If labour win the election can they introduce VAT immediately?

[londonparent321]

(For school fees) Or do they need to go through the courts which could take years /never happen?

What excites me?

The rich being taxed appropriately.

Yes they can and probably will if notorious class warrior and firebrand revolutionary Kier Starter gets his way.

Did you know he has a Che Guevara tattoo on his bottom?

So you are excited about the huge number of SEN kids who will now need to be educated back in the state sector - that already can't cope?

Or you are excited about all the kids from low income families who now won't be going to a grammar school because the parents who would have used selective private schools will switch to those?

Or are you excited about the extra wodge of premium that's about to go on house prices in the catchment of the top comprehensives?

Maybe you're excited about the huge chunk of cash the Treasury will be sending the way of the really big Public Schools when they reclaim all the VAT they've spent on their shiny new theatres and sports centres?

And for what? The net result (if there even is one and it doesn't go on lawyers) will be a rounding error in the overall budget?

Or do you actually just want to metaphorically spit in the faces of parents and children you are envious of?

@otherwayup - seems like a silly point. Tory governments have been ruinous for the state sector and the NHS, and I look forward to seeing the back of them.

However, I pay taxes which go to the state. I also educate my kids privately, which means the state is saved from funding my kids’ education. If anything being taxed appropriately would mean I should get some kind of rebate for not using state education - which is actually the case in several European countries.

Absolutely spot on!

Local authorities are required by law to find a school place for any child that needs one. If there are no places available at all, the LA will have to persuade schools to create places. They cannot force parents to keep their children at independent schools.

FGS the thread isn’t about the merits, it’s about the legislation.

I expect it would be a ‘first hundred days’ policy. Payable either on Term 3 24/25 fees or, Term 1 and onwards 25/26.

They definitely aren’t going to drop it. Labour don’t have many policies and this is high profile, relatively easy to implement and uncontentious within their own MP group. No brainer.

It could be done very quickly because it’s only the regulations not the primary legislation. The challenges will
cone when schools start to define what exactly is ‘education’ and ‘ ancillary to education’ . Is lunch vatable for example , hat about after school care ( many independents include this in their fees atm) etc etc

Frankly think it’s a waste of time , will raise a tiny amount of money, will benefit no one. Would rather they concentrated on the important stuff like NHS waiting lists , SEN education and most importantly social care .

This argument has never made sense to me. Should people without children get a tax rebate too? Healthy people get a rebate for not going to the doctors?

Your taxes go towards funding the education for everyone, not just your children. You're paying for the education of your future doctors, or your grandchildren's teachers, or the writer of that novel you'll read in 30 years.

@dontjudgemeagain - I’m one hundred percent happy to pay taxes that contribute towards state education, even if my kids’ don’t benefit from it! The point I was making was to @otherwayup about VAT on school fees equating to ‘the rich being taxed appropriately’.

I already pay higher rate tax, and don’t use the state system. Labour whacking VAT on fees will ultimately hit the parents - they are making something that I choose to pay for unaffordable to our family. ‘Appropriate’ to me would be sorting out the non dom tax dodgers and capping bankers’ bonuses - but Starmer won’t do that because he doesn’t want to lose the city vote.

It’s to decrease burden on the state

You have greater addition of disposable income directed towards education and health and the state lower burden to do both for

It can work well behaviourally and economically but politically probably no chance here.

Why would they run a public consultation? It will be in the manifesto so they will have a mandate if they win. Governments don't run a public consultation when they change tax rates, they just amend the required secondary legislation and do it. It happens every budget and autumn statement.

Hooray! Another panicky thread by the sharp-elbowed middle classes. Where would MN be without them.

Wait until you have this policy in place. Parents will displace dc by getting into the top state schools using extra funds and motivation

‘Or you are excited about all the kids from low income families who now won't be going to a grammar school because the parents who would have used selective private schools will switch to those?’

Big assumption that children from selective private schools are more intelligent than ‘kids from low income families’…..

All of this

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face

Not more intelligent. But more prepared and tutored, absolutely. So will take grammar school places from also bright but less tutored kids. As already happens, but more so.

I'm staunchly working class and I cant understand this "let's hope so" mentality. It's so short-sighted.

It's not merely a 'tax on the rich'. It's a real-life blow to children who are already behind on education due to covid and will now need to deal with another massive upheaval to their lives.

SEN kids could be absolutely traumatised by this, with their education and future affected in ways we can't quantify.

Then there is the state schools and teachers, who are already absolutely on their knees, will need to find resources and space for 20,000+ uprooted children.

I predict a bullying and worsened childhood mental health crisis by 2026. But yeah, "lets hope it's fast". How idiotic 🙄

I'm not going to vote Labour because I so strongly disagree with this policy. Since I also hate the Tories, God knows what I'm supposed to opt for. It's quite the shit sandwich.

However, I pay taxes which go to the state. I also educate my kids privately, which means the state is saved from funding my kids’ education. If anything being taxed appropriately would mean I should get some kind of rebate for not using state education - which is actually the case in several European countries.

What a ridiculous argument. Firstly, everyone benefits from children, and therefore the population, being educated. And secondly, we don't get rebates for services we don't use. I've not used the NHS in the last year, can I have a rebate? I've never called the fire brigade, shall we give out rebates for that?

@londonparent321 why do you think it would go through the courts first?

The government can make decisions about whether eg biscuits and cakes have VAT on them.

Then there might be a legal challenge as to whether a jaffa cake is a biscuit or a cake 😀 and so there might be a legal challenge as to whether a paid homework club is private education, say.

But the decision as to what categories attract VAT in the first place will belong to the government, not the courts.

I can't see they are going to drop it.

Assuming it comes in in sept '25 then we will have one year left to pay for ds and then he will be off to state sixth form.

Dd won't be going private. She starts sept '25.

So that's 2 more kids for the state to educate and we will save the money for uni fees.

👏🏼👏🏼 Great policy labour.

A fact indeed😂

It’s likely that if Labour decide to go ahead with VAT on school fees it will be part of the first budget which Rachel Reeves presents. This may be an ‘emergency budget’ within weeks of them taking office, or (assuming a late autumn election) it may be in spring 25. The VAT could then apply from the start of the 25/26 school year. All highly speculative, obv. We’ll see.

Maybe not so much here. My DC’s gained grammar places without tutoring. I was a ‘low income’, single parent family.

My daughter goes to a private ASD school because mainstream massively let her down. I have to pay fees and transport we get nothing. I sold my house to help pay the fees and adding VAT will make it impossible.
So yet again SEN children are being let down by the government and politicians.
Private schools aren't all about rich families.