Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Education

Join the discussion on our Education forum.

Taking DD out of school for holidays - been unauthorised.

194 replies

Bunch · 07/10/2008 13:41

Me and DH have booked a 2 week holiday for next May. DD is in Year 4 and DS in Year R. DS headteacher has authorised his 10 days but DD's headteacher has not. We realise now that we should have had the school authorise it before we booked it but its too late. Apparently it is the week that they have their QCA tests (whatever they are). I know it is Sats time but not until Year 6 so I didn't think it would be a problem. What would everyone do?

OP posts:
forevercleaning · 08/10/2008 21:04

Yes, that was us, ducking down.

League tables? I personally do not think those tables make any sense whatsoever.

You can read them from at least 3 different colums and each will put them in a different place.

If you look at the secondary schools league tables, you will find that many of the top public schools fare very badly. Why? Because they opt to take the apparently more challenging IGCSE (International) which the government does not recognise, although all further education establishments regard them extremely highly.

As a result the league tables are deeply flawed, so no, I take no notice of those.

Quattrocento · 08/10/2008 21:08

I'm not remotely interested in the issue of whether or not you can browbeat one school to capitulate.

But I am interested in why you are taking your children out of school and simply don't care about it. That's so weird!! Is your school really so bad that they wouldn't learn anything in two whole weeks?

compo · 08/10/2008 21:10

so what did you say to your children 'quick duck down, your teacher might see us, and unlike her we don't give a shit if you go or not'

I know , I know, it's not like that but how can you say later on 'you must listen to your teacher, sit down when she says, do your homework like she tells you to' etc etc

Blu · 08/10/2008 21:14

Spokette and Fivecandles - in general I agree with many, many of your points - but this particular OP is about a woman who does have the restriction that this is the only time that she and her DH can get leave from work, so I think it unfair to lump her in with all sorts of people who have more choice.

"Wondering what these jobs are that don't allow you to take any time off at all during the whole of July and August or the two weeks at Christmas and the two weeks at Easter or the Whit, February or October half-terms.

I have to say that I've never heard of this phenomenon before now.

TBH if you have young children you have the right to ask for flexible working hours and holidays that suit your family. Your employees have to give a very good reason why they can't comply. "

THOUSANDS and THOUSANDS of public sector or factory workers get no choice! My brother's job specifically excluded any school hol leave fpr anyone! (because the main busines happen during the school hols!) As others have explained its often 'first in, first choice of hols' on the rota. You need to spend more time listening to people in the real world! 'a very good reason' - yes, they just say 'we need you and we can't let the whole workforce go off in the hols. I thinkyou get your knowledge of employment practices from some nice good practice manual - not from listening in on many a manager's unsympathetic response to a request!

"Also, what do these people do with their children during the 13 weeks of official holidays if they are using up their leave during the school term? " - the OP is NOT 'these people'. She is someone who does not have the ability to choose hols in the summer. It's not about about money and entitlement for her. Were you at childminders al through the hols while both your parents worked? If they were able to atke hols during the summer then you got time with them!

Anyway, I guess it is no longer about the poor Op who got into this asking advice in a genuine dilemma and found herself in the centre of a huge morl rant in which she is responsible for falling moral standards (and worse!)

Blu · 08/10/2008 21:19

I would never tell DS to duck down and hide while his dad could be heard telling lies on the phone.

But so long as you realise you are teaching them to be top in deceipt so that they can run rings round you as teenagers, I guess that's OK!

myredcardigan · 08/10/2008 21:23

I do not take my kids out during term time.
All I'm saying is as a state school teacher teaching in a seriously deprived area of the country I do not take it upon myself to criticise parents living on minimum wage who take a holiday once a year at the only time they can afford it. Also many of these parents work in either factories or small businesses where they are unable to take schools holidays off. (Many factories have a first in, first served system for time off)

forevercleaning · 08/10/2008 21:26

To tell you the truth, we laughed as we drove past.

You seem to feel that we do not take our childrens education seriously because we decide to take them out during term time.

As some have explained, they are limited to certain weeks holidays due to their jobs. They want to and deserve to spend precious time with their children whenever they can and if this means taking them out from school and having quality family time on a holiday then so be it.

Doing the above most certainly does not mean that they are failing as a parent.

Our DC have learned so much during our family holidays which yes, have been taken during school times.

Let me give you a little example. Last autumn we were going to centerparcs in Holland. We stopped at Arnhem, and learned all about the war, visited a museum, visted some battlefields and war graves. Then we had a frantastic time trying various sports which we would not usually do, as well as learning a bit of a foreign language, using and learning the value of the Euro, just to name but a few things.

On the way back, they learned some french from the hypermarket by asking for various foods at the delicatessen.

Not exactly amind numbing week off school.

The education of my children never has and never will be placed entirely in the hands of the teachers at school. We, as parents are perfectly capable of educating too you know. It seems to me that some people believe that the classroom is the ONLY place a child will ever learn

myredcardigan · 08/10/2008 21:26

Blu, one of the parents I am referring to works in the factory of a leading childrens shoe manafacturer. Busiest time is the run up to each term starting, hence the no time off during school hols.

fivecandles · 08/10/2008 21:49

The leave thing I get - if it really is the only chance for a family to be together all year during term time then I think you'd be pretty heartless not to be understanding but I think ideally you'd pick the time to be as least disruptive as possible and be pretty apologetic to the school.

The finding it funny to lie to the school and not giving a shit about disruption I don't get.

'I do not take it upon myself to criticise parents living on minimum wage who take a holiday once a year at the only time they can afford it'

I think the thing I find difficult about this is that as I've said a holiday does not have to cost much money so if parental leave is not an issue and money is then I really don't have sympathies with a family that takes their kids out of school only because it saves them money when they could have a cheaper holiday or a holiday at home in the school holidays.

If I can't afford to go away then I don't go away.

It's not right to say that a family is being hard done by just because they can't go abroad but then the parents take off additional time during the official school holidays.

Saving money is not a good reason to take your kids out of school if you have flexible holidays and can go on holiday during official holidays.

myredcardigan · 08/10/2008 21:58

Fivecandles, I actually agree with at lot of what you're saying. I'm not talking about families who go to Spain rather than Cornwall. I'm talking about parents taking their kids to a caravan or camping in June because in August the price doubles and they simply cannot afford it. These are parents who we help out with school uniform too because they simply cannot afford the outlay.

fivecandles · 08/10/2008 22:06

Well, sorry, myred but if my view is that if you can't afford to go away on holiday then don't go. Actually there are a lot of campsites that cost a fiver a night even in summer. I should know because that's how I spent some of my summer holiday!! And if that's too much then stay at home and make bring the holiday there. I've done that too. And I also buy uniform second hand. I just don't see that you're particularly hard done by if you don't go abroad for your holiday every year. I've got friends who've never had a passport and haven't left their home since their dd was born but love their holidays!

myredcardigan · 08/10/2008 22:18

Well as you are professional and comfortable (we have both said we pay for school) you (and I) are not facing the same struggles these families are. For the £10 summer trip they start paying in the autumn term; 50p here, 40p there as £10 all at once is just not possible.
As I said, we are not talking about holidays abroad.

fivecandles · 08/10/2008 22:23

Mmm, yes I pay for school for two and that's my choice but that leaves me with very little disposable income hence the lack of foreign holidays and the camping up the road. In a field incidentally. Had a great time. You don't have to pay a lot of money to have a good holiday and if you only take your kids out of school to save holiday and not because you have to then perhaps you should consider other types of holiday or even not going away. Spending time with your family is the important thing - not going away.

HorseStories · 09/10/2008 07:58

forevercleaning How long do you think schools could allow parents to take holidays during term time if every parent in your child's class demanded this? Would there be no disruption to lessons then?

forevercleaning · 09/10/2008 08:39

HS - As previously said, If i take my child out of school for holidays, I take full responsibility for any education they would have missed. See post of 21.26 last night.

My children are not solely educated by schools.

fembear · 09/10/2008 10:01

ROFL at the picture being drawn of holidays being educational family love-fests. Aren't tetchy holidays (inc Christmas) one of the biggest triggers for divorce!?

forevercleaning · 09/10/2008 10:23
Hmm
HorseStories · 09/10/2008 10:33

I appreciate that the holidays you take include educational elements but where you go and what you teach them during the holiday isn't likely to to be inline with what part of the national curriculum is being taught to your children at that time.

Using your argument, it would be perfectly OK for parents to take their children out of school every Friday to visit a museum or or castle or if I collected my child early from school everyday to have her help me cook dinner and learn about maths and chemistry and healthy eating.

juuule · 09/10/2008 10:52

"Using your argument, it would be perfectly OK for parents to take their children out of school every Friday to visit a museum or or castle or if I collected my child early from school everyday to have her help me cook dinner and learn about maths and chemistry and healthy eating."

Well, actually,that might not be a bad idea.
But then I home-ed some of mine, so I would say that wouldn't I?

forevercleaning · 09/10/2008 11:00

snap juule

Oh and I know absolutely nothing about the national curriculum for the sole reason that I take my other children on holidays during term time.

Which is why one of mine is well on target to be sitting his maths and biology gcse at the age of 13. His education takes place outside of school, and incidentally spent the best part of 5 hours on a golf course yesterday, and today is enjoying a day out with his HE friends

But of course, the only education that can take plce is in a class of 30 from 9 til 3.30 monday to friday.

HorseStories · 09/10/2008 11:19

"But of course, the only education that can take plce is in a class of 30 from 9 til 3.30 monday to friday"

That is certainly not my opinion and I don't think anyone else here has stated that.

I am merely pointing out the logistical nightmare that parents cause to schools when they decide to use their child's school as a Smörgåsbord. It only works for the few, like yourselves, because not everyone is doing that. If everyone were doing it, the schools would be too chaotic.

My opinion is that you either home educate, if you're going to find the school system too dictatorial or you agree to abide by the terms and conditions of the school you choose to put your child into.

LindzDelirium · 09/10/2008 13:30

I firmly disagree with taking kids out of school for holidays, if you can't afford to take your kids on holiday in school holidays then you just don't have a holiday, it's simple.

I didn't go on holiday until I was 21!

forevercleaning · 09/10/2008 13:37

thats a bit sad LD

LindzDelirium · 09/10/2008 13:48

maybe, forevercleaning, but my Mum brought me up on her own so she couldn't afford holidays, and to be honest it hasn't done me any harm. I work so that we can afford school holiday time holidays, thankfully we only have one DD so not too expensive.

forevercleaning · 09/10/2008 13:53

Of course it hasnt done you any harm, I just think how nice it would have been if you had been able to experience a childhood holiday.

Its nice though, that you can enjoy them with your DD