#2 Anyone feeling worried now?

[nearlyhellokitty]

Link to the previous thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/eu_referendum_2016_/2656228-Anyone-else-really-worried-now

Seems like it was a useful threat started by MrsBlackthorn and it hit the big 1000 so I took the liberty to restart it!

Original post:
My work has started quietly drawing up contingency plans for if Brexit happens. Same at DH's work. Could mean lots of jobs moving to Germany and Ireland at both our firms. We're already seeing far fewer people investing or spending money.

I'm bloody terrified. Could lose my job. House could end up in negative equity. And for what?

I don't even think it's "project fear" from the government anymore... News today showed investors are taking money out of the UK faster than anytime since the crash. People with "skin in the game" voting with their money.

I understand that for lots of people the EU referendum isn't about money. however, because of a lot of it leaving, stopping coming in, or just simply being worth less... Well that leaves us screwed for a very long time. Fewer jobs. Less tax money coming in - so less money for the NHS and so on. So even if we 'take back control', of what exactly. what will we be 'in control' of?

I'm really worried about "Leave" happening and me and my family being utterly f*ed in a few months time as a result. Has the country lost its mind?

Anyone else worried about where this leaves us?

That's precisely why I'm not worried Kitty as far as I'm concerned either way a massive FURBAR is going to happen over a referendum that shouldn't be talking place, and is only happening because Shiny Dave wanted votes.

The changes we need to happen to improve our country need to happen either way....

Better border control
Investment in affordable housing
Aiding the NHS
Providing better pay rather than benefit top ups through better employment law
The list goes on and on

However, can anyone 100% tell me HOW these things will be achieved whether in or out? No.

Things aren't good now, they won't be great in the aftermath of such a close referendum.

I just want it over, then let's weather the storm and those serious about social change can continue cracking on trying to make a difference. And those people ain't the shouty people in the media.

I can tell you that all of the above will be negatively affected by a BREXIT. The question is how long for...

Yes, but I can tell you that someone else will tell me categorically that they will be negatively affected by Remain too

Then I'd get buried under statistics from both sides.

Think of it like climate science - the majority of 'experts' say that leaving poses the greatest risk. Of course there is a minority that would contest that and start waving the hockey stick graph around. But despite all the figures there is a consensus that leaving is by far higher risk.

You can ignore it, but it doesn't take away the fact the other people have strong feelings on it. It still needs to be addressed once and for all along with everything else.

Democracy is somewhat irritating like that. Bloody people wanting choices

I am finding it hard to sleep thinking about this: I think the economic consequences will be dire. But I'm also worried about the breakdown of the rest of the EU if it happens - the biggest political change in our lifetime during a period when we need strong alliances to face common problems . I do understand that people are worried about immigration. I think a lot of people don't like their cities changing. But my fear is this: I am a second generation immigrant. But I am brown and identifiable as not ethnic British , as are my children. When will be ever be accepted? How many generations of being good citizens and paying taxes and being law abiding and supporting local communities. It's all very well to be anti European immigration but where does it end ? It feels like the flood gates have opened here and it's scary, especially when you can't hide your skin color

Thanks Mother. Honestly I am a mess. This feels very very personal even though I am not an "immigrant". I think many people who naturally would be Labour voting left leaning have been convinced of brexit bc of this issue. Many people in my community are uncomfortable with the high levels of immigration too. Me personally? Yes, sometimes it fucks me off that someone who is white European can be here for five years and blend in and generally accepted whilst my family could be here for five generations and still be told to fuck off back to my own country. ( this has happened by the way). Nevertheless I liked Europe - it gave me a sense of a bigger post- national identity, more options. I think the remain campaign has been dire about explaining how they will institute sensible immigration policies - I still don't know if anyone has an answer to this. It's awkward bc the Tories have had eight years to address this and haven't at the same time cutting public services . I truly feel that some of the voices from Brexit- may seem very reasonable now, but if you are a person of colour - j have no doubt that the tide will turn against us very very soon. Agree with dragons : this shouldn't have been a choice - cheap Tory move

sorry to hear that ohdo.

Am also feeling pretty concerned after the webchat with Andrea Leadsome. I really hope there is more understanding in leave of what they are dealing with than she showed...

Someone I know got very upset when they used the phrase 'brown muslim' in conversation and just couldn't understand why this was a problem and why I picked up on it. Brexit has made this legitimate and ok to say openly and without thought as to what it actually means and what is really being said.

I don't have a problem so much with many of the Brexit arguments, but the underlying tones and language increasingly bother me hugely. Ohdogoaway I have no idea how I would feel in your shoes other than afraid.

I'm scared.

I don't think it matters how the vote goes now. Pandora's box has been opened. We won't fall off the cliff on 24th June. I think we all stumbled blindly into the dark a while ago.

It's awkward bc the Tories have had eight years to address this and haven't at the same time cutting public service-while giving tax breaks to others.

Its interesting about acceptance, in my home town, very white, conservative strong hold. My parents (both white) dad had lived there his whole life as had parents etc so was deemed a local but my mum dismayed that she was still not seen as a local after twenty years and she only came from the adjoining county!

I'd hope that attitudes change ohdogoaway as people get more exposed to different people etc. but this foreigner bashing in the older generation hasn't moved on much from 'rivers of blood' from the windrush.

Thanks Red, Nearly and Dad. It's not that I don't understand where people are coming from when neighbourhoods change . But that's the way of the world - it's globalized, traveling is easier, we are more exposed to others. This is, imo, a good thing. Leavers keep going on about immigration from the commonwealth- what many mean is white people from Australia and NZ. Not brown people from Pakistan and India, or black people from African commonwealth countries with "different " cultures , religions . Some may not want to share a beer with you at your local pub some may have some "funny traditions " but that doesn't mean they don't want to belong. That they aren't human beings who have something to offer. I am having a hard time believing this doesn't boil down to race, much as I wish it wasn't .

It's so distressing - you are right - whoever said it - about Pandora's box. The Tories should never have started this. I'm sure they never intended to - and that it was one of the manifesto commitments to be given away in the coalition that never was.

There is something deeply hubristic about the way it has taken on a life of its own, right out of their control - and awakened so much latent unpleasantness.

I actually wonder about the mental health of DC. He did well during the Farage night, keeping it together, but the mental agony must be pretty huge - knowing he is responsible for tipping us all over into an abyss. History won't be very kind, that's for sure.

Am also feeling pretty concerned after the webchat with Andrea Leadsome. I really hope there is more understanding in leave of what they are dealing with than she showed...

Was it lack of understanding, or was she being deliberately misleading? I couldn't tell. Either way it's concerning.

Blimey. £30bn wiped off the FTSE today - a lot of it off people's pension funds - today by Brexit fears. That's 3.5 times the annual cost of EU membership. In 10 hrs.

And it's not even started yet. This could get very, very nasty indeed.

I thought China was now the richest country if you go by GDP?

chalalala I was trying to be diplomatic. But yes. Lack of understanding or wholesale repetition of key speaking points despite their weakness or lack of actual relevance to the question.. These politicians they be trained for not answering questions!

Yes and the FTSE will be up tomorrow. There's nothing to panic about.

Once we've Brexited, after the initial turmoil, it'll all settle down.

I'll be checking the FTSE tomorrow thick

how long do you estimate the initial turmoil to last bearing in mind it might take 10 years to negotiate trade etc?

I reckon 2 years.

In the meantime Dh made some money on the FTSE today. It's easy to read. Certainty vs uncertainty. It'll rally.