I have become so bitter

[earlypondering]

My dad died of dementia after a lifetime of drinking way too much - was a hard last few years. Now I care for my elderly mum is disabled - severe COPD from all the Marlborough reds & osteoporosis

Yesterday my father in law announced he has lung cancer - in the 25 years I have known him he has eaten & drunk to excess, vaped & never exercised (mother in law same)

I have just been totally unmoved by his diagnosis- you can’t be surprised with lifestyle choices like that - my brain just jumped to “great, now my husband will have to run around after them whilst I have my. Mum” - I’m quite shocked at how cross I feel

I think I’m actually burnt out from it all and this level of a apathy is some kind of way of coping, underneath I’m so mad we have to manage all this whilst trying to raise our own children, work full time & keep ourselves healthy to stop the cycle - exhausting

But it doesn't work like that

I have every sympathy for your position

I try not to post on here because it makes me even more depressed about my situation

Which is ... my mother always looked after her health. She has had some big problems and recovered extraordinarily well - like no one can believe it.

So she's still a burden to me at 87. Looking after your health doesn't mean that you aren't going to have age related decline. All it does is prolong it. I've been trying to look after her for eight years now. I've had one nervous breakdown. I'm trying not to have another.

She has a lot of needs due to her age and there wasn't a way for her to avoid that

I really relate to that feeling of being bitter, but in my case, it's more because... I should've been free by now

When I was a child, it was considered amazing if somebody reached their three score and 10

I feel pretty heartbroken, really.

Oh, and my dad looked after his health extremely well too - he developed a number of health problems because to a large extent that's life

In fact, after his second heart attack, we were talking with a dietician and he said to me "I should've eaten more ice cream"

I totally know what he means.

This sounds like my childhood, though I was beaten too. One parent died in their 50s as a result of 45 years of smoking. The other is in their late 80s, COPD due to smoking for 40 years, wet macular degeneration that's more severe than it would have been if they'd had regular eye tests ( they refused to have them) and wears the fact they never went to the GP for years as a badge of honour. I'm resentful and have to regularly step away to save my sanity.

I think my elderly people definitely have the attitude of “I’m going to get old and ill anyway” & therefore they continue to have a smoke in one hand, booze in the other & overeat! So I just cant’t agree with this attitude

I do hear the main parts of your post though - solidarity!

Are we in the middle of a generation that's living longer than ever? It certainly feels like it?

I shouldn't say this stuff and I have terrific parents. Even I'm tired of it. The weird thing is, I'm much closer to my mum than I was to my dad. But I feel like I will end up remembering him more fondly because he died at civilised age.

If mum goes on another 10 years, I genuinely expect to be dead myself - I realise age wise I'm not supposed to be but I just can't tolerate more of this.

I nearly posted because I've been away, lied about when I was coming back in order to get an extension of not talking to her, and absolutely dreading getting back into it.

Sorry that's probably a subject for the more general thread.

anyway, I would think of my mum is being a warning - if you encourage your parents to look after their health, you may just be encouraging them to live to 100 and is that what you really want?

Goodness knows why all of us over 60s don't just f off and die, since we have outlived our usefulness....

Most of us will eventually find ourselves in this unfortunate situation, unless of course by then medical treatment is refused for anyone who is not economically productive.

As with any human interaction putting oneself in someone else's shoes is a good principle.

How will you feel when infirmity hits unbidden? What will you choose to do? At what point will you see yourself as a burden? Will that point get pushed forward bit by bit as you age?! Do years of child rearing, grandchild care, financial sacrifice and hard work count for nothing? The scenario cannot be quite so crudely transactional, but neither can there not be such an element involved.

No-one wants this and, however an elderly person might try to not be a burden, sometimes it is impossible not to. Even if family are doing nothing, they still finish up with the burden of worry or guilt.

Very often someone plans for retirement and infirmity but their plans go away.

Are old people worst nothing?

Worth .... not worst.

If a young person becomes disabled or dependent and needs help do they lose their worth, become expendable? I spent 25 years of my working life defending the rights of those with disabilities and feel passionately about this.

I know how stressful it is to look after an elderly parent, as well as knowing what it is like to nurse a sick OH through early onset Parkinsons. It was stressful ... it is not what I would have chosen as ideal .. but it is life ... it is real. And I respected the individuals. We cannot have life as we choose ... we have to take life as it is.

Lobby for better care services, tap into every entitlement, ring fence your time so that you are not the sole carer .... but please recognise that one day this will be you .......

I think you have a very simplistic understanding of health and how much control any of us have over it. It’s not a linear equation: bad habits = poor heath in later age. There’s plenty of oldies who drink, smoke and eat poorly and die of something completely unrelated. Or live just fine then drop dead of a heart attack.

My parents have plenty bad habits, but this is the life that they enjoy. I certainly don’t think they are any less deserving of care in old age because they drink more than the recommended limits or because they eat chips too often.

if you don’t want to provide whatever level of care you are giving, then stop. Take responsibility for your own choices and for your own happiness, rather than being bitter and a martyr. The only choices you can control are your own.

Very simplistic solution to just “switch off” & stop caring for your parents if only it was that easy.

And this is posted in a space where many of us continue to do above and beyond whats required or provided by social services We are allowed to vent

They may try and guilt you into helping. Other family members may also try. Dont buy into it. Step back. Get carers, SS, etc in. People get infirm later in life sometimes regardless of lifestyle. You have a choice about how much help you give. Doing it, resenting it, and getting bitter, is no way to live.

Is there a well-known link between smoking, drinking and dementia? Because there definitely is between smoking, drinking and cancer. OP has every right to feel angry. Stepping away is good advice, but for your own self-protection…and why should OP have to pay for care?

I understand OP and I think you’re getting a hard time on here by some posters.

My DF had pulmonary fibrosis, never smoked, looked after himself, ate well and walked everywhere, because the last thing he ever wanted was to be was a burden to anyone in old age, and he did everything in his power to stay as healthy and independent as possible. I was so pleased that I was able to care and look after him in his final years, of course there were trying times but I knew it was just as upsetting for him as it was for me.

How would I have felt if he had abused his body, and took for granted that I would be there to care for him? I’m sure I would end up feeling pretty resentful. Caring responsibilities are relentless, especially when you’ve got your own family to care for too and work. You’ve had more than enough of your share and it’s no wonder you’re burnt out and numb to dfils diagnosis.

You haven’t described the level of care that you are doing, but it’s clearly having a big impact on your life and not in a good way. There’s a huge spectrum between doing absolutely nothing at one end and running yourself into the ground at the other end. And posters on here can help find a balance that works better for you, because you only have one life - why spend it feeling bitter and burned out by choices that other people make and which you can’t control?

You can’t change how your parents have chosen to live, you can only choose what you do in response to the situation. Simplistic, maybe, but also true.

Sorry, NOT altruistic

I have a similar experience. The way you feel is entirely understandable. People who have not gone through years of care, for people who knowingly abused their bodies for years on end, have no idea how it completely consumes and wrecks the lives of the family around. I have always maintained a healthy life, but I’ve switched it up a gear even more since caring for parents and parent in laws who spent decades drinking far more than the recommended amount, ate unhealthy food copiously, smoked, never did an ounce of exercise, and would openly scoff at those who did. Yet the speed with which they all were on the phone expecting me to pick up the pieces when it caught up with them was rapid. Not an ounce of care for my own life, needs, or that of my young children who at times barely had my attention for weeks at a time, whilst I battled caring duties. The generation before my parents, my grandparents, were much healthier for much longer because they didn’t abuse their bodies in the same way. They lived independent, heathy lives to late eighties, then passed quickly. My parents needed care from late sixties. I’ve been caring for them for over a decade, and it could easily be another decade. I ponder that I’ll probably actively care for them longer than they could be arsed to actively parent me. From about age 13 I raised myself whilst they got pissed in the pub.

I would leave them all to it.

You need to look after yourself and your nuclear family.

They brought it all upon themselves so just leave them.

I went no contact for exactly this reason. You can too.

@Mischance i'm not extrapolating my situation to anyone else though

There are many of us on here who have what is described as "dead parent envy". More fool me, I thought having one was going to be easier than two. Although maybe it is? I have no way of knowing how much of a PITA dad would've been if he'd been here.

I'm not even having to much of anything at the moment. Although my mother is constantly threatening to get rid of her carers. (to me not to them). I'm actually quite worried that the care agency will say they can't see her anymore, because she seems to be getting better and better. When we first employed them, she wasn't well at all.

there have been four 999 calls in the last year. No, I'm not very resilient. After years and years of this, I find it incredibly difficult to cope with. It's just repeated stress and it never goes away. I do find that some people just do not understand it and they probably never will. But some people have more of a caring gene, I suppose.

I did also have depression and anxiety which was diagnosed decades ago, in the days when it was still something to be ashamed of. So no, I don't cope with this at all. I no longer feel the need to apologise for that.

You ask what will happen when it's me - I don't have children. I don't have anyone. I am literally nobody's burden. Perhaps that's not a bad thing.

I'm not suggesting for a minute that people become expendable or whatever. I'm simply saying that I am sick of it.

i now understand people who move a very long distance away from parents. I've been away this week, I've even thought about it. But I do actually really like where I live. And I don't really want to start over again.

It's literally just wanting to run away. I mean, this could go on for 10 years. The past is depressing on this front, the present is depressing on this front and I don't know how long it's going to spoil my future.

I have lost most of my 40s dealing with my mum and that realisation hit me hard when I turned 50. It's so sad. I will never get those years back.

Someone will inevitably come along and ask "but what did you want to do with that time?" honestly? I didn't want any family obligations. I don't have a massive list of things that I've missed out on that I should be going and doing. And the world has changed too much since 2020 anyway for me to do a couple of things I would like.

So yeah - imagine another 10 years of this and I'll be 60

Or maybe I won't. There's a 50 something in the local area who died suddenly from cancer - her son told me it was very short from diagnosis to death. That lady's 94-year-old mother is still around.

hasn't someone written a book about this? I'm sure there was a book mentioned - by an Australian lady. I think she's in her 60s and she's saying how difficult it all is.

and no, I wouldn't want to go no contact with my mum.

It's good to have an anonymous space where we can say these things

I will go because @earlypondering I don't want to hijack your thread.

You're being unreasonable because you're under a huge amount of stress and strain; that's allowed.

Anecdotally, the people I knew who lived to a ripe old age with very few health issues and we're no burden to anyone around them were those who socially pickled themselves in booze and smoked like chimneys. And I have known plenty of people who take careful care of their health who have fallen victim to serious health issues requiring a lot of input from others to manage their lives.

As others have said, there are no inevitable outcomes (unfair as that is) so your anger is not really rational (you would be no less stretched and stressed if these people had lived exemplary lives but ended up ill anyway, which is perfectly possible) but it is understandable in the situation you are in.

Your anger is self-communication, though. You can't be all things to all people and you're no good to anyone if you break completely. Be kind to yourself and try to push through the guilt and discomfort of saying 'no' to what you can't reasonably manage.

But even with prevention, there will be a period of deterioration.

The body literally breaks down. It's a malfunctioning machine which leads to death. Yes, you can extend the life of the machine with perfect fitness. But the machine will eventually break.

I get that - my issue is all the bad lifestyle choices of the old people brings the care forward to a time when we are working full time and trying to raise our own kids through exams etc

My parents had me late too - so I have had caring responsibilities since I was 36 with my own little kids!

My parents did not have to do this for their parents

@Mischance your circumstances and attitude so very much mirror my own, right down to the "well if I die it might be for the best, but I'm not suicidal" type of thoughts .

as I tell my adult child, being old is no job for wimps.

But we keep buggering on because, what else can we do?

Ludicrous, inhumane reactions here. Life is harsh and unpredictable. Some choose to take the edge off with a few drinks and so on. The risks are laid out. One doesn't have to hang around helping out sick, elderly relatives although I feel it a dereliction of moral duty to do so if they have been decent people. Good luck for old age & infirmity for the judgemental types on here 🙏

Or maybe it's a 'dereliction of moral duty' to live your life without any thought for the consequences of your actions and expect your 'loved ones' to put their lives on hold and break themselves mentally and physically to deal with those consequences. Just another angle.
This thread is about feeling angry and resentful that people make themselves more ill than they might otherwise have been, not that anyone who had a drink now and then should be out on the scrapheap.

I believe very much in letting people get carers in if they need help. It was very easy for me because my parents were not great and I was already LC with them. Not living near them and looking after my grandchildren left me no time. Not that I would have done it anyway. No family pressure, siblings feel the same. I have one elderly parent left who is in a nursing home. I don’t really want to go into a nursing home but more importantly, I do
not want my adult children to look after me so the nursing home it might be.
Ladies ( and it is usually women) please don’t waste what good years you have left by taking on caring responsibilities. You are entitled to some good years after you have stopped working.