If labour win the election can they introduce VAT immediately?

[londonparent321]

(For school fees) Or do they need to go through the courts which could take years /never happen?

I think you’re possibly clutching at straws here. Perhaps you are an exception, but all the state schools I know of are far more prescriptive than their private counterparts. They’re constrained by the national curriculum and government targets/assessment in a way that private schools aren’t.

For example, at primary, whilst the state schools were doing endless SATS/phonics test/times tables preparation, for fear of the school results looking bad, the nearby private school pupils were able to spend that time doing creative subjects such as drama, art and music.

At secondary level, they have endless opportunities both within the curriculum and through extra curricular options to do a huge variety of arts and sporting activities. They’re far less prescriptive than state schools with large classes have to be - the children are encouraged to use their imagination and explore their strengths.

how creative can you be if it is timetabled

A lot more creative than state schools which hardly timetable creative subjects at all! Even where its timetabled, it’s far easier to enable pupils in a class of 15 to express their own creativity than in a class of 30 where the teacher has no choice to teach all pupils exactly the same. For example with art, a teacher and other staff with lower pupil numbers can cover a broad subject such as pottery, but can enable each pupil to use their creativity and have a degree of choice over what to do, with staff support.

I've always ensured the home environment encourages the imagination with the way they played

The same as many private school parents do.

Did I say state schools don't have timetables? The prescriptive approach to learning and the focus on attaining high grades whatever cost, including to the child's mental health at the private schools in our locality is something that would not suit DD.

I'm describing Artists broadly here, it depends what you think qualifies as good art so that is all subjective. The diversity of society as a whole is not reflected in private school settings (class diversity) and so how can art comment on it.

I think people should be free to choose private school but I'm highlighting that some posters cynicism i.e no one had ideals and everyone is driven by money, is frankly bollox .

I do know what both sectors are like, having attended private school and having close relatives whose children do. State schools vary, ours has a theatre and loads of music drama clubs but no, the timetabled doesn't allow some free wheeling, Dead Poet's Society teaching as I'm sure happens regularly in the context of fee paying schools.

And yet again you misunderstand many private schools with "high grades whatever the cost". Many private schools aren't academic hot houses, this has been explained to you many times on other threads but you choose to ignore it. Many posters on here have explained that they send the other DC private especially FOR their mental health/SEN because their state schools can't cater for their DC.
Artists can make social comments irrelevant of class/upbringing etc. You don't have to have be lower working class and on the breadline in order to feel empathy and comment on society. That isn't the privilege of the small 10-20% of kids in some state school who are economically or socially disadvantaged.
As always, your view is incredibly black and white with no shading allowed.

Still laughing about your comment that you choose state school because private schools are too prescriptive in their artistic subjects and don't allow freedom when all state schools have to follow the repressive national curriculum which allows hardly any space for arts/creativity/individual expression.

Agree@Another76543
If state schools are so amazing it’s bizarre why parents keep moaning about them and why private schools are constantly giving them a leg up with extra support and extra curricular activities.
How on earth can private schools be getting it all so wrong🤣🤣🤣🤣

I didn’t know state schools did ………for example
photography or classics as standard
or rowing and fencing

How have I missed that!

Indeed or for Yr 7: geology, archaeology, debating, classics, ancient Greek, art history, choice of 3 MFL etc.
Maybe I've got it all wrong after all!

I’m still trying to get my head around the logic that private schools are awful, spoon feed children, are full of pupils with low intelligence, don’t allow creativity etc, and yet at the same time they give an “unfair advantage”.

Other threads, are you stalking me? Are they recent threads?

Where have I said, "I chose state school because private schools are too prescriptive"? Don't think I said anything about choosing state school, like most people my DC go to state school by default. There is a shocking shortage of cash for the Arts in the state sector, in fact on this thread I have pointed out how unattainable extra curricular lessons are to a poster (was it you) who made the ludicrous, stretch of the imagination, suggestion that state school children are paying for all these clubs and this is an advantage that is akin to a child attending private school. Personally the Arts being available to a minority of wealthy people's children is not really very funny in my mind, it is a sad state of affairs.

Who said you have to be on the breadline, you certainly have to be in the context where the makeup of society is represented which it is not in private school, to comment on it effectively, otherwise what is your art about. At the end of the day it is my opinion and we are free to have them in a democracy just as we are to send our DC to private schools!

@Goldenbear no we have had this conversation on a previous thread. My parents are both artistic but come from private/privileged positions, hasn't stopped them being good at what they do. Maybe because they don't buy into your theory of not being able to empathise or put yourself in someone else's shoes just because you have a certain background.
So you acknowledge the lack of Arts funding in state sector but yet send your child there because private schools don't allow a sufficient artistic focus?
No-one has said that the situation with the Arts is good or acceptable in state schools but it is just ironic that you choose somewhere that delivers the horribly boring national curriculum yet criticise private schools for a lack of artistic freedom.

Completey correct. They have flexibility and the opportunity to be spontaneous. It's frankly an absurd suggestion that state schools provide a more creative timetable!

Again, where did I write that state schools are so excellent? State schools should not have to beg and borrow anything from private schools or don't you believe education opportunity should be equal for all. I thought many posting on here absolutely were behind the idea of state school provisions levelling up and it shouldn't be a race to the bottom, blah, blah, blah....I wonder why so many voters feel limited sympathy to the marginalised minority group that is the 'private school parent'. 🙄

P.s my DD's school offers Photography, textiles, Latin/Greek, Film studies as GCSE options.

Equally, zero help from private schools to state schools in our city.

I know
Why are people so envious of such crap schools🤣🤣

I know and even During lockdown the range of online activities was amazing and hilarious at the same time

The head did dog training on the green.! 🤪

Go onto the charity commission website
Look up a school of your choice
It all their

I absolutely think that state schools need improving and levelling up.

P.s my DD's school offers Photography, textiles, Latin/Greek, Film studies as GCSE options.

And there’s the problem. Most state schools don’t have that choice. Less than 3% of state schools offer Latin for example. We have no local state choice which offers any classics subject. It’s ridiculous that state school provision is postcode dependent. How is it fair that only a minority in the state sector can access that choice?

Our school provided a full timetable (including sport/art/science experiments) during lockdown. The local state primary provided 1 maths and English worksheet a week. Apparently my choice of education is a “luxury” though. I view a decent education more as a necessity, and one which should be available to all children.

Absolutely.
In countries such as France where state schools are so much better there are fewer private schools and no antagonism towards them.

If everyone paid a little extra in tax (1-2% inc ), and everyone was taxed on all earnings with no tax free amount inline with some other countries then state schools could improve more inline with private and everyone would feel they were benefiting from the money they are putting in.
If Labour are so concerned with the state of state schools an actual policy that would actually benefit schools is needed.
Of course, that’s not exactly a vote winner…..which is the only reason why they will never suggest it.

Exactly this. Improve the state sector and make it fair and equal to all children - not just those lucky enough to live in catchment of a good state school. This policy has nothing to do with improving the state sector though. It’s all about punishing the private sector.

We were in state school during covid - there wasn't as much at all. However, my best friend teaches in a state primary and she said out of a class of 30, 1 child was completing the work set - that must be pretty demoralising. Completely off topic I know, but it does show the importance of patent engagement.

Have we, I don't recall it at all, it's slightly anxiety inducing that you know all this. Anyway, as I have already stated, 'good art' is subjective and I do say it is my opinion.

You have LOL on two posts about lack of state Arts provisions, if that is you empathising then that is quite depressing.

Again, where do I state that I chose state school for it's wonderful curriculum or provisions. I've said quite a few times on here, that it is the Lottery system for school allocation where I live, I didn't choose anything! I am commenting more broadly about creativity not about state provision and the curriculum but being Artistic beyond the curriculum in a school, can you produce amazing art if you are segregated from a large part of society. If none of your friends have problems with enough food or if 99.9 % live in middle class comfort or everyone is nice in the class, no child attempts to fight you or they are all reasonable and can talk through problems, or you have the roof of your classroom caving in or there is Asbestos or freezing temperatures in temporary classrooms that have been temporary since the 90s, how can you make a comment that is 'profound' on the troubles of society.

Of course you can produce amazing art. No artist has a profound understanding and experience of all levels of society.
Just look back on every artist you know. They will have grown up and lived within their own bubble. Most of our well known artists were not poverty stricken…far from it.

I'm sorry you feel anxious, I do have a good memory but it was more about your obsession with the Arts and a completely blinkered view of private schools.
It was you who stated that you were happier to send your DD state because she would have a more creative experience.
That was what my original "lol" comment was aimed at.

But @OOBetty but that doesn't fit the narrative of@Goldenbear whereby only people who experience some form of disadvantage can be truly artistic because seemingly only those people are qualified to pass comment on society. No-one from private school could possibly have empathy with anyone outside of their socio-econimic circle or be concerned about injustice etc

Agree with you @twistyizzy @Goldenbears view is very shortsighted and has no historical president.