The post-Brexit family tragedy playing out across the UK

[WalesTilly2016]

I am writing this as it is happening within my family and I need to share my heartbreak...

Grandparents are special. To children and young people they are a life-long constant, offering kindness, love, tenderness and an ever-open ear when parents often have to be the opposite out of necessity. They are fun and they are generous. They are quite simply immaculate in the eyes of their grandchildren.

The EU referendum is unfortunately fracturing that traditional relationship.

Young people across the UK have been dismayed at the outcome of the EU referendum, and have wasted no time in voicing their disappointment across the social media platforms they inhabit. The statistics clearly show that younger people are naturally Remainers. They have been born into a modern multicultural world that they see as their oyster, and where the idea of being able to travel and work anywhere with few limitations seems natural. They happily and comfortably school and hang out with people from other cultures, and the idea that they should be outraged because of Germans claim the sunbeds simply doesn’t occur.

The same statistics show the older generation to be firmly in the Leave camp, and the overwhelming driver for them wanting to leave is immigration and a wider dislike of foreigners in general, even if they live in areas where immigrants are few and far between. They have read and bought into the countless scare stories on the pages of the Daily Mail which have successfully built on a heritage of good old-fashioned British xenophobia; where Germans grabbing sunbeds is indicative of how you can’t trust any of them.

This dissonance between young Remainers and old Leavers is resulting in an uncomfortable sea-change in the grandparent-grandchild relationship, and it is currently being played out in countless families across the UK.

The debate as to why older people voted the way they did, and why they think inexperienced younger people are clueless is undoubtedly taking place in households up and down the country as we speak. Young people are voicing their opinions and asking ‘why’, and older people are not holding back on answering them, often in brutal tones. Sadly, for many young people it will be a profound and emotional culture shock when they see and hear their dearly-loved grandparents revealing themselves as xenophobes and foaming-at-the-mouth racists.

It is a tragedy of the deepest order, and one which truly strikes at the heart of our society. Countless grandparents will be revealing to their grandchildren a disturbingly ugly side never previously shown, or even suspected. And for what? All because the morons at the tabloids have been manipulating their readers for their own benefits.

One of the most biting post-Brexit opinions shared on social media is that ‘Old people hate immigrants more than they love their grandchildren’. It is very hard to argue with, and it is truly depressing that a perfectly legitimate political debate about membership of the EU has been polluted and poisoned by rhetoric from the media and politicians that, while successful in achieving a result at the ballot boxes, has come at the cost of fractured family relationships.

Didnt expect anything else

Loving mother, good person, destroyed families, children, Nazis, WWII, fascism. Here on Mumsnet this wordcloud is guaranteed to tug at users' heartstrings, isn't it?

Wonder why specifically and singularly the Remain campaign somehow got included?

Talkin quite obvious isn’t it?

I’m rather fond of Negronis.

Shaken not stirred of course

and then a well built Manhattan rounds the day off nicely

as the two are good companions

'Why on earth would anyone think badly of your children' Without boring everyone with life stories, which are not really appropriate to this discussion anyway, I am. and am known by family and all close enough to share with, to have been a good mother, a good and caring person, specifically equality orientated and actively non-racist, socially minded etc.etc. who has not been overdemanding of her children and has done her personal best for them even in the face of some quite sizeable difficulties, (not claiming in any of that not to have ever made any mistakes or to have delivered perfection to my children) Family and friends who may be close enough to confide would be likely to think badly of them in relation to any estrangement behaviour that they may have initiated - perhaps the more so because of my single parent status for a fair part of their upbringing. I don't suppose that I am alone in feeling protective of my children in that way - seems obvious to parents of grown children I think - maybe not in the earlier days of parenthood?

girl

Sorry, in an attempt to clarify

Your children have initiated an estrangement due to how the older members of your family voted

(Im assuming younger voted remain and now want nothing to do with the family members who voted leave)

Is that right?

Without boring everyone with life stories, which are not really appropriate to this discussion anyway

Hellooooo?

Why are you posting on a thread about “The post-Brexit family tragedy playing out across the UK”?

And ... no, this 2 year old thread does not show up under Google searches for “brexit and family rift' or somesuch“ so I am interested in the agenda here?

Come on now, for a a good mother, a good and caring person, specifically equality orientated and actively non-racist, socially minded etc.etc where is your condemnation of the Leave racist dog whistles? The Farage Breaking Point poster for instance?

'where is your condemnation of the Leave racist dog whistles? The Farage Breaking Point poster for instance?' I have never ever ever said that I approved of any of the leave campaign. I do however, claim this space to discuss family estrangement and will not be goaded into your virtue signalling - my involvement in all of the things that I have referred to is much more real than that. It goes without saying that I disapprove - doh!

Whatever the rights and wrongs of Brexit, as a good person, a loving mother and a deeply equality motivated and non-racist person I will never forgive the Remain Campaign for using generations against each other, for setting up major stereotypes coercively in clever ways, and for destroying my family.

Virtue signalling much?

Pot, kettle, etc.

Just to clarify too that in saying that I will never forgive the Remain Campaign for the effect that some of its less ethical strategies have had on my family, I do not mean that I blame or will not forgive campaigners. I believe that the damage to my own family was as a result of what I consider to be unethical strategies that were or became strategies of the Remain Campaign - and it is at that level that I will not forgive. There were without doubt, things that cannot be forgiven in the Leave Campaign. I had no part in either the remain or the leave campaigns.

I will never forgive the Remain Campaign for the effect that some of its less ethical strategies have had on my family

Do please list what these were in the run up to the Referendum.

And for balance you could add the Leave strategies as well - you know, the ones like Turkey joining the EU and the EU army for instance.

You just need to read my first post on this thread - that is it. I will not repeat it here. When I repeated it in an earlier post because it seemed that people were asking me questions without having read it, I think that you criticised my doing so (actually not sure if it was you, but somebody did). Your own contributions to this thread seem symptomatic of the trope that has been created - there is no end, and no end to the attack - I guess that is why this two year old thread is the only one that I found in my google search on this subject - and even here speaking out is punished. It is sad. I don't know exactly who set up this strategy, but it is clever, and nasty on its own terms and no amount of 'what about ism' can excuse it. It's all yours - and the more you attack, pursue and close down discussion - the more that you demonstrate that discussion is being stifled in a process that has ruthlessly damaged families and society for political ends and is still ruthlessly damaging families and societies for political ends. It should have been possible to discuss this matter in family terms on this family site. What a shame. And shame on the spin doctors who set or ambled into the strategy.

Sorry - I missed the bit in your last post where you outlined the Remain campaign’s less ethical strategies that has caused your family strife?

Please do share.

And as for your first post:

I will never forgive the Remain Campaign for using generations against each other, for setting up major stereotypes coercively in clever ways, and for destroying my family. For me, it seems akin to the cynical and well documented use in the 1930s of young people in Germany to impose facism on the German people. It was a cynical, deeply unfair and grossly damaging approach. Shame on them.

Sorry - I’m still missing how the Remain Campaign turned generations against each other in a rather Nazi sort of way?

Surely the Remain campaign (as did the Leave campaign) appealed to all age groups equally and everyone was free to vote how they saw fit?

And it’s kinda hard to discuss things if you throw our sound bites like the effect that some of its less ethical strategies have had on my family without actually specifying what those less ethical strategies comprise.

So, please do tell.

And stop with the the whatabouterism.

HTH.

Of course, I accept your apology. I can't explain matters any better than I have done already in the discussion. It is an attempt to communicate, and it is the best that I can do. I can only refer you to the posts that I have already made. Off to bed now.

Oh, I should have used pardon rather than sorry as it certainly wasn’t an apology.

Still waiting for what those less ethical strategies comprise.

And how the Remain Campaign turned generations against each other in a rather Nazi sort of way?

I’m all ears.

Really, it is very tedious to be constantly under attack. 'And ... no, this 2 year old thread does not show up under Google searches for “brexit and family rift' or somesuch“ so I am interested in the agenda here?' I did say 'or some such'. In my search, it comes up as item 5 when I put in 'brexit and family break up'. I have searched for help in this area from time to time before in the last two years using whatever terms that I hoped may come up with something, so it is possible that my computer reacts differently to yours especially if you have allowed options to be narrowed in your searches - or if I have inadvertently done that (not sure how that works but it is my understanding that searching can be customised depending on what you tend to search for). Please do not attempt to discredit by inference - it is easy, but not really acceptable. And yes, I did go to bed, but as often happens when this problem is on my mind, I was not able to sleep. Anyway, I am off to try to get some sleep again now.

.... Still waiting for what those less ethical strategies from the Remain campaign comprise.

Well im still waiting for a reply to my question

Probs in a for a bit of a wait

If you are going to add to a discussion and hound another member, at least have the courtesy to read their posts. You will find the problem I identified on the fist post I made in this discussion. I have also repeated that post once and referred you to it several times. Shame on you for hounding another member. If you are a parent, I hope that you never suffer the heartbreak of family break up and if you do, that you do not come across the sort of behaviour that you have demonstrated here.

Words words words words dogwhistle wordcloud Remain dogwhistle wordcloud words words words

Signifying nothing.

girlglo I have read back through all your posts. If I understand it correctly, there has been a breakdown in the relationship between your children and their grand parent(s), with you in the middle. You explain that this breakdown has occurred due to the differing views your children and their grandparent(s) hold on the brexit referendum. Your focus on this thread is not on the outcome of the referendum but the effect the campaigns on the referendum vote has had on your family.

I can see from reading many of the brexit related mumsnet threads that there are many families that have experienced fractures and splits or, at a lesser level, an agreement not to discuss the matter due to strongly held differing views. Whilst it may be of little comfort to you that other families are facing similar distressing breakdown, there are others in your position.

What I have not read previously is an allocation, as you have done, of the blame for your particular family breakdown. You identify the remain campaign content for that breakdown because you say it set out to create division between two generations. Can you cite any examples, from that remain campaign, that created the schism in your family? I am curious as to why it was the remain views of your children, as you explained that caused the split ? You have not mentioned any of the views of the grandparent(s) and how these were formed and discussed in your family. Were these differing views on the referendum not also the cause?

Or are you of the view that the leave campaign was based in fact and the remain campaign based on stirring up family conflict?

girlglo you haven't explained "the problem" in your first post at all.

I will never forgive the Remain Campaign for using generations against each other, for setting up major stereotypes coercively in clever ways, and for destroying my family. For me, it seems akin to the cynical and well documented use in the 1930s of young people in Germany to impose facism on the German people. It was a cynical, deeply unfair and grossly damaging approach.

How did the Remain campaign turn generations against each other?

How did the Remain campaign set up major stereotypes?

How is the Remain campaign in any way equivalent to the Hitler Youth, particularly given the rhetoric of being dynamic and forward looking and hopeful is more applicable to the emotions evoked by the Leave Campaign?

And:

I believe that the damage to my own family was as a result of what I consider to be unethical strategies that were or became strategies of the Remain Campaign - and it is at that level that I will not forgive.

So what unethical strategies did Remain use?

You can't have a discussion with someone who makes bold and unsupported statements and then refuses to shed any light on how they have drawn those conclusions.