Page 29 | Whitehall “braced for private schools collapse”

MerryMaker · 29/12/2024 22:56

Labour are not criticising home education. They are saying families on a child protection plan should need approval to home educate. If you do not abuse your kids, it will not affect you

Sasskitty · 29/12/2024 23:03

The fact that keir starmer borrowed his multi millionaire friends’ place for HIS ‘boy’ so as not to disturb HIS boys’ GCSE’s - but Keir Starmer gives not a flying fck for those thousands of children whose GCSE’s are being seriously negatively affected by this ludicrous envy induced policy - tells us all we need to know about this current Labour Party.

‘My boy, 16, was in the middle of his GCSEs. I made him a promise, a promise that he would be able to get to his school, do his exams, without being disturbed.’
‘Asked about the donations, Sir Keir said that around £20,000 he had declared from Lord Alli for unspecified accommodation was for his teenager to study for exams in a “peaceful” atmosphere‘ The Standard

Tell us how ‘peaceful’ it will be for those children who have to move schools now Keir. I guess he doesn’t give a shit about THOSE children. If he did he wouldn’t be implementing this policy.

MerryMaker · 29/12/2024 23:06

@Sasskitty Oh come on! Starmer works where he lives. There are staff constantly in and out.

Sasskitty · 29/12/2024 23:09

MerryMaker · 29/12/2024 23:06

@Sasskitty Oh come on! Starmer works where he lives. There are staff constantly in and out.

👀

Heathbear · 29/12/2024 23:13

MerryMaker · 29/12/2024 22:14

Here is our private school extras checklist to help you clarify what added extras you may be expected to pay for with the school admissions team:
· Transportation – be it to and from school or between sporting matches or on school excursions, the fees for private school buses can be quite pricey especially when you factor in siblings.
· Meals – most private schools include the costs of meals in their termly fees, however some do not, and the fees can reach their hundreds per term. Other schools request that parents keep a meals account topped up with funds which pupils can draw on by swiping a card each day.
· Books – Not all schools require parents to stump the extra money for these vital curriculum staples, but textbooks are expensive, especially when they reach a higher secondary level.
· Uniform – All schools will require pupils to wear the correct uniform and some private schools only allow uniform to be purchased from an approved supplier. It’s worth checking on the second-hand market – many parent volunteers run excellent sales to avoid waste.
· Sports equipment – From hockey sticks and cricket bats, specialist mouthguards and protective headgear, most schools will expect pupils to be properly equipped and this will not be something that the school will fund.
· IT/Laptops – Most schools have moved to an online homework system and will expect pupils to have access to the internet and a computer or laptop to either bring to school or use at home.
· Art and DT supplies – For higher levels such as GCSE and A-Level or IBacc parents may be asked to pay for specialist paints or resources to support pupils to complete their coursework.
· Exam Fees – For most private schools, parents will have to pay fees for entrance exams, but statutory exam fees, as they progress through school, may also need to be financed.
· School Trips – From Geography trips to Iceland, skiing in Canada to drama trips to New York, field trips fees can be exorbitant and when you factor in the insurance and kit list, they can reach into their multiple thousands.
· Insurance – Usually factored into termly fees, some schools make this a separate charge so it’s worth checking in with the admissions team.
· Stationery – Some schools request that an account with funds be created for pupils to access the stationery store or tuck shop throughout the term – there are certainly ways around this, but in boarding schools, it is often a pre-requisite.
· School photos – Annual individual, sibling, sporting teams and whole school photos are part of the school calendar. Whether or not you actually like the professional photo of your little darling, they are a regular occurrence, and the bill for ordering photos will most certainly be met by the parents.
· Extra-curricular – Many private schools include extra-curricular activities in their termly fees, however attendance of some clubs such as Drama or the Model UN may be accompanied by extra costs.
· Foreign language magazines – Not all private schools will charge separately for these items, however with rising costs, it is likely that items such as these may be passed onto parents.

https://www.schoolguide.co.uk/blog/private-vs-state-hidden-costs-explained

Show quote history

What is the point of this list exactly?

Certainly some of the items are equally applicable to state schools.

The vast majority of children have to pay for their lunches, whether packed or school meals.
Transport isn’t free for state school kids
Books cost money - we’ve been asked to buy DCs reading books for state primary.
Stationery is needed by all children. Multiple requests for pritt stick etc per year again in state primary.
School uniform is needed in most schools.
IT is generally needed.
School trips cost whether you’re in state or private.
School photos cost in both.
Extra-curricular clubs are free at DC1s school except for 1 of about 100 clubs and travel to matches is free.

Insurance and exam fees are the only real difference. The rest are the costs of schooling generally

Ubertomusic · 29/12/2024 23:20

Kittiwakeup · 29/12/2024 21:43

So the Government didn't say that at all. It was a report to the Government. That is quite a difference.

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Where in my quote above do you see the word "government"?

They = Labour. The professor was a Guardian journo for ten years, he cannot be Tory. He was also CEO of Sutton Trust, a very influential organisation, so he is hardly "non-political". It is not a pure coincidence he's advising the gov on schools curriculum. And his views are obviously in line with PP who cheered abolishing Latin - "the prols should do/study something useful, not faff about high-brow activities that are not for them".

CautiousLurker01 · 29/12/2024 23:21

Sasskitty · 29/12/2024 23:09

👀

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My thoughts too. It’s not as if he was evicted from his actual home, the one he owns with his wife and where his kids go to school, is it? No reason he couldn’t have stayed there with mum and a security detail…

Original poster

ICouldBeVioletSky · 29/12/2024 23:25

MerryMaker · 29/12/2024 23:06

@Sasskitty Oh come on! Starmer works where he lives. There are staff constantly in and out.

And the fact that Starmer continued to use his mate’s flat for three weeks after his son had finished his GCSEs…. do you not think that tells us quite a lot about Starmer, his hypocrisy and his rank dishonesty…?

OP posts:

Kittiwakeup · 29/12/2024 23:28

CautiousLurker01 · 29/12/2024 23:21

My thoughts too. It’s not as if he was evicted from his actual home, the one he owns with his wife and where his kids go to school, is it? No reason he couldn’t have stayed there with mum and a security detail…

Show quote history

Within the context of a thread entitled "Whitehall braced for Private School Collapse", it would be helpful if you could be a bit more specific when you say 'they'. There is a very significant difference between whether these assertions are being made by those who are actually governing the county or not (as it were).

Kittiwakeup · 29/12/2024 23:41

@CautiousLurker01 sorry I quoted the wrong post. It was meant to be a comment on Ubertomusic's post.

Ubertomusic · 29/12/2024 23:50

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Juliagreeneyes · 29/12/2024 23:54

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😆 gosh how elitist - you know, we ought to slap an extra tax on that kind of thing, just to make sure that none of the lower classes can ever afford it. Ballet for the super-rich only, I say! Make it even more expensive, that’ll be excellent for social mobility!

Ubertomusic · 30/12/2024 00:03

Juliagreeneyes · 29/12/2024 23:54

😆 gosh how elitist - you know, we ought to slap an extra tax on that kind of thing, just to make sure that none of the lower classes can ever afford it. Ballet for the super-rich only, I say! Make it even more expensive, that’ll be excellent for social mobility!

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Hanging my head in shame, honest!

MerryMaker · 30/12/2024 00:08

@Juliagreeneyes as an academic, you are displaying a surprising lack of logic in the structure of your arguments

LetItGo99 · 30/12/2024 00:10

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MerryMaker · 30/12/2024 00:20

@LetItGo99 you are like Julia. Reacting to comments by calling people thick

juggleit · 30/12/2024 00:48

IVTT · 28/12/2024 14:23

It’s pretty contorted logic to expect a teenage kid moving to another school to improve the State system.
What exactly do you think they and their parents are going to do that’s any different to the vast majority of State school parents?
Also pretty insulting to imply that Sate school parents can’t fight for a better education for their kids without help.

It’s the government’s job to improve State education. Not kids, not their parents.
So what exactly are Labour going to do aside from tax a specific group of parents that is likely to result in an even poorer experience for all children?

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@IVTT a brillliant response to a ludicrous assertion from @aldisud 👏

@aldisud ignorant batshit posts like your’s have won the day! All my friends who send their kids to state school could not give a shiny shit why I decided to send my child to an independent school where she is no longer harrased and assaulted by angry toxic children.

The policy is a direct result of Rachel Reeves past experiences of her inferiority complex of her state school being in close proximity to a private school that she perceived to be in a superior league.

This is a Rachel problem not a state versus independent problem.

The vat money, on my part, of course will be paid and I hope all the state schools thrive on their ONE extra teacher this will provide.
Complete madness from the Labour toddler group, as to be expected! 😩

Lebr · 30/12/2024 00:48

MerryMaker · 29/12/2024 22:56

Labour are not criticising home education. They are saying families on a child protection plan should need approval to home educate. If you do not abuse your kids, it will not affect you

Labour have sought to:
(a) conflate home education with absenteeism
(b) conflate home education with safeguarding risks
In the latter case they rushed their announcements to exploit the death of a child.
The Bill they intend to pass ends the right to home education not just if a child protection plan is in place but also if any investigation has been started. That treats home educators as guilty until proven innocent.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/labour-ofsted-england-gillian-keegan-centre-for-social-justice-b1131082.html
https://www.educationotherwise.org/childrens-wellbeing-and-schools-bill/

The week after Labour's election victory, interest in homeschooling increased 300%.
https://www.bbntimes.com/politics/labour-s-victory-fuels-interest-in-homeschooling-by-300

MerryMaker · 30/12/2024 01:02

There have been concerns for some time about a growing number of parents on child protection plans home educating. The trigger for this decision is often when a child investigation is instigated and a plan looks likely.

https://schoolsweek.co.uk/home-education-abuse-review-protective-school-factor-missing-from-lives/

Home education: 'Protective' school factor 'missing from lives'

Review into deaths and abuse of 41 children finds they were 'less visible to agencies'

https://schoolsweek.co.uk/home-education-abuse-review-protective-school-factor-missing-from-lives

Lebr · 30/12/2024 01:02

Labour's mendacious language on home education is similar to their mendacious language on the VAT issue :
Calling the introduction of an entirely new tax "ending a tax break"
Saying they will "end tax breaks" for private schools when it's the parents, not the schools, who have to pay it.
Pretending schools could somehow absorb the cost and that it was optional for them to pass it on, when most of them have nothing to spare in their budgets and have additionally been hit by the employers NI hike.
Maintaining that "very few" children will be disrupted, when 13000 have already left private schools, their own estimates put the number that will leave at 40,000 and independent reports such as those by baines-cutler put the number at 130,000.
Maintaining that they'll raise 1.6 billion for state schools, when this figure is based on fantasy economics by the Fabian society, and has been repeatedly debunked by independent reports by Baines-Cutler, EDSK and the Adam Smith institute, which shows the policy could raise nothing and actually incur a net cost to the taxpayer.

MerryMaker · 30/12/2024 01:03

And if you are not abusing or neglecting your child, it will not affect you

Sasskitty · 30/12/2024 01:18

Lebr · 30/12/2024 01:02

Labour's mendacious language on home education is similar to their mendacious language on the VAT issue :
Calling the introduction of an entirely new tax "ending a tax break"
Saying they will "end tax breaks" for private schools when it's the parents, not the schools, who have to pay it.
Pretending schools could somehow absorb the cost and that it was optional for them to pass it on, when most of them have nothing to spare in their budgets and have additionally been hit by the employers NI hike.
Maintaining that "very few" children will be disrupted, when 13000 have already left private schools, their own estimates put the number that will leave at 40,000 and independent reports such as those by baines-cutler put the number at 130,000.
Maintaining that they'll raise 1.6 billion for state schools, when this figure is based on fantasy economics by the Fabian society, and has been repeatedly debunked by independent reports by Baines-Cutler, EDSK and the Adam Smith institute, which shows the policy could raise nothing and actually incur a net cost to the taxpayer.

💯

MerryMaker · 30/12/2024 01:18

We will see who is right soon enough

Boohoo76 · 30/12/2024 06:04

MerryMaker · 29/12/2024 22:14

Here is our private school extras checklist to help you clarify what added extras you may be expected to pay for with the school admissions team:
· Transportation – be it to and from school or between sporting matches or on school excursions, the fees for private school buses can be quite pricey especially when you factor in siblings.
· Meals – most private schools include the costs of meals in their termly fees, however some do not, and the fees can reach their hundreds per term. Other schools request that parents keep a meals account topped up with funds which pupils can draw on by swiping a card each day.
· Books – Not all schools require parents to stump the extra money for these vital curriculum staples, but textbooks are expensive, especially when they reach a higher secondary level.
· Uniform – All schools will require pupils to wear the correct uniform and some private schools only allow uniform to be purchased from an approved supplier. It’s worth checking on the second-hand market – many parent volunteers run excellent sales to avoid waste.
· Sports equipment – From hockey sticks and cricket bats, specialist mouthguards and protective headgear, most schools will expect pupils to be properly equipped and this will not be something that the school will fund.
· IT/Laptops – Most schools have moved to an online homework system and will expect pupils to have access to the internet and a computer or laptop to either bring to school or use at home.
· Art and DT supplies – For higher levels such as GCSE and A-Level or IBacc parents may be asked to pay for specialist paints or resources to support pupils to complete their coursework.
· Exam Fees – For most private schools, parents will have to pay fees for entrance exams, but statutory exam fees, as they progress through school, may also need to be financed.
· School Trips – From Geography trips to Iceland, skiing in Canada to drama trips to New York, field trips fees can be exorbitant and when you factor in the insurance and kit list, they can reach into their multiple thousands.
· Insurance – Usually factored into termly fees, some schools make this a separate charge so it’s worth checking in with the admissions team.
· Stationery – Some schools request that an account with funds be created for pupils to access the stationery store or tuck shop throughout the term – there are certainly ways around this, but in boarding schools, it is often a pre-requisite.
· School photos – Annual individual, sibling, sporting teams and whole school photos are part of the school calendar. Whether or not you actually like the professional photo of your little darling, they are a regular occurrence, and the bill for ordering photos will most certainly be met by the parents.
· Extra-curricular – Many private schools include extra-curricular activities in their termly fees, however attendance of some clubs such as Drama or the Model UN may be accompanied by extra costs.
· Foreign language magazines – Not all private schools will charge separately for these items, however with rising costs, it is likely that items such as these may be passed onto parents.

https://www.schoolguide.co.uk/blog/private-vs-state-hidden-costs-explained

Show quote history

We don’t pay transportation to the school as my DC is driven to school (along with the one in state school). In any event, many people with DC at state school have to pay travel.
Meals are optional. They can bring a packed lunch if they want.
Books - never been asked to pay for any book.
Uniform - not cheap but it’s worse at our local state where even the shirts and trousers have a logo. We just use plain old M & S (or supermarket etc.) at DC’s private. There’s also lots of second had sales.
IT/Laptops - school provides each child with an iPad from year 3 upwards. The only additional cost is if you want to buy one when they sell them off second hand. But that would just be for personal use.
Art and DT supplies - haven’t got to GCSE yet but we’ve never been asked to provide anything for any practical subject. Even cooking ingredients are provided.
School trips - all overseas trips are optional. In any event, they are just as expensive and elaborate at my DC’s state school.
Insurance - no requirement for insurance if you don’t want it although the private medical cover is a bit of a bargain. Much better cover for DC than I get through my work.
Stationary - only additional thing that we’ve been asked to buy when compared to DC at state school is a pen/stylus for the iPad. Not an Apple one though, just a cheap one from Amazon.
School photos - no pressure to buy and the photos are cheaper than the ones at my DC’s state school.
Extra curricular - loads are included. It’s only if you want specialist stuff such as one to one tennis lessons or music lessons that payment is required, or some of the dance stuff. My DC does a variety of stuff each day for no extra charge. For example, cricket academy with a professional country player (and former international). No charge!
Foreign language magazines - again, never been asked to pay for anything.

That’s at a large, successful all through school.

Our extras bill is very low each term.

JamesWebbSpaceTelescope · 30/12/2024 08:18

Some private schools will benefit from
this policy, especially the higher end. If the school is passing on the full VAT with little or no drop in numbers AND can now claim VAT back on any purchases it makes (especially large building works) the school will actually end up with more money.

Anything you brought up to 4 years before being registered they can now claim the vat back from.

Rumour has it that Eton will be getting a nice chunk of money coming in due to recent building work. Possibly more than the VAT on fees will bring in in the short term!