hold his own against this experienced EU hardnut. In French. Oh and find a permanent office.

What do the others need to learn? Hammond - how to perform a bloody miracle. Patel - it is illegal to use foreign aid as a leverage for trade deals. Leadsom – er everything? Rudd – how to do bigger assault on liberty and human rights than her mentor. Fallon – how we will afford to defend ourselves with pitch forks, especially if we can’t use Trident for some reason and it becomes necessary. Our enemy; Russia? North Korea? Turkey? Isis? Na. Trump if he wins.

Brexit is now officially in the hands Whitehall’s unbelievers. Those overstretched officials who are already saying there is a gap in their capacity to deliver what Parliament wants without additional the burden of Brexit. These discredited experts are left wondering if their challenge is, in reality, Mission Impossible, and this is made worse by the pressure that just about every senior Brexiteer seems to say is ‘easy’ despite all the mounting evidence to the contrary. Which is cold comfort to everyone who voted – Remain or Leave alike.

We still don’t even know what Brexit is. It is still something which has no coherent ideology and no clear set of prescriptions for what ailes us as a society. It is a bundle of contradictions, united chiefly by what, and who, it opposes. Whatever the problem, Brexit can fix it. Whatever the threat, internal or external, Brexit can vanquish it, and it is unnecessary for Brexiteers to explain how.

May’s plan? Some say that she is the Dear Leader, some say she is an evil genius with Larry the Cat on her lap waiting for the Brexiteer Boys to fuck it up so we can Remain, some say she is blessed by the Ghost of Thatcher but we know her as The PM. –Sorry I’ve been itching to make the May/Hammond Top Gear gag for several weeks— The truth is, we just don't know yet.

Plus anything Brexit related about the Labour and UKIP leadership and the rest of the world thrown in to boot.

This is the quest for the answers that everyone wants and trying to keep an eye on those politicians and accountability (both here and abroad in the era of post-fact politics in the trail of Brexit). There maybe no single ‘truth’ but there sure as hell is a lot of bullshit to wade through. Get your wellies out, and plough on through with us.

No experience necessary. Sense of humour required.

-------------------------

Brexit Fall Out Timetable
Labour Hustings Nottinghamshire: Wednesday 17th August
Labour Hustings Birmingham: Thursday 18th August.
Labour Hustings Glasgow: Thursday 25th August.
Labour Hustings London: Thursday 1st September
UKIP Leadership Result: 15th September
Labour Leadership Result: Saturday 24th September
The Department for Exiting the European Union first question sessions in Parliament: Thursday 20th October
High Court hearing on a50: due 'no earlier than the third week in October'
US Presidential Election: 8th November
French Presidential Election 1st Round: 23 April 2017
French Presidential Election 2nd Round: 7th May 2017
German Federal Election: Between 27 August and 22 October 2017

Last thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/2690632-Westminstenders-Continues-Boris-is-having-a-bad-week-Corbyn-resists-Its-gonna-be-a-long-summer?pg=1

OP posts:
Report
Motheroffourdragons · 05/08/2016 09:06

Great job, Red. I am continually amazed by all you are doing here.

Agreed, I wish we could back to 2012, we seemed to all pull together for the Olympics, it was such a good summer.

The BBC is running a story about Mrs Trump's illegal immigrant status when she came to the US originally. Made me chuckle, anyway.

www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36981502

I'm not a big fan of Clinton, but I really really hope she wins by a significant margin.

Report
RedToothBrush · 05/08/2016 09:24

To start off your morning the Telegraph editorial is
www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/2016/08/05/dont-blame-brexit-for-this-rate-cut-blame-project-fear/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
Don't blame Brexit for the rate cut, blame project fear

OP posts:
Report
RedToothBrush · 05/08/2016 09:26

Dan Rebellato ‏@DanRebellato
"Don't blame the iceberg for the Titanic sinking. Blame those who warned about the dangers of icebergs"

David Allen Green ‏@DavidAllenGreen
"Don't run into the wall."
[Runs into wall.]
smack
- That is your fault, for warning about the wall.

Well quite.

OP posts:
Report
howabout · 05/08/2016 09:31

Hi all, just checking in.
On Rio the Beechgrove gardeners were muttering about being off air for some giant overseas Highland Games tribute Grin Wonder if Andy can play tennis in a kilt?

Struck me listening to the debate on the limits of monetary policy and the need for fiscal stimulus post rate cut that JC and JMD appear to have won - big change from all the rhetoric going into the 2015 GE.

I watch too much NCIS and lived in DC so I think Clinton looking to be securing Virginia is a very good sign for her.

Report
HesterThrale · 05/08/2016 09:32

I also yearn for the feel-good spirit of 2012 - unity around a non-political event made us happier than these self-imposed divisions.
I've written to my MP about why we're voluntary committing obvious self-harm.

Switzerland's position in negotiating with the EU, which has similarities to ours, has been negatively affected by Brexit.
www.politico.eu/pro/swiss-could-become-brexits-latest-casualty-european-union-migration/

Report
Kaija · 05/08/2016 10:01

That Telegraph editorial is quite something.

I really want all this black is white stuff to stop now.

Report
SwedishEdith · 05/08/2016 10:18

That Telegraph editorial amounts to "Stop thinking, people. Stop it." Who knew the Telegraph was so anti-elite and for 'The People's Army.'

Report
RedToothBrush · 05/08/2016 10:31

David Allen Green ‏@DavidAllenGreen · 11m11 minutes ago


Raoul Ruparel @RaoulRuparel
Many wise ppl writing eloquent summaries of probs w Brexit. But, would be nice, if these v smart ppl actually started coming up w some ideas

David Allen Green
Those of us explaining the real and hard problems with Brexit are now at fault for not solving them as well.

In other news

www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-nissan-idUSKCN10G0LM?utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Content&utm_content=57a448ad04d30102385be255&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter
Nissan come right out with it, and blame Brexit saying that they are waiting for information about the Brexit deal before making investment decision.

But you just keep blaming Project Fear, The Telegraph.

The Express did a survey asking if we were going to fall into a recession post Brexit. The result? 76% voted Yes - We need the EU.

Westministenders Continues. The one where are being grateful for having a Boris rather than a Trump and UKIP show Labour how it’s done.
OP posts:
Report
UnderTheGreenwoodTree · 05/08/2016 10:48

placemarking - still reading along trying to keep up Wink

Report
Chalalala · 05/08/2016 11:01

thanks for the thread and summary Red!

I just heard on French radio that the EU had moved to impose big tariffs on Chinese and Russian steel (higher than the provisional February tariffs)

I wonder if Brexit UK will have the economic clout or political will to do the same thing on its own.

Report
TheBathroomSink · 05/08/2016 11:10

That Telegraph opinion piece is gobsmackingly reductive. You can't blame Brexit because it hasn't happened yet, and if it did happen all the problems would become glitter and everyone would get unicorns.

Peregrina - I think the Silverdale councillor was one of the Ukip exceptions, she was relatively well-liked, and had split from Ukip to join the local independents before her death, and seemed to be a competent councillor. The Labour councillor who won the seat last night has a lot of local experience and quite a high profile in the council, and had a lot of local campaigning going on.

Report
Peregrina · 05/08/2016 11:18

I just heard on French radio that the EU had moved to impose big tariffs on Chinese and Russian steel (higher than the provisional February tariffs)
I wonder if Brexit UK will have the economic clout or political will to do the same thing on its own.

No, I expect we will say, Chinese and Russian steel welcome. Never mind the quality. The Chinese have just lost some face with the Hinkley agreement being delayed, so this would be a way of making up to them.

Report
prettybird · 05/08/2016 11:19

Hadn't the UK been arguing against higher tariffs for Chinese steel for fear of upsetting our Chinese friends potential investors? If so, it shows that our influence in the EU is already diminishing.

Report
Kaija · 05/08/2016 11:20

Have had a general sick feeling over the past month that immigrants are being made to feel so unwelcome and disrespected here they will decide to leave the uk in large numbers. That editorial has turned it into a very particular fear that Mark Carney will be one of them.

Report
OneArt · 05/08/2016 11:34

Place marking

Report
howabout · 05/08/2016 11:50

The Telegraph editorial - seemingly the very last bastion of monetarism as a faith - according to the bbc even GO was tweeting about the need for government investment ie fiscal stimulation yesterday.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36977101

Why I would be pretty relaxed if Mark Carney packed up his marmalade sandwiches.

www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/aug/05/recession-bank-england-money-uk-households

And the very different plight of another Canadian family living in Scotland highlighting the huge inequities in the treatment of non-EU nationals.

www.thenational.scot/news/relaxation-of-visa-rules-at-elite-english-universities-is-a-chance-to-let-families-stay-say-mps.20807

Report
missmoon · 05/08/2016 12:06

The Pete North blog is very interesting, but I found this paragraph very frightening to read: Given the rank dishonesty of the London School of Economics and the FT throughout the referendum campaign I can see a strong case for a purge of academia and the well sinecured chair-warmers throughout the land who lie for a living. These are the experts we rejected during the referendum. We want rid of them.

There is no proof whatsoever that they were "lying", in academia if you disagree with something you need to show evidence to the contrary. The first step in any totalitarian regime is to restrict academic and press freedoms, see what is happening in Turkey (and has happened elsewhere, e.g., Egypt) :(

Report
missmoon · 05/08/2016 12:07

Plus, UK universities are private non-profit organisations (not public organisations), the government wouldn't be able to "purge" universities even if they wanted to, but their actions can lead to the best academics moving abroad.

Report
NotTooBothered · 05/08/2016 12:17

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TheBathroomSink · 05/08/2016 12:31

There are many objections to be made about the LSE, but to claim that it needs to be shut down because it didn't back brexit is really getting into 'I don't want to hear anything which doesn't agree with my point of view' territory.

Links to climate change sceptics are almost predictable.

Report
SwedishEdith · 05/08/2016 12:52

Who is Pete North? Never heard of him. Had a look on is blog and he comes across as an angry conspiracy theory type. Why is what he says relevant?

Report
OlennasWimple · 05/08/2016 12:54

Another great thread

Report

Don’t want to miss threads like this?

Weekly

Sign up to our weekly round up and get all the best threads sent straight to your inbox!

Log in to update your newsletter preferences.

You've subscribed!

InShockReally · 05/08/2016 13:01

Thanks red, opening posts incredibly informative as always Flowers

Report
SwedishEdith · 05/08/2016 13:05
Report
prettybird · 05/08/2016 13:16

I do think that Ghosn, the Renault-Nissan Alliance Chief Exec, is being over optimistic when he says, ".... that at the end of the day common sense is going to prevail from both sides"

So far, common sense has been conspicuous in its absence Hmm

And what seems like "common sense" to one "side" is not common sense to the other Hmm

As someone I used to work with use to say frequently, "If common sense were so common, why is there so little of it about?" Wink

Report
Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.