Prep school admission test for reception class

[Sue9]

Hello, my DS is to have an informal assessment in November, for a reception place in 2009.

Does anyone know what sort of tests they give to 3 year olds?

Since the prep school takes the vast majority of their students at reception, and most get the independent school places they want at 11+. I am assuming their testing at age 3 is accurately predicting future performance at 11+.

I just don?t know what tests they will give him on the day. I really would like to prepare him for it if possible.

Could someone please help?

Oh you could have used my "Mabel" story from earlier. Feel free if you do a follow-up

I've heard the 'Mabel' story as well, squeaver. Is it apocryphal or did it actually happen?

I believe it did happen. Wasn't there myself (!) but the person who told me heard from those who were, iyswim. I'm in N London. It's a v academic girls school.

squeaver my ds at 3 yrs old could do all of what listed except the sequencing - don't know what that is! All natural and no coaching.

I do know someone who tutored their child for an assessment for a school that they had no intention of going to just so they could see what level their child was! Completely mad. No testing at my ds's school at all, which at any age before 11 is what it should be.

For once Xenia I agree 100%. All those are things that you would do with your DC in a perfectly normal, fun family way. There is absolutely no need whatsoever to get concerned about a 3 yr old test-either they pass it or they don't. If they were doing tests later on you would make sure that they knew what it entailed but you wouldn't employ a tutor, there was a poster a while back asking about a tutor before her DC is 7 when she is already paying for pre prep!!
I really don't know who you think I am Quattrocento-you had a whole lot earlier when you decided that not only was I against private education but that I had turned the thread into the usual private/state argument when I had done no such thing. I have nothing against private education-twice I have looked into it for my own DCs quite extensively. The first time we moved instead and the second time I got the school to meet my DS2 special needs.
To tell me to stop right now and that I know nothing about it is very unfair! I have a considerable number of friends, family and aquaintances who use the private sector. I know perfectly well that some parents drill or tutor their DCs instead of just telling them to do their best, you may not have met them but I can assure you that I have. My nephew is going through the same school from 3yrs to 18yrs. He has managed on his own ability and worked his way through to the age of 13 and I have no doubt that he will do very well at A level. He has done it himself.

I love the Mabel story!

Would love to know which school this was at (not for professional purposes as the article was finished ages ago - I'm just curious).

After I'd finished working on this I was chatting to boring someone at a kids' party about it and she said her neighbour had had her preschool son tutored for eighteen months in preparation for a fiercely competitive entry school in outer N. London (major clue, it begins with H and isn't Highgate). That was even more extreme than the examples I'd come across in my research for the article.

I am not surprised that you have come across examples theauthor-I will look forward to reading the article.

That doesn't surprise me about the H school at all.

The Mabel girls school is the Ch- one, not far from the other "H" school you mention.

Ah, I've heard it about NLCS. Do you mean the Ch school with the brown uniform?

Yup. Though it wouldn't surprise me about there either. I was told by someone who has boys but knew the mothers of girls the same age iyswim.

It's a brill story whether it's true or not, let's face it.

Didn't like that Ch school with the brown uniform, at least not the junior section. V. precious, a bit dull, and the head was oddly defensive. DD2 and I go to the cafe at L House once a week when ds does an after-school activity, and it's always full of Ch mummies comparing their dc's ORT levels.

The head of a nearby prep school proper told me that her 7+ entry is always overrun with kids who've been hoofed out of Ch and SHHS after being 'selected' at 4, so the system can't be particularly reliable. She tells them to go back to the schools that 'selected' their child at Reception and ask to see the SN policy and request that they put it into practice.

That's hilarious, frogs.

The Ch-mummies are the worst.

Our local prep school had 8 applicants for every place at the nursery stage. Each child was assessed (parents charged) when the school knew that most would be failed. They had a priority for siblings, which was not guaranteed, but more-or-less was implemented. The parents were often told that dc2 was granted a place but would not have been considered without sibling priority. Nice to know your child is welcome

Two children from our primary (years 3 &5) have just gone to the prep. Their father gained a promotion with school fees included. These children were not hothoused, just bright state school children. The prep school could not wait to get them, credit crunch here we come! They're not so fussy any more

An acquaintance of mine took her daughter age 3 (august birthday) for interview with headmistress at north london prep school. That morning she told daughter if she behaved and talked nicely to this lady in a loud voice they could go and buy a 'play kitchen' afterwards. Well, they walk into headmistresses office have a lovely chat and then headmistress tells daughter what a good girl she's been etc. To which said girl replies 'that's because Mummy says I can have a kitchen if i'm good today!'. Red faces all round and she actually didn't get a place!

Does "Mabel's" real name begin with an A ?

I wonder if some of the people who have been outraged on here would be equally outraged by the way my ds is being 'assessed' at his state primary nursery at the moment. Apparently it is a baseline assessment - something to do with the EYFS.

Rationally that must be equally outrageous but I suspect it's easier to bash the private sector doing it...

I am outraged about EYFS chipmunk-it was my reason for coming onto mumsnet in the first place-I wanted people to sign the petition against it. There have been several threads about it on here.

We're assesesd all the time in our lives. I don't think tutoring is too different from what parents do with their chidlren when they read to them and help them with homework. We paid for daughter 2 to have some practice with exam papers for the 7+ at NlCS (and she got in) simply so that she would have some familiarity with exams but all the help at home, having parenst who sit with you and are interested in your homework, help you learn your spellings and tables is the bigger element of "tutoring" and it's the biggest unfair advantage in the Uk along with having high IQ genes and no labour Government or state system will ever remove those advantageds unless they took children away from interested middle class or indeed working class parents and put them with drug addict and prisoner type parents. It's just how life is that some 3 - 7 year olds will have parents who in effect "tutor".

What we see masses of out here is parents (usually Asian and Chinese ones) who not surprisingly are very keen for the chdilren to get on - that's the whole point of emigrating in the first place who do put huge pressure on the chidlren. One boy in my son's class didn't want to go home one night last year because he hadn't got the mark he thought his father wanted him to have. The issue is whether that hcild is lucky ot have a parent setting such store by his marks and whether I damage my chidlren by benign neglect and not being at all cross if they don't get good marks.

I think you can be quite happy in benign neglect. I don't think anyone could want to have their DC frightened to go home with a bad mark (at least I hope not).

I don't actually know, alphabet, sorry

That's my reputation as a reliable gossip-provider torn to shreds.

Hi - I've been following this thread with interest and just wanted to share my views.

1. I am one of these parents whose 3y old is being "tutored" for assessment at North London Prep schools in January
2. Before you all raise your hands in horror let's just try and define what tutoring at this age actually means - daughter asks me "mummy, how do people make cars" - so we chat about it. At nursery duaghter asks " what comes after number 5" - teacher explains. At "tutors" daughter asks "what do cats like to drink" - tutor chats. A tutor is just another adult providing guidance to a child, satisfying curiosity and encouraging questioning - nothing wrong in that.
3. A lot of learning at a young age is by osmosis/diffusion/observation/interaction/play - the more children are exposed to different environments - home, nursery, "tutor", friends, families... the more they absorb - nothing wrong in that
4. Some learning does also need to be more focused/structured - if a child holds a pencil incorrectly it makes sense to say" can you hold your pencil like mummy does, look" rather than just let the incorrect grip continue. There's plenty of time to allow children to grow naturally but also focus their natural abilities
5. So why tutor - well the world is a changing place. Every generation wants that little bit more for their child than they had. My parents were relatively uneducated but worked extremely hard and gave me a private eduction which allowed me a professional career. For my children I want them to be great independent thinkers - and they will need to be self motivated and confident to be able to do this in the changing world - and I do believe life will be more difficult for our children in the next 20y. Even 5y ago for my other children the "tutor" scene was not so big - but many parents are looking to the future rather than just the here and now - tutoring is just one part of the equation - and does no harm

I really can't see why you need a tutor for any of this, it is surely what good parenting is all about? You talk to your DC, answer their questions, read to them, give them materials to paint, draw, cut out, play games with them, let them interact with all sorts of people. I don't see why you need to pay someone to do it for a particular aim. I don't want more for my DCs than I had; I had a very secure, loving childhood with parents who had my best interests at heart, who supported me in what I wanted to do and didn't have some game plan in place as soon as I was born. I would agree that life will be more difficult for our children in the next 20 yrs-unfortunately I forsee more mental health problems resulting from the pressures to get them to perform.
It appears to me that you are saying that rather than let DC mature at their own rate, in a secure loving home, they need a personal trainer as a toddler!

Hello, I had no idea there would be so many replies.

I managed to have a long chat with the headmaster of one of the prep schools. After much wrangling/flirting I did manage to get to the bottom of it. So this is coming straight from the headmaster.

They test all applicants on a single day. Selection is based on the childs performance on that day. Their tests are structured to tell them how well a child will fit into their school and the expected academic progress of that child.

If a child is not in a mood to perform on that day then the school will wait a few months and reschedule a test for him.

So the admissions test performance is of utmost importance for the school. There is no other information they use other than test performance.

There is hardly any other information they ask for other than to give the childs name, pay the registration fee and to turn up for their all important test.

This is a boys prep school which has an excellent record of students gaining scholarship to independent schools at 11+

Their testing at age 3 has been successful for them in choosing students who they want. That is why they give it so much importance.

Sue9 that's what it was like at my daugther's schools Habs and NLCS too although they were 4+ when assessed. I like the fact other information like what job your parents do, what class your parents are doesn't count either. Anyway it seems to work this early selection. The schools are quite good at it.,

As for narnia having tutoring with 3 year old as she says it's just play for a child. They love one to one attention and if you've got the money, why not? Our children were at private nursery schools at 3, one learned to read at 3 adn there was absolutely no pressure. They are little sponges. If you're in a bog standard state primary class for 4+ they will probably soak in less than if they're in a better type of school and I think selection at a young age ensures they get a better mix of peers in terms of IQ, level the class works at etc.

I think it is great if they don't take account of what job parents do etc.
However I think it is absolutely amazing that you would pay someone to do what you should be doing yourself as a parent! They can have one to one attention with their mother. If you have the money, you also have the time to give to them.There is nothing as important to a DC as time-their parent's time. It is very sad if you are farming it out IMO.