Would like to chat about Less

[WhitegreeNcandle]

So, I’ve just read Patrick Grants book Less and found it really thought provoking. I’ve never bought from places like SHEIN but I had been trundling along thinking I was doing ok. Since reading it I’ve realised how much tat we are surrounded by and I don’t want to be a part of it any more. I hadn’t realised how insidious it’s become really. It’s not just the quality of stuff it’s about how the economy could work on a quality scale.

Would love to just chat about easy swaps to make. Preferably cheap ones and it is a more expensive lifestyle I think. I went into our local refill shop yesterday and found there is a local company who do cleaning refills. Manufactured within 20 miles of where I live, reusable glass bottles etc.

So I’m still living without a tablecloth as I can’t find one!

Today’s two ethical dilemmas.

1. DD wants one of those freestanding make up mirrors for Xmas. What on earth could I get her that’s well made and fits the bill. Everything I’ve seen so far is Chinese tat.

2. I was up early this week and saw Milk and More deliver in our village. I wonder how much better for the environment having milk in glass bottles is? I used to have it but stopped when we moved house. Now I’m shopping more at the greengrocers etc it would be handy to have it delivered

Do you need to get a wipe clean tablecloth?

We bought some of the padded heat protector stuff which can be wiped clean and which has lasted for about 20 years now. We then just use a fabric cloth on top of that. Duvet covers make great tablecloths and are very easy to make.

Thanks @user0507 we live in a farmhouse where 3 meals a day with kids are eaten at the table plus crafts and visiting reps with tea etc so it gets a lot of use. I think if I use a tablecloth I’ll just be washing it 3 times a day. I like the idea of making on from an old duvet cover - I might do that because then if it doesn’t work I haven’t wasted anything

Honestly I would just get the wipe clean tablecloth. It’s not like you’re planning to use it a few times and then throw it away. Just find a decent quality so it’s still going strong in 10 years rather than needing to be replaced in 2.

As for the make up mirror just get something as neutral as possible so she doesn’t want to replace it when it no longer matches her decor.

Thing is they only last about 6 months before getting ripped and tatty!

I’ve had milk delivered by Milk and More for 15 years. I won’t deny it’s expensive particularly as I get organic, but the quantity of plastic that we’ve saved must be phenomenal. Also don’t have to go to the shops as often.

My drive for less continues. This week I have swapped to milk deliveries. Love it already - just like the feel of glass rather than plastic. It is more expensive - significantly so but already noticing DH isn’t chugging down half a pint at bedtime. I’ve started with Milk & More but chatting on our village facebook page has turned up a local dairy that’s been delivering here for donkeys years and is much cheap per than M&M. Most of the oldies seem to use it and I think quite a few of us young ones will be sigining up. So that’s one small local business being helped.

Also Shopped at our town market on Friday. Again, more expensive but for example, the piece of fish I bought which was a bone shaking £16. The fish man could tell me where it came from, when it was caught and there was no plastic. It’s also make enough for 3 family meals for 4 (I turned it into fishcakes). So for a bit of effort it was actually ok. When I balked at paying £5 for grapes on the green grocer stall he let me try one and they are 5 times nicer than supermarket grapes. Also got to have a nice chat and pop to the library at the same time.

I appreciate I’m lucky to have the time to be able to do this but it was only 20 mins out of my day. I’d probably have spent 20 minutes doing an online shop and I felt much better having been outside chatting to people.

Still haven’t bought any new clothes since reading the book. Have bought DD some school socks she needed off Vinted and accessories for an 80’s outfit she needs for school.

DH is nervous this will cost
s fortune. kids aren’t keen as they are tweens and shiny plastic things advertised on You Tube are still very cool to them

Well done on the milk op. We use a local milkman - have always been impressed with the reliability and there have been a few times over the years when the supermarkets have had supply problems but he has kept it coming. Over 20 years we must have saved a lot of plastic bottles.

I agree, Countess - our milkman lives locally and the cows are 4 miles up the road. The 'food miles' are so small compared to the supermarket, it's money going to a local family-owned farm and there's not plastic.

Worth a bit more per pint for all that.

I see a lot of make up mirrors in charity shops. All sorts from old wooden ones to new ones still in their boxes. I guess they are given as presents and not wanted. Even if it's made in China it won't be bought new and could have gone to landfill.

Fans of Hannah Hauxwell might also be interested in Hope Bourne. She was a wonderful lady from my part of the world who lived a fabulous, frugal, close to nature life and wrote and drew beautifully. www.theguardian.com/environmen0t/2025/aug/26/life-of-exmoor-nature-writer-hope-bourne-recognised-with-ex0

I disagree that buying cheaply means your things won't last. I only buy cheaply, our dining table and chairs, tv unit, and side tables are all from Ikea, we bought them when we moved in nearly 25 years ago. I buy almost all my clothes from Primark and every thing has lasted better than the stuff i bought from Next in the sale last year - jumpers all bobbled or went clumpy. Not that next is hugely expensive but it definitely wasn't worth paying more for. I still have jumpers from other cheap high street shops that have lasted 20+ years.

I also love my eco egg for washing. I hate the disgusting chemical perfume of washing powders and liquids, this is so much nicer. I wear things as many times as possible before i wash them though.

What I don’t understand about this is underarm stains / ingrained sweat. My DH buys good quality cotton shirts but they end up needing replacing because of yellow marks under the arms, way before the rest of the shirt has worn out.

re Primark, I find their stretch crew t shirts vastly superior in quality to eg M&S, and I’ve had some for over a decade which still look good.

@SeaAndStars thank you for that, I’ve never heard of her and she sounds fascinating.

My daughter’s homework this weekend was to ask an old person what their experience of technology was as a child. We had 85 year old Grandpa over for lunch and she quizzed him. It was fasicinating. He didn’t have electricity till 1954 when he was 14. Up till his mid teens water came from a well and he went to bed with a candle. Living on a farm says he went to school for a rest. He described working a threshing machine and what his first combine was like. We’ve never spoken about these before and it was absolutely fascinating.

It boils my piss when people have double garages but have to park their car on the road as the garage is crammed full of unnecessary shit!

This is likely to be something he is using i.e. the type of deodorant. The yellow is caused where sweat reacts to aluminium and so if you use a deodorant without aluminium it shouldn't happen. It can also be dietary.

Why?

We've got a (single) garage that mycar is never in. The garage has our (4) bikes in as we try to always walk or cycle if the journey is under 2 miles. It has our freezer, so that we can bulk buy and batch cook to prevent food waste. It has our camping stuff, so we can go on sustainable holidays. Meanwhile my car sits on our drive as I can't fit it into the garage.

ETA which of our stuff do you think is unnecessary?

@lostintranslation148 I also have things bought in IKEA donkey's years ago and also some really old clothing items. Perhaps not IKEA, but for sure many clothes and furniture items were much better made 20 years ago. I have belts, bags and jumpers I bought in White Stuff in the early 2000s and they're as good as new. The quality of their clothes now is nowhere near as good as it was then.

@AnnaQuayInTheUk Just had to say - brilliant user name.

It also happens around his collar and on his pillow and he doesn’t use deodorant on his neck, so I don’t think it’s just his deodorant.

Thanks, I'm quite proud of it myself!

I’m not trying to have a go at you or single out Primark in particular but if you had read the book we are discussing you would understand that the growers of cotton and the makers of a cheap T-shirt are paid pennies for their labour. That’s exploitation.

I’d be keen to know if there are any successes with yellow stains - it’s a problem here too.

Quite pleased with yesterday’s food plate - sausages from less than 50 miles away and potatoes, onion, leek and cabbage all from our county and a farm shop.

This weeks purchases are DS has outgrown his school trousers. There is a second hand shop but I’ve bought a couple of pairs that just don’t fit and it’s only open during the school day. Will try Vinted.

This weeks aim is to have a go at making bread. I hate the plastic bread bags but can’t afford £5.50 for a sourdough loaf.

Also starting to think about Christmas. Trying to get local thoughtful gifts rather than amazon

I’ve been making sourdough for a few months now. It is a faff theres no denying it as the rising times are long and you have to coordinate it with when you are at home to bake it. The flavour is good. Despite that I think I will go back to making regular bread though as it’s easier. Trouble is my family while saying home made bread is delicious still eat the white sliced in preference if there is any around.

I think sourdough might be a bit ambitious for me to start with @narniabusiness! I’m lucky in that I work from home and often have nuggets in the day where k think I could do the odd bit of kneading - and we’re lucky enough to have an Aga (run off solar panels these days!)

We've also had success with a lot of cheaper items and have Ikea furniture that is 25-30 years old that's still in perfect condition but in a way I'd quite like to actually fall apart like people claim it does so I'd be able to justify buying something new either because it no longer suits what we need it for, or there's something else I'd like.

Likewise suitcases, crockery and cutlery, plus probably many other items. Just about everything we have is basic supermarket or Ikea level so not expensive but seems perfectly durable and lasts for decades.