Fil jeopardising mil care home place

[MafaldaHopkirkRules]

Hoping for advice. Mil has dementia and is at the stage she is incontinent and no idea of her name and who other people are, just a familiarity. Fil refused to get her diagnosed or any help until he became unwell last year. She had carers from the council but it wasn't enough.
Eventually last autumn fil had a fall and was hospitalized for a month and social services found Mil a home. The home said she was so bad she was moved somewhere more suitable not far from their home.
In the meantime fil was diagnosed with parkinson's and discharged from hospital. There house is unsuitable for both of them but he's determined to change nothing, stay there with no carers.
He's adamant that mil must come home. There's no lpoa and her social worker says this will not happen.
Sorry this is so long. However fil who shouldn't be driving as he's not informed the dvla that he has parkinson's is going to the home daily and taking her home and she gets very distressed.
The home called a meeting with the family, fil didn't come because it was too early!, and social services who said he can visit as much as he likes but he must only take her out of the home once a fortnight and accompanying by another family member. All seemed resolved.
Until last night when dp spoke to his dad and the same day as this meeting he went to the home and took mil back to his house for the afternoon.
If you've got this far, we're at our wits end. What is likely to happen? Will he be prevented from seeing her? Could she lose her place at this lovely home, council funded? And then what? Does anyone have similar experience? Tia

Can you not take his car keys away very quietly ?

I do think fil has some sort of cognitive decline but he was always a difficult character so it's hard to know

He's surprisingly on the ball if he thinks you're taking something. I suspect he may have other car keys cut. Car is about 25 years old

You’ve had to sign a contract saying visitors will behave themselves? That’s a lot of nonsense - how can you be responsible for a grown adult especially if you aren’t there?

Is there any possibility that your dad could also be in the home with her? It does sound like he is not making sensible decisions or functioning very well. If it was put to him that he can either play ball or find himself explaining to the police why he wants access to your mum (if, say he drives himself and has been instructed not to arrive at the home under his own steam perhaps he could be made aware that he won't be admitted for a few days while he gets the message) or live there himself.

@MafaldaHopkirkRules perhaps these people could point you in the right direction? 💐

https://www.ageuk.org.uk/information-advice/worried-about-someone/

Can you break the car so it doesn't start?

Because it distresses her.

If mil does not have capacity to agree to going out, is not safe, he is not safe driving and their home is unsuitable then if anything happens to her the carehome, gp and social worker will most likely be told they are responsible. She needs a capacity assessment, dols review, best interest meeting, cop involvement if needed and it might be safer for him to visit her there and stay all day, have lunch with her, join in.

Yes. And I imagine that's the kind of advice you'd be given. Looking at it in safeguarding terms is likely to be the most effective. But yes, it's something that social services save the home will hate having to do. Taking out a legal injunction (maybe?) to prevent him taking her home will be no fun for anyone involved. But they might have to.

In the meantime, continue to build your relationship with the care staff. Make sure they know how much you appreciate then and what they do for your mum, and how you really want her to remain there where she's so happy. If they have a responsive and appreciative relationship with the family, they're less likely to want to wash their hands of the problem.

If it reassures you, I had a different problem. My mum was in a care home where she behaved exceptionally badly (she has full capacity, but paralysed down one side). She was even, at times, a danger to other residents in her electric wheelchair, and was horribly abusive to staff. They still didn't throw her out.

He was so bad when he was in the hospital that it was suggested went on the waiting list at her home but he said he didn't want to lose his house and didn't want to pay which would mean selling the house

Could he spend his days with her in the home?

Advice apart, I just want to say how much I feel for you @MafaldaHopkirkRules . This is a total avalanche of care and safety issues that you're dealing with for both your parents. I really hope that adult social care can help.

Re the driving. Could you call the non urgent police number, and tell them you believe he is unsafe driving because of the Parkinson's. They might keep an eye out for him on the road, and pull him over if he's driving erratically.

Really really difficult. It stems from a place of wanting her with him and missing her but rigidity if thought with Parkinson’s. To the poster that suggests she goes home during the day, she is scared and can’t manage the house steps and there are no carers to feed her and manage her toilet issues.

Will he consider moving in with her?

i really think homes should have more set ups for rooms for couples to share or adjoining rooms. There seems to be a weird thing that couples have to be split up and weekly visits. That would kill me when I get to that age

This would be much more confusing for her. 😕

Because it is very distressing for her to be moved back and forth like this.
People with dementia who no longer recognise their old home are always better off in a peaceful and non challenging environment.

Being moved and having to travel every day will be seriously upsetting her.

This, there should be a general agreement with all staff and visitors about dignity and respect, don't get fooled by being told she can go out with him if another family member is present, they have a duty of care to keep her safe and its not your responsibility to supervise this.

What does he do with her once home? Does he take her back to the home? I thinkSS need to get tougher with him if he is not complying with the agreement.

He just resumes normal life and he sit infront of the tv and she potters about. He doesn't seem capable of doing this in the home. He wants to leave the moment he gets there

This is cruel to your mum, OP.
She must be so confused.

BTW did you know that the REPLY button on Mumsnet doesn't work?
To respond to a poster, click on the three dots and select QUOTE.

Please ask the care home and social worker about a DoLs order for her.

https://www.alzheimers.org.uk/get-support/legal-financial/deprivation-liberty-safeguards-dols#:~:text=What%20does%20the%20Deprivation%20of,in%20the%20person's%20best%20interests.

It might not work but it's a legal document that shows the limitations and what's best for her with her care as she can't make those decisions herself. One could be that she can't leave the home without a carer present (like for medical visits etc) which could put an end to being taken out as its distressing her so much and I bet they have a job calming her after.

In the mean time, report your fil to the dvla and ask the GP to do so too. He clearly doesn't understand the implications and is not doing what's safe or in his or her best interests because he just doesn't want to. If he continues with the DoLs and the dvla taking his licence there's legal steps to stop him then.

I think this has probably already been done. As it's dp's mother I'm not completely sure of everything that has been done legally

This sounds so stressful. Do contact the dvla yourself about his driving - the police won't do anything and neither will his GP. I wrote to the dvla about a family member with dementia who was resisting giving up driving and they then wrote to him cancelling his licence. They accepted it from the dvla much better than from me! Then maybe you can get him to sell his car and set him up with a taxi account. But that doesn't address him going to the care home and removing her every day.

It may be better to try to move them both into the same care home. This is difficult if they have 2 different medical diagnoses as they might be placed on a dementia ward but together, or on seperate floors. If you don't have POA for health and he won't agree then I'm not sure what other options you might have. Hopefully other PPs will come here with suggestions.

she wont be kicked out he'll just be banned from seeing her

ask him if thats what he wants-they shold be preventing him from taking her out not you