Whitehall “braced for private schools collapse”

[ICouldBeVioletSky]

Whitehall ‘braced for private schools collapse’ due to fee rises

Worth reading the whole article, it’s not quite as alarmist as the headline suggests. But as you’d expect, gov sources are talking it all down while the ISC is ringing the alarm bell.

https://www.thetimes.com/article/e6465c9e-d462-48cb-a73e-74480059a1f3?shareToken=05bf599cd4a2376fe3ce83cdce607100

I’d be quite surprised if some of the schools near us don't fold tbh. There will definitely be a contraction in the sector, I just hope those that hold on can remain a viable concern.

@IVTT totally right it’s not up to a demographic to change education it’s the government’s job not this demonising of any private sector

Do extra resources include tutors, extra curriculars, work experience etc?

As there are huge numbers already doing State Plus. You opt for best state school you can, make a nice profit on the catchment house at the end, and plough the equivalent of school fees into tutors and extras.

Parents with connections will also use those to ensure good work experience options, prepping for university interviews etc.

Not sure I see much difference between that and a private school except the former requires more faff from parents to organise.

Exactly, lots of contorted bleating about "equality" while at the same time hailing bursaries for the "poor" students who have to ace the entrance exams way beyond the paying customers, would get slates of 9s and A*s wherever they went and whose absence harms the state schools they would otherwise go to. Equality? For a few.

Only 7% of students get a means tested bursary anyway. And only 1% get a full means tested bursary, some bursaries are very small.
Remember this 1% includes specialist schools such as music or sporting schools where there will be a large number in most cases of full means tested bursaries.

I'm not sure you are correct. That certainly isn't our experience.

My ds is a benefactor of a 50% scholarship. He attended state primary and came out at 10, angry, stressed, miserable and lonely.

Moving to a small rural independent where football mania wasn't obligatory and he wasn't bullied endlessly for liking maths , science and chess, made all the difference.

You do not see how using a state school differs from using a private school?
Plenty of private school pupils also have tutors.

We hosted a mum and 14yr old from Ukraine for 18 months. The daughter went to an independent school for that period.
No entrance exams, no expectations.
She and her mum spoke very little English on arrival.
They gave her 121 English lessons after school, bought Russian language versions of texts so she could study in her native language and so on.

We applied for a state school place and it took 4.5 months for them to be able to offer her a place based in Fair Access as there were no places at any school in the city with a space.

If you ask actually a lot of things are possible. Not everyone asks!

Private is a waste of money anyway

"Also pretty insulting to imply that Sate school parents can’t fight for a better education for their kids without help"

Are you intentionally stupid? As long as there is a get out clause for richer people, there will be no political will to improve the state system. if you went to "Indie" school, it is proof that they are pretty much bullshit providers.

But 94% of children are already educated in the state system. How is a few extra per cent going to make a difference?!!

Because those few extra percent grab all the jobs because of their network. That is what this two tier system results in, from law to journalism to politics to entertainment.

Not really.

I went to a mix of state and private schools as did my siblings. Everything from top public schools to state boarding grammars to local state primary. So I have a pretty good first hand knowledge of private and state provision.

DD is entirely educated in Ofsted Outstanding and highly sought after state primary and comp.

Not much difference at all - Latin, multiple foreign languages, vast amounts of art, drama and music, loads of extra curricular. Setting in the comp means pretty much like the grammar and private schools in top sets. Similar oxbridge numbers, public school gets better GCSEs but otherwise not much in it.

DDs friends are all from very similar backgrounds to those I was at school with - doctors, lawyers, architects, company directors etc

Perhaps the real issue is that state schools are not all equal?

Because those few extra percent grab all the jobs because of their network. That is what this two tier system results in, from law to journalism to politics to entertainment.

That network will still exist amongst the parents no matter where the children go to school.

Are you intentionally rude?

actually a majority of ANY income decile (including top decile) is already in state. It is only at the top 1% that it approaches (but does not exceed ) 50% in private schools. Plenty of very rich people in state already, so clearly not the magic bullet you think it is.

you might want to fact check your own assertions before calling others stupid

Stories like this boil my blood.
https://www.theguardian.com/education/2024/dec/27/two-years-after-evacuation-rotting-cumbria-school-sacred-heart-catholic-school--barrow-in-furness
certainly not the same school as the NEVER NAMED, fab state school that @OhCrumbsWhereNow children attend.
the issue isn’t private schools clearly there’s a much bigger mismanagement issue.
The VAT controversy simply allows the incompetence to be swept under the carpet a bit longer.

@GildedRage yes it is awful how the Conservatives just left school buildings to rot.

Actually I have often named DD’s state school.

She’s at Kingsdale Foundation School in Dulwich. You’re welcome.

Many schools will close due to the falling birth rate, nothing to do with VAT. Fortunately there are many spaces in local state schools they can transfer to.
Hants is my local LA and there are loads of state schools applying to reduce PAN due to falling birth rates - private schools will be no different. It’s not even the whole LA, just part of it.
www.hants.gov.uk/aboutthecouncil/haveyoursay/consultations/admission-arrangements26-27

@MerryMaker the parents and the local community. The current solution is idiotic 5 drunks in a pub could probably come up with a better solution than busing within school hours to an unsuitable location.

It’s not worsening anything - it’s continuing as it already is - houses close to good schools are already popular and as a result cost more.
Loads of state schools are reducing their PAN (primary and secondary) so private schools aren’t the only ones affected by falling numbers.

@GildedRage still not saying what you think the solution is? I suspect what you really think is you want the government to just drop its vat plans, so you and others can pay less.

Yes but with those just priced out of private putting their money into the right house, it'll worsen that inequality

There are lots of things that worsen inequality, buy to lets being one of the clear winners.

Well as a state school educated (and free school meals recipient) lawyer, I can tell you that pretty much all my colleagues are state school educated. I believe that the actual figure for privately educated solicitors is around 22% but that is not even the gotcha that you think it is given that at sixth form level 20% of pupils are privately educated so the profession currently reflects the 80:20 state: private split of those that continue their education to 18. So no, all the private school kids don’t grab the jobs.

Thank you Juliagreeneyes, fanaticalfairy and Labradorara and many others for your excellent posts.

As a knackered parent of SEND DC in private school as a last resort, and very worried about money I can’t express clearly and unemotionally how stressed out this policy makes me. State school parents DO constantly fight for their kids. It doesn’t make a blind bit of difference what we say to schools without increased funding from central government.

Mainstream state school abandoned my DC saying they couldn’t meet their needs and that there would be one or two years’ wait for a special school place. No form of education was being offered in the interim. Nothing. There are so many DC simply being at home with parents having to be at home to look after them. Careers cut short just like that. I now know this is illegal of the local authorities. But LAs break the law on SEND obligations, all the time. Constantly. Again well documented if anyone cares to look.

And rest assured our LA is not concurrently looking for a special school place for our DC to restore their access to state education. They’re just happy to have kids off their books.

Thousands of state school parents are constantly begging, crying in the head teachers’ offices of our kids’ schools asking for them to ‘up their game’. And contacting the local authority to beg them to ‘up their game’.

There’s a well documented national crisis in SEND provision. The system is broken. Obviously we are the very very luckiest ones among parents like us.

No part of the VAT imposition which will push more SEND kids from private into state provision, is reserved for state schools to help them meet needs of kids with SEND. so it’s just going to punish those kids.
Has the government released any impact assessment of this policy yet?

The idea is to do that as well isn't it? so Labour say.... but of course as fast as one avoidance measure is closed, a new one appears... the wealthy, as this thread proves, will do anything to avoid paying tax...

Hence why tax accountants are v highly paid.

But as always it's someone else who has to pay....