Appalling behaviour-dressed up as old age-it has to be addressed

[BlueLegume]

Hi all, having followed and contributed to several threads on ‘Elderly Parents’ I want to thank so many of you for helping me look at my/our situation. I won’t name check you just yet but you know who you are. This thread is not to be unpleasant about the elderly who are having a hard time. It is to address a very honest point that my parents have always been difficult. Impossible to discuss anything important with, always known better and having watched them alienate good decent people I am angry that they made no effort in life to do anything other than fun stuff for themselves and now expect me and my siblings to pick up their mess. It seems so many middle aged people have fallen foul of these ‘war babies’ as my mother still refers to her and Dad. Yes I accept they were born at the end of the war and they will have had to live in a post war country. For our mother that is all she talks about. She doesn’t accept they had the boom years post war which she has photo evidence of living it large in the 50s and 60s. She was an incredibly authoritarian mother yet after a few drinks would party all night. Always a case of do as I say not as I do. Now as I approach 60 I am wracked with worry and anxiety because she now ‘can’t cope’. It’s ruining life . I have all the therapy theories and have shared much of it. That said I am mad at the fact I am still dictated to or it feels so by her. Father is in a nursing home after a lot of denial that was what he needed. She will not have any help in the house so it is all falling to us. We are broken. My own family are fed up and rightly so. Selfish as it sounds I did not retire to look after a very unpleasant woman who has never liked me. I appreciate that sounds very bitter.

@HoraceGoesBonkers it just "enhanced" the watery and vile curry. Awful memories

@BlueLegume hope you are bearing up x

@Lexy70 thank you very kind. Having abit of a rough time if truth be told. Cannot see much light at the end of the tunnel I am trying to use a mantra inspired by @Mischance on an earlier post combined with the old Philippa Perry ‘choose guilt over resentment’ quote.

My Dad is in the right place is also a help.

At a loss as to how to help our mother. It is largely pointless too as every problem solved she brings a new one in. I considered shocking her with a social services referral but she won;t give her permission so I think it would go nowhere. It is incredibly hard as I cannot shake the feelings I had as a kid around her.

@BlueLegume You can't fix this by fixing her cos you can't fix her. I got to the end of the road with mine when we'd jumped through so, so many hoops to try and get Dad sorted in the face of her nonsense then she started up about herself. Which was clearly going to be another round of having to trail up and down for "emergencies" that were overblown and self inflicted. I did find counselling quite helpful to process my thoughts properly.

Last weekend for the first time ever I didn't go to a big family meet up - I was doing a sport I enjoy instead.

@HoraceGoesBonkers thanks and good for you. I have sorted some therapy out and am going to embrace it very firmly.

@BlueLegume It is very much a process that you're back and forwards a bit throughout. I hope the therapy goes well and your counsellor is nice. It might also take a couple of goes to find the right one - the first lot I tried were a bit of a disaster area as they turned out to be from a religious group who believe in honouring thy father and mother...

A huge thank you to all the people on this thread, which for the most part has been supportive and sound advice. I never thought a rant back in October would open up such a can of worms. I am sorry glad I know I am not alone even though at times it feels like that.

What I am taking away and into therapy is we are good people who get swept up into trying to help parents who are unwilling to help themselves yet expect so much from adult children.

I would love to say it’s all good now, and I’m fully relaxed about it- but I can’t.
I can however say that I’ve resolved my inner critic that demanded the impossible from me. That was one of the first and most valuable things I learned.

I still wrestle with actually managing her. It’s much easier now I know it’s not my fault, I can’t fix it. But obviously I’m left with a highly demanding, hard to please, hard to tolerate yet still very vulnerable and genuinely sad. 🤷🏼‍♀️

That too will resolve in time.

Just caught up a bit on this thread as very, very, tough day.

Thanks for starting this @BlueLegume because it is so helpful not to feel alone with it when my DF (who still has no diagnosis) is behaving utterly appallingly.

DF has been absolutely vile to me today and I’ve no idea what to do but I can’t keep on going to visit if it distresses both of us. I think therapy is probably necessary for me.

Huge thanks to you @BlueLegume for initiating the thread to start with. It’s been very cathartic and very reassuring that others know exactly what you mean when you describe these parents and the incredibly complex history and relationships we have with them.

My DH and adult children know exactly what my mother was like, and saw her in action, but it’s very hard when you have so many outsiders telling you how lucky you are to have such a wonderful parent, how I should treasure her and how charming, generous and special she was. When you have to stand there, smile and listen to the adulation and praise knowing this is the same person who physically and mentally abused you for years and that she managed to so successfully convince and manipulate everyone outside of her four walls that she was someone completely different.

I suppose lack of self awareness is such a huge part of narcissism, but I never understood how she clearly ‘knew’ how to behave acceptably and had enough self control to project the perfect image in front of an audience, but dropped all pretence within her own four walls and didn’t care about her own child’s emotional wants or needs. I was always dressed beautifully and spotlessly clean, but that not for my benefit, it was to show others what an attentive mother she was.

@BlueLegume you poor soul, you sound just done. Your mum has ground you down to a pulp. I'm so sorry she is the way she is.

I am having high drama too and I instantly thought of your mum. Dad had a TIA speech impaired, mum telling him to speak properly and pull himself together. Of course he can still drive!
I think your mum would be the same.

Please look after yourself and prioritise yourself. These women never stop, even when you are ill and have nothing left to give they will still feck about.

Much love and thinking of you xx

@BlueLegume @Lexy70
You may possibly know about this already, but my adult daughter mentioned FOG - fear, obligation, guilt - and when I looked it up, it makes a lot of sense regarding coping with these parents, things I wish I’d know and been aware of when my mother was alive. I don’t know whether it’s any help to you, but might give some pointers with coping strategies.

https://outofthefog.website/toolbox-1/2015/11/17/fog-fear-obligation-guilt

@JohnPrescottsPyjamas ha thanks - I went through a phase of recommending the FOG website all the time on here. Definitely need to revisit it especially the glossary - things have just spiralled abit in the past 2 weeks with further nonsense behaviour and it is so terribly isolating.

@JohnPrescottsPyjamas yes thankyou for reminding me of this great resource xx

@BlueLegume I know it is isolating but you aren't alone, we all get it. Please use us for support xx

My favourite post . I can see this is how my
relationship with my own mother will end . Just pushed a button too far and that will be it .

Yup. This happened with my mother too. One day I thought, I can’t do this anymore.

Almost seven years ago I also had a moment of clarity, put the phone down and never went back.
I’ve had a couple of phone calls and cards (I only opened one by accident -no apology, just ‘let’s put it behind us/life’s too short/you’re my daughter). Last Christmas I sent a card and a small present. Regretted it immediately as my nightmares and anxiety intensified.
My best friend has recently gone through hell with her own very difficult mother who finally died six weeks ago. Supporting her through it brought back the nightmares and anxiety, so I know that I’ve made the right decision.
The only thing my biological family want is someone to gossip and bitch about and who will support them both with help and money. They need to look elsewhere now!
As others have described I just reached a point where I knew that I couldn’t do it anymore.

This happened to me and I had three years of peace. Unfortunately I got sucked back in. My mother is currently guilt tripping me and telling me ‘we all love you’. If love means put down comments, rudeness and never acknowledging her own bad behaviour it doesn’t feel like love. It feels like abuse. She still manages to make me feel guilty and crap about myself though. My sister and she are in the same page and to be honest I cannot stand either of them.

@AskingQuestions45 it is horrible isn’t it. I feel like I am an awful person as I know I am no longer able to even be reasonable around my mother her antics are so strategic to mean we feel we have to help. I do think our inner child really thinks we might just have that ‘breakthrough’ if we keep trying. We won’t, ever. People like this cannot change and when you join the dots you realise they have always operated on a sliding scale of this type of behaviour. They do not mellow, they double down on the defiance, obstinacy and inability to see they are being helped.

I think we all have this eternal optimism that we can fix them, it’s just a question of finding the key - except there isn’t one, because they constantly move the goalposts, and the game is about them having control. They don’t want a solution, they prefer creating problems because that keeps us in the constant cycle of guessing and uncertainty which means they have the power.

@AskingQuestions45 I so recognise the overuse of the word, love.
”you do know I love you”
”it’s because I love you”
”if you loved me, you wouldn’t be so horrible” - that one was usually thrown at me when I stood up to her.
”you never tell me you love me”
”I don’t know what be done wrong except show you love”
It just becomes a meanness mantra in the end.

@JohnPrescottsPyjamas thank you - I need to stop looking for the key. That is so helpful as a way to look at this.

I had got to a place where I was just doing what I was willing to do, on my terms.

Now I realise, DF has just been upping the ante and I’ve got sucked back in to looking for the key.

@JohnPrescottsPyjamas ’eternal optimism,’ absolutely. I still hope that things will change, you know, a letter or a call that is sincere and authentic. It’s never going to happen. I need to remember that.
@AskingQuestions45 I am sorry that you got sucked back in. It is so easy to do given the intense social and cultural pressure and, as @JohnPrescottsPyjamas identifies ‘eternal optimism.’
We need to be kind to ourselves and recognise our own needs in a way that our parents, and often siblings don’t.

Unfortunately, DFs often seem to become their intended or unintended enablers.
I’m not sure if it’s because these people deliberately set out to find partners who are acquiescent and passive, although I guess anyone who wasn’t, wouldn’t be in a relationship with them in the first place.

I adored my late father, but he was totally beholden to her and would do anything to avoid confrontation or even standing up to her. He kept quiet when she was verbally or physically attacking me and used to ask me not to upset her when I was child of only 10! Only once he stood up to her when she was hitting me, and she was pathetic. She literally collapsed in tears and begged him not to hit her! My DF never lifted a hand against her and it didn’t seem to occur to either of them, that I was actually the victim of assault.

I look back with mixed emotions to him. I loved him so much but I am also sad he did so little to defend or protect me at the time. I suppose now it would be considered coercive control and he might have been just as frightened at the time as I was.

I'm feeling a bit down. We never replied to my mums message about presents - I was quite upset about it and I go through periods of total inertia with dealing with it mentally.

A few days ago the postman appeared with two parcels from my mum, for everyone in my household.

I opened mine with my husband - she's got form for sending upsetting messages. She's sent me a horrible pair of gloves, no note.

I'm now really not sure what to do about the other items.

I think she wants me back in touch so she can have another attempt at manipulating me into providing care. I just feel really unsettled about it.

It's my birthday in a few weeks and I think she's going to keep going with this.

Get them out the house this afternoon. Leave them for someone to find or drop them in someone's bin for landfill.
You don't need them repeatedly taking up headspace.

I have become terribly brutal when feeling strong but I've wasted days of emotional energy on 'stuff'.