Steiner education

[alloveragain]

Can anyone suggest an appropriate forum in which I could talk to someone about Steiner education? We have our concerns about it, but our children are still at a Steiner school.
Thanks

thecaty it's the pedagogy. That's what we have to keep coming back to if we want answers. Individuals may be well-meaning, schools may do their best. But if you're going to run an education system on imo unscientific principles (not the least of which is even a nod towards anthroposophical medicine) you are going to be challenged on those principles.

Why are you talking about cults?

I have myself made many mistakes. That doesn't let you off the hook now. If you guys want to improve what you're doing, be honest with parents about the pedagogy from the very start. It may reduce your client base but at least no one could then accuse you of disingenuousness.

thecaty you wrote: it is at this point where the most skill is needed by both parties, including the path they choose to resolve the complaint.

It is true that Waldorf schools do not tend to have formalized conflict resolution programs or clear paths to follow as so often do other schools.

"If one party chooses the wrong path its up to the other party to respond appropriately."

And there is no wrong path when it is the health, safety, or well-being of your child that is at stake.

The children of parents with psychological issues would be supported within state schools. Our school works hard to counteract the damage done by poor parenting (due to alcoholism, drugs, neglect and mental illness) and we will inform the relevant authorities of our concerns whilst supporting the children.
Is this the case in your school thecaty?

thecaty I'm curious about something. You write to northernrefugee39: 'some one told me you have been doing this for more than three years'. I'm assuming you mean: writing about her experiences re her children's education. At any rate, she disputes your odd accusation.

Do you know the poster northernrefugee39? Have you been discussing her with others and if so, who? Will you confirm that you're an employee of a Steiner school? It's only something you've stated elsewhere on mumsnet.

shockers our school has reported one case in 5 years as far as I know and has had to consider a few others but decided not to.

restless
I made an assumption about how long Northern had been posting. Should never assume anything... any how she is or was an ardent poster. She said Steiner was a guru and suggesting lots of other unfounded stuff.
I suppose once she gets going...
Did you know that the PLANS website will be 13 years old in 7 days and boast 65.6 hits per day - 100 hits of my own. Wikipedia also makes interesting reading on PLANS check it out!

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Gnomesrus, when you wrote this, it brought me up sharply

"The best thing about being free is that although this year has been a rollercoaster ride of emotions, the children are smiling again. And that has been a long time coming."

I'm really so glad that your children are happy; (what you wrote just reminded me of our dc's when we pulled them out, their relief and recognition that we recognised, a bit, what it had been like for them.) It brought a lump to my throat.....

Answer to the yes/no question...you can see what's coming..no. We never got that far. We never got as far as any of them admitting there was much wrong; for a long time we were told that our dd was "winding us up" which meant we doubted her word. I feel so so awful about that; it meant she had no where to turn. When other children ( particularly the child of an anthroposophist ) said the same things, the teacher listened....There were rumblings among some parents that there had been problems for years and years, but so much denial.

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thecaty yes, you're right.
I was ranty when the shock of what sort of school we had unwittingly subscribed to hit home. No one should underestimate the sense of betrayal and outrage a parent can feel about their children's well being, safety and education being compromised; or for having been deceived.
But I've always been truthful.
What I do find disturbing is that you can be quite so insouciant about writing things that are clearly untrue.

Any comments about this post?

thecaty Mon 26-Oct-09 23:23:47
"Northern, still at it are we? has your genuine parent tag not worn yet? I give you 0 credit on the honesty and thruthfulness score. that is my vote! a sham, you are...I am afraid to say, from the bottom of my heart.
It is really sad to read the same old faces rambling on, guessing,... a wonderfully seductive but empty effort to discredit someting you once subscribed to. It leaves me with a twisted aftertaste, Northern."

You have consistently tried (and failed) to undermine parents on this forum, and as Gnomes points out, you then rather transparently attempt to backpedal. Some of the comments you made in April this year were quite incredible. (On those posts you also talk about your class, so it is quite obvious to people that you are a Steiner teacher, although for some bizarre reason you won't admit that on this thread.)

It would be wise to be careful about making false claims; since I've written about what happened to us, I've been frightened and intimidated by emails and having my name & where I live published.
I know of at least three people who have had death threats.
Guru - "A teacher and guide in spiritual and philosophical matters.
An acknowledged and influential advocate, as of a movement or idea:"
It beggars belief, tbh, that you are a teacher.

Gnomes, thanks
The irony being, of course, that people like thecaty and thebee, tizian, eva, whatever name, are incensed that because some of us posted what happened to our children, about anthroposophy, and tried to force some transparency and openness, we have become a target of their wrath, which is extremely unnerving. Just when they are pushing for public money for Steiner academies.

I see that mumsnet have 'cleansed" many of the threads....there must be links to work which shows Steiner waldorf in a bad light.

The only thing about state funding is that it would force them to be scrutinised I suppose; I mean, they surely would have to be accountable, and mention the role of anthroposophical belief in their curriculum?
How can they have a teacher training that is so much about anthroposophy and barely mention it to parents?

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Oh god Northern, death threats would not surprise me given some of the activities of those who seek to protect the Steiner brand at any cost, they really are trying to shut up every single concerned teacher, parent and student.

In my opinion this is closer to the behaviour of a criminal organisation than a school and surely needs urgent investigation from the authorities?

Hi Gnomesrus, glad to hear your children are smiling again, I read the article on academies yesterday with state funded Hereford Steiner school at the bottom.

Interesting response from its principal, Trevor Mepham, he said the school had come bottom because parents had refused to let children take the tests. "Parents in large numbers decided that they would not have their children sit the tests".

Do they really think they are above and beyond scrutiny? Two Steiner schools have already threatened the government with court action to gain EYFS exemptions, so it would appear so.

Hereford has also just been given 5 million pounds for a new building for their 300 students.

I wonder who gave them the green light?

"Calling all ex steiner/waldorf parents, please could you just answer a simple yes or no to the following question - were any of you ever made aware of this body when you raised your concerns or lodged your 'petty' complaints to your school?"

No. What a joke.

I have not contributed to this thread in a few months as all our troubles with some of the people involved in the Steiner circle in our area started up again and I needed to try and clear my head of all things Steiner for a while.

There are a couple of people on here who I was in contact with who I didn't reply to on email/phone calls but I am sure you will understand my predicament. It has been exhausting.

"Calling all ex steiner/waldorf parents, please could you just answer a simple yes or no to the following question - were any of you ever made aware of this body when you raised your concerns or lodged your 'petty' complaints to your school?"

Our answer? No

The bullying was denied, so how could it be addressed?
The behavioural problems? "Nothing we can do".
Well wrong, there was something we could do, and we did, we got them out and the kids are happy we did.

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Hi Gnomes and Alloveragain

I have experience of 2 Steiner schools and have also lived in a Steiner community.

TheCaty, does it not occur to you that the idea of a parent 'posing' as you like to call it would be a rather strange and time consuming pastime whilst looking after young children, holding down a job etc.

Believe me I never set out to take on the Steiner Waldorf movement, but you and your movements appalling behaviour leaves me with little choice. Many parents from the UK and elsewhere are seeking help and support that you and your movement are attempting to deny them.

I don't know of any other education system where a support group exists, do you? Curiouser still is when the website address of that support group has been written on here in response to a parent asking for genuine help, the education movement concerned demands that it is deleted.

In my opinion the behaviour of your movement and the way it treats those who voice their concerns is strikingly similar to that of the Scientologists. I wonder if it a coincidence that the former Scientology HQ were next door to those of Steiner HQ at Forest Row in Sussex?

And before you go shrieking defamation to MN take heart I have copied every single post and will be giving them to the relevant authorities.

I have also copied Barking's last post.

lolapoppins it's absolutely understandable you wanted a break from this, you must be exhausted

gnomesrus not a simple no, sorry! I always believed that Steiner schools were like a franchise, that the SWSF was a central representative body remote from individual schools. I also believed that they didn't have the resources to 'help' schools with anything other than leaflets.

*Barking^ you wrote,
TheCaty, does it not occur to you that the idea of a parent 'posing' as you like to call it would be a rather strange and time consuming pastime whilst looking after young children, holding down a job etc.

Well Barking, it seems it is not a pastime but a mission to me.

thecaty so what's your point?

I think it might be you who's been given a mission, if anyone has; to defend Steiner Waldorf by presenting a face to the world, thus showing Barking & northernrefugee et al for what they really are: entirely & persistently sane.

It's apparent that if you people had behaved better, you wouldn't be left alone on the troll-bridge waving your toy weapon in the air like a figure from lego Star-Wars.

Seriously: I've just read through the last few posts on this thread & it's the courage & empathy of these posters that strikes me.