Would like to chat about Less

[WhitegreeNcandle]

So, I’ve just read Patrick Grants book Less and found it really thought provoking. I’ve never bought from places like SHEIN but I had been trundling along thinking I was doing ok. Since reading it I’ve realised how much tat we are surrounded by and I don’t want to be a part of it any more. I hadn’t realised how insidious it’s become really. It’s not just the quality of stuff it’s about how the economy could work on a quality scale.

Would love to just chat about easy swaps to make. Preferably cheap ones and it is a more expensive lifestyle I think. I went into our local refill shop yesterday and found there is a local company who do cleaning refills. Manufactured within 20 miles of where I live, reusable glass bottles etc.

MN advertising on this thread makes me laugh.

"Between 20 and 31 Oct, shop with Amazon Haul"

No thanks.

I also don't think that refill shops are necessarily a better option. To use the porridge oats example - Aldi sell UK grown porridge oats in paper bags. I doubt that a small refill shop can do that more economically or in a more sustainable way than a large supplier can.

(Also, how many bought Patrick's book and didn't get it online or via the library? ;) )

Was just coming to point out the same thing myself!

I haven't read the book but we generally try to repair our clothing as much as possible or cut it up to use as cloths when it is beyond repair. It is challenging to keep old clothing looking smart when you have repaired them multiple times. I wonder if Patrick Grant ever lets himself be seen in public with a patched up pair of trousers and worn shoes...

The King is well known to wear repaired old favourite items of clothing - some over decades. So Grant may well embrace repair & mend.

I have a wonderful winter coat - wool & cashmere - purchased from a charity shop a couple of years ago for £10. I've lost weight now so I am altering it, making some dramatic darts etc which will totally change shape of the coat but will make it wearable again.

I so agree with you about furniture. I have stuff that belonged to my parents and grandparents. All of it will outlast me. I also buy vintage or save up to buy decent furniture that will last. Having said that I did buy a very cheap IKEA wardrobe years and years ago as a stop gap until I could buy something better. It is still going strong!

(If you happen to be in the South Wales area, do let me know, I would love to pay you a visit!)

Thank you for the book recommendation. I think this is such an important conversation to be having -all the time.

We were just looking around our rather dated kitchen (in our rather dated house) last night, talking to our DC about how even choosing not to do something is a positive choice for the planet: when we choose not to rip out and replace our 80s pine kitchen or even older bathroom suite, both of which are in perfectly good working order, it's a win for the planet. So we make a point of squeezing the last little bit of 'use' out of everything, and then replace with a second hand version.

On the subject of laundry, cleaning and hygiene products, I think there is a lot of performative cleanliness going on, and, as a PP said, people cleaning stuff for the sake of it. We say only 5 things go into the laundry basket after a single use: socks, knickers, flannels, anything with a stain that can't be spot-cleaned and the bastard compulsory branded polycotton school shirts our teen DC wear which reek at the end of the day, despite exemplary personal hygiene. Everything else is hung back up to be re-worn. We do 2 loads of laundry per week, 3 on alternate weeks to include towels and bedding.

Bar soap to replace pumps and bottles is such an easy win. Flannel washes instead of showers or baths, hair washing when actually needed. Teen DC still buy 'products' and toiletries such as make up and hair masques and I don't try to police that, I think it's part of growing up. They know it's not the 'gold standard' for environmental stewardship, but there is something to be said for exploring that dilemma and arriving at one's own conclusions.

We clean the house on a Saturday and use water, vinegar and washing up liquid. Rags made out of DCs old primary school polo shirts -they've probably lasted a decade, and were second hand to begin with.

We buy most things second hand, whether it's kitchen ware, our phones, clothing, instruments, tools, appliances, furniture, bedding: there is such a huge 'used' market for literally everything, there really is no need to buy new stuff. If I see something I like the look of or think we need, I have a hunt on Vinted, eBay or a local FB group and always manage to find either the very same item or a close match. As someone with 'expensive tastes', I'm able to wear the brands, cuts and fibres I love without the environmental impact.

Less for the win!

I love bar soap but live in a very hard water area so it's a no-no - the scum is horrific.

I have bought all our recent major electricals as refurbs - generally they are "as new", come with warranties and are just ones that have been returned. The last 3 ones I bought were a Dualit 4-slot toaster, a Dualit kettle (vastly cheaper than brand new, and they are also repairable), and a Magimix food processor that was £100 off and indistinguishable from new. Most brands have an outlet that's worth a look.

I think the mindset of not replacing things until they are done is a good one, not just because you don't like it. It also makes me more considered about what I buy - trying to figure out if I still will like something in 5 years' time is important.

Agree, you need up bursting the pods and the product spills and soaks into the cardboard. They have the right idea but the execution isn’t quite right. Why put really delicate, pods of liquid in a matchbox with no opening

He was preaching to the converted with me.

And this is a big part of the problem. It's the people interested in reducing their environmental footprint who will read the book.

I have thought more about buying well made long lasting clothes. I have tended to rely on buying second hand and then quickly donating to the charity shop or selling on which is still going to lead to landfill in the end. Plus you end up with some plastic content.

@DeafLeppard I borrowed the book from the library. The library is one thing that must save me hundreds of pounds a year. I love their system of reserving books. If I read about a good book on here I can order it up without leaving my seat and the library mail me when it's in.

@Istheworldmadorisitme Patrick does wear patched up things. He lists his favourite things that he uses regularly and they include a sweatshirt his nan bought him in a charity shop over a decade ago, jumpers with visible repairs and his dad's old dinner jacket and ties.

I am hoping that the fact that lots of people will know Patrick from the Sewing Bee will be inspired by the book.

Can I do a shout out for the library to borrow online/ebooks and magazines?

I have adhd so the chances of me returning a book are slim to none-existent. But with the ebooks they appear on my iPad (2018 iPad mini going great with no plans to replace it) and disappear once the three weeks is up.

Some of my cleaning clothes are DS’s old terry towelling nappies. Apart from the fact that it was totally NOT the done thing when he was born to use terries, those nappies are now 36+ years old.

I use branded liquid cleaner for everything. Dilute it in a spray bottle for kitchen cleaner. Use soap.

buy as much as I can on Vinted and buy a “decent” brand.

Do put toner on my hair every now and again. so I’m not perfect.

Agree. Or at least the people who have a vague interest.

It’s an excellent book, I really liked it.
I do have issues with some of the things he claims about history, particularly textile history, as he has a tendency to idealise the past, but it doesn’t detract from his main points which I very much agree with.

Tbh the fact that enshittification has got so bad lately in the clothing industry particularly is driving more reuse and repair - I have started to use Vinted not to be virtuous but because if I can find something that’s 20 years old the quality will be better than comparable things today, as well as it being cheaper. And even if a repair is not perfect or invisible it could easily still look better than an undamaged new piece, just because the materials and overall making quality are better.

I get all our fruit and veg from Oddbox. It means less food waste in the system, less plastic, we get plenty of variety and the cost is decent too.

I had a gorgeous jacket in the late 80s. I loved it. It was from benetton. Unfortunately it got nicked in a club in 1993.

I bought the exact same jacket on vinted a few weeks ago. It wasn't my jacket clearly but it was the same one. Its obviously been well looked after but the fact that it's still around and in good condition says a lot about the quality.

Has anyone got any recs for a book to learn to sew/repair clothes? I am haunting gumtree for a sewing machine.

something that’s 20 years old the quality will be better than comparable things toda

So true. I volunteer in a charity shop and some of the best-made things are from defunct 90s brands like Richards Shops, Tammy Girl / Etam, The Sweater Shop. Not always what you'd want to wear in 2025, but such good quality compared with these days.

Milk from the milkman. I have it in glass bottles so they can be reused.

We have gone backwards in so many ways during my lifetime I can always remember my father saying that his mum used to go to the shop (in the 1940's) with a bag and what she purchased for dinner just went straight into the bag. No plastic.

Youtube videos are very good for sewing techniques imo.
I have one of the Sewing Bee books and it’s fine but tbh my MIL’s old Readers Digest one has been more useful - old ones tend to be very thorough.

Also, I haven't used washing power or fabric softener in any form for decades (prompted by my skin condition).

I use laundry balls, they are great.

Thank you.

Exactly.
The most interesting thing I saw in Dartmoor Prison Museum (other than an impressively convincing gun made out of soap) was a 1980s uniform for flight risk prisoners. It was basically just a brightly coloured track suit, but omg the weight and quality of the cotton jersey it was made from 😮
Even top of the range casual wear these days is flimsy and poor compared to what this was made from.

YouTube has lots of great sewing technique videos.

I agree re sewing books - nothing has really changed re sewing machines/sewng so older/2nd hand sewing technique books will be fine.

To learn sewing you need to learn how to operate your machine, & then techniques of sewing. Its a fun process, fraught with error & frustration - like learning any thing there will be mistakes, but then you start to wear clothes you make/repair/alter etc and its fabulous.