"Because they keep coming over here taking our jobs!"

[LookAtMeGo]

Did anybody see this on the BBC news when a woman who looked to be about 80 uttered this phrase when asked why she had voted Leave.

Was I the only one to have seen the irony in the fact that as she said this she was having her nails done by an immigrant in a nail bar?

I blame policy makers who have refused to increase funding to areas when it has been noted that the population has grown.

Love your Islington and Chelsea remark, I live in London yeah, but I live in Enfield, way higher levels of immigration from all over the world than anywhere you'd care to list.

BTW, this GP stuff. Is this YOUR G.P or just getting to see a doctor, cause to be fair growing up in the North East I only met MY official Doctor twice but was able to see a GP on the day if I went and waited. Same goes now in London, same goes in the north with my mum's GP.

I like the assumption that all immgrants are paid less than the minimum wage, the majority will not be.

The point about housing? Umm that would be down to the fact that we have under built the needed housing for the UK for 20 years, that and the fact that the big four house builders land bank meaning there are currently 615,000 housing sites in the UK with planning permission that are not being built on. Why would they? Control the supply you get bigger prices.

The Rotherham gang? Yes misery was caused, but I don't think you need to bring that up here when we are discussing EU immigration, it conflates the two.

Borojo
Yes, training as a nail stylist is an attractive prospect. Not too difficult and one can make a living in a not too shit line of work.
But an individual can never compete with the pricing of the nail bars staffed with immigrant women. The pmises are tiny and crowded. The working conditions are not pleasant. Many, many of these establishments are facades to illegal businesses. One cannot compete with a comapny who uses trafficked women as their staff.
Besides, EU migration is pretty irrelevant to the nail bar business, goven that most of them are staffed with women from countries outside of Europe.

And you see were back on to the infrastructure stuff and it drives me crackers.

Your primary school is not full because of immigrants. Even in the areas where there is major over subscription 70% of student get their first choice. Nationally the figure is 87%. There has been an overall trend in the increase in the number of births in the UK only 1 in 4 of those is to a non British mother, and as non EU immigration is far higher than EU immigration its far less likley that an EU hild is keeping your child out of a school place. If there is its bad luck, not down to immigration being out of control.

"I like the assumption that all immgrants are paid less than the minimum wage, the majority will not be."
Yes, but it's not those immigrants who are well paid and living in Enfield that is causing the concern. You don't notice them. They blend in with everyone else, because they are like everyone else. You think because you have a high level of immigrants, everyone must have the same sort of immigrant, enriching the area with new food, experiences etc.

But some immigrants are exploited - particularly those from Romania, in my experience. They cause problems in the area, which isn't their fault. And it's always an area that's already down at heel - not Enfield. So the council turns a blind eye, because it's not their voters that are affected.

I find it difficult to understand how you can't accept that there are areas that have been blighted by immigration - not through the immigrants that we need, but because the Conservatives have done nothing to help the areas, and Labour denies there's a problem.

And so with that perfect storm, we get Brexit.

"I blame policy makers who have refused to increase funding to areas when it has been noted that the population has grown."
Yes. But sadly, not everyone blames the policy makers, and Farage has exploited this.

Well, how do people get the infrastructure sorted. The Conservatives don't do it - their policies encourage high house prices, for example. Labour says there is no problem. And if you complain, you're racist.

Ah, now there's a vote. You can't get the infrastructure sorted, but you can stop immigration. Vote Brexit! And so Boston tops the Brexit poll - but still people say how areas with high migration are pro Remain. They are in denial. And, of course, Farage omitted to tell voters that you can't really stop immigration. And Boris, that man of such high ideals, speaks of unity.

Anyway, I'm off to bed, and I'm going to avoid thinking about all this, as it's just too depressing. If only David Milliband had won the Labour leadership. It seems a lifetime ago now.

Umm, have you been to Enfield? Not down at heel? I invite you to come and take a look at the Island Village estate, or Ponders End, or come just down the road to Edmonton, or any part of Enfield on one side of the a10.

Nice assumptions too.

Did you not se the poster from above that said how actually if the government had acknowledged that Boston's population had incrased ( and it knew this from several sources) and therefore increased fuing it would have been fine and that immigration had positive effects on the town?

See you are desperate to blame immigration for the problem, but in the end it isn't. The problem is fear, now the Tories and their allies in the press have made Europe the bad guy for decades, and since 2004 have been bitterly nasty about EU immigration. It influences judgements, allows misconciieved preconceptions to develop and ends the issues of a small minority within a minority being used to demonise the entire populous, or make judgements on why certain things are the way they are, and then we end with a brexit.

EU immigrants don't steal people's jobs, they are net tax contributors, they benefit the majority of the communities that they are in, there are a minority which don't.

Also when you say Labour didn't listen, well yes it didn't, but because many of the problems that you are identifying with immigration are actually to do with austerity, and Labour spend 5 years fighting austerity, and still does, then maybe they were. The immigration fund should have been highlighted at the election though.

mass immigration creates poverty

mass immigration creates poverty

On the contrary, it is mass emigration which causes poverty. People leave, businesses are no longer sustainable, so there are no jobs, so more people leave, until there is no one left.

But let's be honest EU immigration which is lower than 150 000 per year net is not really mass immigration.

Yet more of the hyperbole which should have been dealt with better by the remain camp

mass immigration creates poverty

Absolutely wrong, and there's no evidence whatsoever to support such a silly statement.

But then, this whole mess was caused by people who refuse to listen to experts, or seek actual proof, data, evidence for their bigoted beliefs.

Immigration bids down the cost of unskilled labour and bids up the price of lhousing driving people into poverty.
.The businesses you are talking about Bumbledumb are the ones who 'can't afford' to pay their staff a living wage.If they did , they ould have no problem filling their vacancies!

It suits the chattering middle classes to label anti-immigrationists 'racist' because it deflects from the fact that the former have a vested interest in, nay create, inequality and hence poverty

If you can't afford to pay your staff a wage they can live on, you should not be in business. If as a government you can't manage housing policy so that everyone can afford somewhere to live, then you shouldn't be in government. Thing is, we have a government who happily encourage a very lightly regulated rental sector because hey, it brings in money to the economy. Never mind that lots of people get shafted and can't afford a decent roof over their heads.

The problems that immigrants have been vilified for here in the UK are almost without exception the result of domestic policy by successive UK governments - both Labour and Tory.

What on earth would we do without nail bars?

Why are people not more mad at the unscrupulous gangmasters and the nail bar owners who are profiting from underpaying their staff?

The next few months are going to be critical to getting a majority on how to proceed on what we want from the EU now and what we are prepared to compromise on to get it.

I voted leave because the EU stands in our way of maximising potential in trading with the rest of the world. I want a free trade agreement and that can only be gained by accepting current EU rules on immigration.

I have more in common with those voting remain tgan I have with those who voted leave with the main motivation of changing immigration rules at the cost of not securing a free trade agreement.

Thankfully, I believe many who voted leave didn't do so with immigration as their main motivation and that these leave voters and the remain voters will outnumber the calls for immigration controls at the cost of free trade.

And we know there is a housing shortage in the UK. Reduce the population by 10% and I bet the housing shortage is reduced.

There is a housing shortage in London and the South East. My council are advertising their council housing in shop windows, they are that desperate to fill them.

As for the skills shortage, one of our colleges massively expanded recently. They focused on adding building, construction and engineering courses and teamed up with a local uni to provide access to health care courses so that our children can fill skills gaps.

I won't bother pointing out where they got the funding for this from but it sure as shit wasn't our government.

We don't need to curb immigration, we need to invest in poorer areas creating new employement and education opportunites so that people spread across the country instead of having everyone crammed into one area. Something our government have consistantly failed to do, in fact they've not only failed to do it but they've cut vital services that help support peoplpe in these areas.

I'm expected to believe that now the EU isn't forcing them to redistribute wealth to deprived areas that they are suddenly going to step up and do it themselves?

I agree there's a housing imbalance rather than shortage.

Likewise immigration is beficial to the economy. We poach people who have been educated and trained elsewhere at their cost and they work here and contribute taxes and their labour. Then many return home so we miss out on the other costly phase of providing for them in older age!

Superb value for us

Joysmum I think that what you want is what most rational people want. Unfortunately what you want isn't what a hell of a lot of the Leavers voted for. I think that if we do reach a sensible deal which will end up incorporating some form of free movement of workers, then there may very well be rioting when a section of the electorate realise that they aren't going to get what they thought they would.

I didn't have a vote as an EU immigrant, would have voted to Remain, but I'm very much not blind to the many faults of the EU as it currently stands.

i think we have come far if the solution to the housing crisis is to reduce PEOPLE rather than built HOUSES.

why on earth is this housing crisis a problem only in the UK??? in such a big exonomy there must surely be enough money??

Unfortunately what you want isn't what a hell of a lot of the Leavers voted for

I suppose it depends on what circles you move in. I'm fairly highly educated, probably middle classed but still consider myself working class, and in mid 40's, my mum was born in the EU, my grandparents haves lived in the EU for over 20 years, my DH divides his work time between this country and another EU country where production is based.

Of course I know there are those for whom controlling borders was the main reason for voting out, but in my circle of friends we welcome the benefits of immigration and that was never a factor.

With 52% vote, it stands to reason there will be a centre view like mine held by leave voters which have more in common with remain tgan they do with extreme leavers.

It doesn't have to be many of us to tip the balance, but I think it's far more than needed.

I do hope you are right, Joysmum. My children have been bullied at school and taunted with 'you're going home'. My bubble at work and socially is very middle class, but our town definitely is not. The atmosphere is unpleasant, racism has become acceptable.

pointythings

I wish I had a magic wand to make it all better and bring this to an end for you and everyone else suffering.

The sooner this country crack on with finding the direction to go forwards in and the majority of us stands together and shows these people their action aren't tolerated and will be ridiculed and demonised for it the better.

Friend of mine runs a hotel. It is mostly staffed by Poles and East Europeans. Why?

Because there are the ones who walk in and ask if there are any jobs going. It seems the local school leavers want to do meejha studies and be soap stars.

How much does your hotelier friend pay? Enough to live on?