All I want for Christmas is ... Power of Attorney sorted

[Mum5net]

For those whose DParents haven't signed POA , Christmas might be a 'window of opportunity' to have the dreaded discussion and suggest that EVERYONE, daughters and sons included, all do their respective POAs in 2024.

Don't spoil your Xmas because of it, but if your elderly parents shows willing, make it a New Year's resolution. An understanding that they will help file the paperwork at the start of 2024 would be a mammoth Xmas present to everyone. Some parents may give grudging approval. Some won't.

DF and DM were rigidly in the camp that said they would never need POA; nothing would happen to them. It's now 8.5yrs since DF died; 13 months since DM. While DM was in hospital under section (out of control dementia), DF had an accident at home which resulted him being in a coma for five days until he passed. DM's care decisions were therefore taken by her local Social Work team until we went through the courts and got Guardianship. She subsequently spent over 8 years in care homes... From June 2015, every financial transaction on behalf of my DM had to be receipted and recorded without fail and audited via the Guardianship/ probate process. We are hoping for probate to be granted in January 2024.

DH and I did our own POAs in 2015.
Looking back POA would have saved so much effort and so many posts on this forum ...

It really isn't so easy in Scotland.

We are about to do ours when DS turns 18 so he can be the second attorney in each case. He's a sensible soul. I used to have POA for my mother but she had me removed as 'punishment' for going on holiday 🙄 (she's a total narc). She's now at the mercy of other family members as she has serious health issues and higher needs. I went LC years ago for the sake of my mental health. She'll probably end up miserable in the cheapest home not of her choosing as the others are all merely concerned about cost. There's a cautionary tale.

Please please tell me where. Life limiting illness forces us to put one in place but the £550 quoted by solicitors isn’t currently achievable!

It’s not only the elderly. I have asked both DS to do theirs on line over Christmas. Both cycle a lot and DS1 has a motorcycle. I might be going over the top, but had problems with DFs care with an old style POA so want to be certain should the worse happen. Need to nag DS2 about his Will as well.

£82 for health and £82 for financial, for each person - ie £328 for a couple.

In Scotland you need a solicitor. I think DH and I were about £500 in 2015 for two x straightforward POAs each. In the same year, DM's Guardianship bill qualified for £1200 in Legal Aid, although also needed a contribution from her of £1000, once we gained access to her funds.

It is, however, worth its weight in gold. When you don't have it you suddenly know its worth...

It's not always a difficult discussion. My parents did theirs happily at the same time they updated their wills. It often gives people peace of mind once it's done.

Yes, definitely. You can’t assume that a spouse will be the best person to ensure your wishes are carried out. You also want to be sure that at least one of your attorneys will outlive you, so it’s sensible to add a DC or a niece or nephew.

You can do it yourself. Everything you need is linkable from here. There’s a reduced fee for registration if you’re on a very low income. Make sure you download the guide from the page where you download the forms - it’s very good

Yes, this is so important. I have POA for both my parents and my husband, and a friend who asked me to jointly be her attorney with another friend.

DD1 has just turned 18 and has LDs, so we have to do her LPA forms soon (she has been assessed as having enough capacity to instruct an attorney to help her with her money, but not enough to manage her own money).

The forms are so simple and they even have a signature order checker, so you shouldn't go wrong.

Sorry, not understanding spouses doing one for each other? We are in process of doing with dd and ds at attorneys for us both - just need to get the money together. Words of one syllable please! Many thanks.

One example: If you have sole accounts, then you can only access that account with authority. LPA would allow you to access the money and pay necessary bills on their behalf.

You need to do one for each other unless you are happy that in the event of one of you becoming incapacitated, your children will be the next in line people to make decisions.

So you could be incapacitated but your husband is well, however the POA is controlled by your children if he isn’t named on it for you.

After dad went into care this year and I’m not certain we will be able to get PoA for him and might have to go down the COP route, we are doing mum’s, mine and my husband’s ASAP. We are early 40s. You never know what is going to happen.

My parents and in laws have them. DH and I have them, my 20 ish yr old DC have them. You never know when you are going to be ‘hit by a bus’ and might be in a coma for weeks. Having the LPAs makes everything SO much easier for everyone trying to handle things whilst having a loved one in a mess health wise. The standard advice is to go up or down a generation when designating the ‘attorneys’ as they are less likely to be with you if there is an accident and less likely to be facing similar age related health challenges at the same time. This was the advice that persuaded my elderly in laws to change from having each other as LPAs to having us as them

@StandByMode My father's assets are considerable, and we have qualified for extra special watching from the OPG based on this alone. And of course, considerable assets often involve considerable costs and associated maintenance, all of which has to be recorded.
While it's good that his assets are considerable, I don't envy the extra special watching. I would find that a nightmare every February! I never ever got DM's to balance perfectly in eight years and always got a pencil corrected copy back showing my mistakes, although the staff member who corrected them was helpful!

@SeaToSki and @Daisymay2 you have both prompted me to have the discussion with my 20 something DC, too. Thank you.

Yep . It's been the only saving grace in the last year that we had it ..

My mum has dementia and I have full control of her finances and affairs .

It's made a horrid situation a little easier .

We are currently dealing with it for my aunt in the same situation medically but no children or poa in place and gaining 'deputyship ' and sorting her care and getting the LA to sub us retrospectively is a nightmare..

Thanks for the reminder. We updated our wills few months ago and next job was getting POA sorted for both of us but then things kicked off with MIL and we didn't get round to it. A job for the new year.

We did ours a year ago (aged early 60s). Our adult kids also did them, as it wasn't a lot of hassle, and they saw the long term benefits. You can pay a bit extra to lodge them centrally with a government agency, so no problem about housing them safely

The POA forms can be downloaded and the filing for for each is £82. There are 2 per.person one for finances/assets and one health and welfare, but you don't have to do both.

We did pay for a will writer to do ours, and my Dad's, and she cost £120 for each POA.

Looking back we could easily have done our own but I'm pleased she did Dad's as she asked him questions and it felt very independent. We would have done the same but it felt more comfortable that way.

You can have more than one attorney and replacement attorneys. So you could have spouse, with child as replacement. There are complications so read the guidance notes. For example, if your attorneys act “jointly” rather than “jointly and severally”, I believe the LPA dies when one of the attorneys dies.

I just want to emphasise that the effort, financial costs and complications of setting up and registering POAs are entirely worthwhile.

Genuinely, even if at worst you take a day off work to sort it and get your head around it, (and it really shouldn't take that long), it will save so much time and effort if things do go pear-shaped further down the line.

View it as something that actually is as much for you and your well-being as it is for them.

If I was clever, I would do one of those illustrative graphs that show that by not having POA, the stress levels and the subsequent impact on your career/family time rockets skyward

My Dad chose me and my brother as attorneys but we can act independently as my brother isn't in the best of health himself and has spent considerable time in ICU when he wouldn't be able to act even if he wanted to.

Then Dad chose replacement attorneys of his adult grandchildren. Just to give the document a bit more longevity.

We chose each other as attorney and then our adult children as replacements.

@Mum5net absolutely right. ILs only set up one for FIL - he was convinced for understandable reasons he would outlive MIL. He didn't and then it was taking 6 months to set them up. That 6 months was a nightmare and we were paying bills on behalf of MIL. She owed is over £4k by the time it was sorted.

Actually @countrygirl99 you make a very good point, I had forgotten financial implication. We had DF's funeral expenses, the cost of emptying/renting their house. We hit £10k.
For those who can't get POA, one of the saving graces for us was that DF had virtually all their bills coming off as direct debits. So while DM was 'imprisoned - she had to reside at the same hospital address for the entire duration of the guardianship application- fortunately the gas, electricity , insurances, service charges or their empty house were all being taken from DM's current account, which we had no access to ....
So if they refuse POA, next best thing is try to get them to do direct debits! 😀