Well behaved kids getting overlooked in school?

[Qwerty654321]

I work for a school and I have children in school. I feel really disillusioned with the education system. I am guessing this isn’t going to be a popular post but I’m going to risk it in the hope there are others who feel the same.

More and more I noticed well behaved children who go to school every day, try their best and complete their work, are increasingly being overlooked in the school system. Resource, training, praise, incentives are now all aimed at those who aren’t these children.

Children who are perceived to be well behaved and doing well are presumed to be ok. They don’t get the 1:1 conversations, rewards or attention that the others do. It really breaks my heart. I think a lot of these children don’t thrive as much as they could because so little focus is put on them.

I know that I am supposed to feel guilty for having these feelings but I don’t. I want the best for my children too.

can anyone relate?

Completely agree, I have two well behaved girls and at one point my eldest was constantly put next to the nautiest boys to try and calm them down which felt very unfair! (Current teacher tbf does not do this) youngest seems to be Completely sidelined and I feel they dont 'see' her at all. Meanwhile the school achievement awards go to all the badly behaved kids that have behaved for 5 minutes for once. It doesn't pay to have a quiet well behaved child

Did you research equality v equity in your training?

Viewing fairness as closing the gaps for those that need it.

https://www.aecf.org/blog/equity-vs-equality

I’m a teacher (and a senco), and I have two ‘well behaved’ children. The youngest is particularly so, and quiet as well.

i don’t especially feel sorry for them. I think they’re very lucky in most regards. They have a loving, secure home. They are neurotypical and they find learning fairly easy.

This is in stark contrast to most of the dysregulated and struggling children that I encounter on a daily basis.

And some parents never get a chat this way.
I am so happy we leave state school and UK at Christmas.
A lot of children and parents are never seen by school or teachers.

I completely agree. My own dc are great, nobody ever took any notice of them through school and that’s fine. Yes, I would have liked them to get a sticker for being a good girl but it’s little to no effort for them to be good girls.

They get plenty of attention from us. They got to go to sports activities and thrive there all whilst receiving a decent education which has enabled them to do what they want to do as they got older.

Quite honestly, you might not be cut out for working in education. It’s making you feel bitter. Especially in the school your own dc are attending.

They seen to recognise the quiet well behaved children quite well in my children's schools, depending on the teacher though. We have a school app and the teacher can assign lesson notes to each lesson (so each hour), various types of notes including positive ones like 'went well' 'good effort!' 'Participated actively!' And my generally quiet well behaved daughter gets those most days as the teacher spots her quietly getting on with her work. There's no star of the week or certificates here so this is the only recognition anyone gets apart from end of year awards (which go to the genuinely kindest two children in each class in primary school, and for specific achievements and best grades in upper school). Meanwhile my son, who isn't very quiet and well behaved very rarely gets a positive lesson note (actually think he's only gotten them on days he got a negative note, probably to make it seem less bad, and from the special ed teacher when he's with her) so gets a lot less recognition (deservedly so) compared to the well behaved children. Possibly takes up more attention from the teacher but of course the teacher needs to deal with issues (of course I'm trying at home as well)

Same with my children.
I'm 60 and it happened when I was at school. At secondary I came top in essay marks, weekly tests and exam results for the year in history. The history prize went to a prat who'd been less of a prat for 5 minutes. I still see him around and his life is crap whilst mine is fabulous but it has obviously really stuck in my mind.

Yes.

Last year the really disruptive kid in the class got star of the week six times. Six times.

DS didn't get it at all.

At the end of the year he came to me upset and asking what was wrong with him. He has real issues with confidence and is a bit of a perfectionist (common for ADHD. He has a diagnosis).

His achievement dropped massively in the last term and the teachers didn't notice or pick up on his confidence dropping.

He's now doing much better, but only because we clocked there was something massively up.

It’s always been like this. Badly behaved children at DDs primary school were given more ‘stars’ to get them to behave. At the end of term those with the most number of stars were highly praised and given awards. Parents had to sit through the awards assembly where all the well behaved/ under the radar kids receding nothing and all the (well/known) badly behaved kids scooped all the awards. Kids aren’t stupid… they could see exactly what was going on but it’ll never change!

It was like this when I was at school.

I was literally the perfect pupil. 100% attendance, never missed a piece of homework, never got a detention, I was never late, I never kicked off at school. I was in the top sets but not right at the top. Because I wasn’t good at PE, music, or art, I never got any recognition. Because my grades weren’t the top grades I was told I should be doing more when I was doing my absolute best. It’s an awful system.

At primary school my dd had a boy with challenging behaviour in her class, if he behaved well in class he was allowed to play football for the last 30minutes of the day on the pitch with a friend as a reward. Dd always asked why he was rewarded but she worked hard every day and behaved and had to work right until the bell went off, she didn’t get a reward and allowed to play.

it’s hard to explain to young children .

this all changed when she went to high school as they rewarded the children who worked hard and they were recognised for their attitude and behaviour. High school was much more strict than primary.

Teachers do their best.
This doesn't have to be a problem for your well behaved child. You explain to them that teachers use rewards to get the best out of everyone and that doesn't look the same for everyone.
In my experience teachers also use subtle ways to reward their 'good'kids. As a parent, you can show enthusiasm and excitement for what your children do.
Rewards given sparsely do have more value.
It evens out at high school.

Oh yes exactly this. My son has autism and ADHD but he behaves in school, he’s self conscious so doesn’t like to make a fuss and struggles to put up his hand. I had to move his primary school to get support for diagnosis because the school “couldn’t see it” (they were just distracted by the louder problematic children) moved him to a smaller school and we got his diagnosis supported swiftly.

Now he’s in secondary school it is a battle getting support for him, because he keeps his head down and scrapes by he just isn’t on anyone’s radar, but he would be capable of so much more with a bit more support which I was assured he would have from the SEN department.

Behaviour in school now is horrific compared to what it was when I went, mine go to a supposedly well respected good school, before the end of term 1 DS had witness 2 violent altercations. They very rarely expel either, long drawn on behavioural management process with a few suspensions thrown in but every e else being massively impacted.

I completely agree and that was one of many reasons why we moved LO to a private school. I would happily pay more taxes to fund schools properly.

I always find these threads depressing/ illuminating. I love the school DS goes to (state primary) and I think his teacher does brilliantly at recognising both the consistent hard workers and the kids doing their best in difficult circumstances.

I'm lucky in that DS has always been really wee behaved, I think it's just his personality he was a very easy toddler as well. I've never thought the fact he doesn't get (because he doesn't need) the 1:1 interventions that some of his classmates get is something to be irritated with.

ETA - I went to a shitty comprehensive in the 80s/ 90s and behaviour there was appalling, I don't think it's got worse at all

Sadly agree, my very well behaved quiet son hasn't had the weekly award in 3 years.
Just had his parents evening and his teacher asked if he was on the residential trip, err yes he spent 3 days in your care for it...did you not notice him!

My friend has a very naughty child which she totally acknowledges and he got pupil of the year, she marched straight back to school and asked them infront of everyone what they were thinking and that he was possibly the worst child and they need to give it to someone who deserves it (he wasn't there) but kudos to her!

Well said!!!
I’ve worked in an infant school for many years and it’s definitely getting worse.
I’ve even had five year olds telling me they’re going to be naughty because then they’ll be allowed to go and feed the animals, or they’ll go to a certain room where they’re allowed to do cooking etc while the quiet kids just have to sit in class and do their work. That’s bloody bonkers and totally unfair!!!

This is the reason I home educate my academic child. He was bored to death in school because of the constant disruption.

Its been this way for a long time. Im in my 40s and happened to me, along with the "naughty" kids being made to sit next to the "good" kids which didn't help either party.

I have tried to ensure I have built up my daughters resilience, she is well behaved, does ok across exams. Volunteers to help teachers, often the go to person to show people around the school, covers parents evening, ran charity events. Really really steps up.

She is in her last year of secondary school, not once has she ever had an invite to the achievement night. That resilience took a massive knocking , what more can she can do - she was so upset as she now will never be get to go to a achievement evening.

I ended up being that parent and recommended the head of year at least says thankyou, she’s aware that to make it fair for all some people need that extra boost but for her she was beginning to feel that she was rubbish at all she did. It made her feel crap and not helped by one of the children who got award bullying her telling her what the point of all she does and she got one for basically turning up. That hurt her & knocked her confidence.

I agree. As adults we understand why some children need adapted timetables, but it's difficult for the children when they see their peers being rewarded for things they will / have be told off for.

A break outside for a child who is dysregulated - Why do they get to have extra playtime?

Leaving the classroom to help with odd jobs - Why do they get fun jobs rather than completing work?

Getting star of the week or other awards = Why do they get noticed and I don't?

It's relentless, and it's no wonder young children think the answer is to copy the behaviour.

I think the logic is very short sighted.
Do they think little jonny is going to get a job that gives him an award for making it to the end of the week without disrupting everyone.....nope Johnny's failing probation and left confused where his awards have gone.

Exactly. And therein lies the problem and is partly why behaviour in schools is getting worse and worse.

Not only are they not being praised for their good behaviour, they are often used to sit next to the naughty kids so it feels like a punishment.

I’m another who works in education and has a well-behaved, conscientious, academic child. Hate to say it, but I completely agree with you OP. As a country we seem to have completely lost sight of the fact that hard work and effort should be rewarded, and that we need to allow high performing children to reach their full potential as well as supporting those who struggle. There is nothing remotely meritocratic about the school system as it stands (indeed, DD’s current primary is very vocal about its obsession with ‘equity’, which seems in practice to mean allowing the hardworking and high attaining to underperform in order to ‘narrow the gap’).

A current example is that recently DD has been coming home upset because her table of more able pupils have recently found some of the ‘extra challenge’ Maths activities they’ve been given quite tricky, mainly because they’ve been printed off and handed out without any further explanation while the class teacher works with those who are struggling. However, when DD and her peers have asked for help/clarification they are being repeatedly dismissed with ‘It’s not that hard; you should be able to get this; I haven’t got time to help you.’ Kudos to the class teacher for trying to stretch them - many wouldn’t bother - but when it’s just her in the room with 30 pupils in a generally low attaining class there is literally zero input for those children who usually just get on with things.

We are lucky in that we have the resources to support DD out of school, but I feel angry on behalf of the bright and diligent pupils whose parents are less well equipped.