Why is 6th form thought of more highly than attending FE college ?

[Summersunshinee]

I can never understand why if you say that you attend 6th form at school you are thought of more so than if you attended FE college.

I would feel that if anything it would be more impressive to attend FE college as you made the decision to go somewhere else and try something different /

@Starseeking So no solicitors went to college and studied Law ?

@Summersunshinee I am sure lots of people have ended up as a solicitor via attending college.
To be a solicitor you need to go to university. To go to university you need to have A-levels OR EQUIVALENT at the relevant grades.
Without looking it up I am sure there is a Btec (or equivalent) that is for studying law the same there is A-level in law.
Universities will except either.

^ that's more aimed at @Starseeking .

You asked where the perception came from; I'm giving you the reality of sixth form versus colleges near me.

Of course you could become a solicitor having been to a vocational college of the type near me, however an individual would have to do lots of extra courses, so it wouldn't be the straight route that sixth form plus uni near me would be.

I think it’s just a remnant from a long long time ago back when some unis were polytechnics etc. I don’t think it has any standing now but collective memory still believes that 6th form is better than college which were traditionally for vocational qualifications not ‘academic A-levels’. Bear in mind that a lot of the Alevels offered today such as childcare and photography etc were not a thing 30 odd years ago. If you were clever you stayed in 6th form and did A-levels and went to uni, if you weren’t you went to pledge and did vocational qualifications and apprenticeships then went straight into work.

For DS who is in year 11 a big part of his decision to stay at his school for 6th form was in his words’ the fact that he had spent 5 years building relationships with his teachers, they all know him, know and adapt for his quirks, which would be helpful while studying for A-levels instead of trying to replicate that with brand new people’

@Starseeking people's opinions will often be based on their age as different qualifications have been around over the years. It can be very much a generation thing.
I went to the local college in the 90s and I did a media course - it was a City and Guilds one, but a similar course now would be more likely to be a Btec.
My college had departments that still seemed quaintly old-fashioned. For example you could still do secretarial courses. As part of my media course we did shorthand and typing which we did along side the secretarial students. The teacher was like something from the 60s bless her !
My college was originally known as the "Technical" college although they had just dropped that part of the name but everyone still called it "The Tech". Even now people of my age (40s) who have teens might say things like "my son is going to The Tech next year" - and to the even older generation (ie grandparents) they do still associate it with that's where you go to become a secretary/hairdresser/plumber/mechanic etc.
But FE colleges and the qualifications you can gain there are very very different these days and offer much much more.
The government is now faffing around wanting to bring in T-Levels which to be honest just sounds like a lot of pointless re-branding of learning the same stuff and that is just confusing people even more.

I am probably wrong but my impression is that college is less work and easier work than 6th form. Therefore suits less academic people who take a less straightforward and longer route to university. Its a good thing imo as it means university is more achievable to a bigger cohort overall.

"I am probably wrong but my impression is that college is less work and easier work than 6th form. Therefore suits less academic people who take a less straightforward and longer route to university. Its a good thing imo as it means university is more achievable to a bigger cohort overall."

Depends on the course. Two years ago I was teaching in a school. Now I'm in a college. The students in the school did exactly the same work / homework as they do now at the college. I haven't changed my lessons or expectations one iota, because they're all sitting the same exam, so need to do exactly the same work.

My DD did two A levels and one BTEC. She didn't find a difference either way. Her biology A level was the most work, followed by her BTEC, followed by her psychology A level. She says the BTEC was the best prep she did for her current degree (AHP course at a RG uni)

I think the amount of work is more related to the qulaification and not the place you do them in. An A Level in Maths will be the same amount of work at a state sixth form, independent sixth form, sixth form college. Its just that school only offer A levels whereas colleges offer a range of qualifications, sometimes including A level, sometimes not. Some school sixth forms might do BTECs as well I'm not sure?

What the heck are T levels going to be? Are they replacing A levels or BTECS or a third qualification?

@SmartHome T-Levels are supposedly going to replace Btecs. So you would have the academic A-Levels and more technical T-Levels.
I don't really know much details but from what I have read the worry is T-Levels will have less emphasis on coursework based learning. Which a lot of the reason teens choose Btecs over A-Levels is because they WANT coursework based learning.

Our local city college is trash. Awful on ofsted and so poor for apprenticeships they’ve now been completely banned from delivering them.

T levels are meant to have a large work placement component but in reality there aren't enough work placements available or the students get on so well on the work placement they drop out of college and the college loses funding for the student etc.

BTECs have been getting more exam focused and I think T levels even more so.
So anyone who doesn't cope with exams is pretty stuffed these days.

In fact even lower down it can be an issue. My DD has been told she won't be suitable for the Level 2 City & Guilds in her course because of how it is examined, but would cope with the BTEC (she has an EHCP). Unfortunately the colleges offering the BTEC are too far away.

I think it is probably easier to pass a BTEC than an A level, but it is still very hard to get the top Distinction or Distinction star grades for BTECs.

The same course is the same amount of work wherever you sit it.

I think it is probably easier to pass a BTEC than an A level, but it is still very hard to get the top Distinction or Distinction star grades for BTECs.

I think this is true- some DC have to be sat down and told what to write to get a pass in a BTEC- it seems nobody who actually turns up to college walks away with less than a PPP, but that grade certainly won't get you into university. I think the grades my DSs achieved in their BETEC were similar in UCAS points to what they'd have achieved if they'd taken Alevels. There's no risk of freezing in an exam and totally failing, even if you're reasonably bright with BTECs.

I also think FE colleges are a better preparation for uni style learning than 6th form in a school. DS was thrilled to discover on his first day at college they were allowed to go to the toilet whenever they wanted (it had always been a bit of an issue for him at secondary school)

If i were that lads parents i would be very proud.

Do any people who attended a grammar school or even an independent school go to college post GCSE`s ?

Yes Summer. Several pupils of the private school Ds used to go to, including his friend and friend’s sister chose to go to the local college for 6th form instead.

Yes. My brother chose to go to a Sixth Form College to do A levels (from which he went on to university) rather than continue with A levels at the high quality independent boarding school where he'd taken his GCSEs.

I (and our other brother) stayed on at that school for A levels. He left. It turned out that these were the right choices for both of us for various reasons, but mainly to do with personality and being in an environment in which each of us was able to flourish.

Thats interesting. Why dont you think you could hack college ?

It wasn't a question of me not being able to hack college. I'd been to a number of schools earlier on including a comprehensive from age 11 to the run up to my GCSEs. Family reasons meant we moved around a bit and I unexpectedly ended up at an independent boarding school for three years. So I was well used to moving to and from different educational environments.

I don't doubt I'd probably have been perfectly happy at a Sixth Form College and would have got on with what I needed to do. It's just that I had a good friendship group already at that particular school which had a particular bond as we moved on together and I knew, rated and liked my teachers who would be continuing to teach me at A level. My brother, by contrast, was ready for a change. As he has liked to do from time to time in his life ever since, with his career path etc. Just indicative of our different personalities I guess.

There were a few boys on my DSs BTEC engineering course who had been to the super selective grammar school. The course offered Maths A level along side it for the most able, which seemed to make it a popular course. Several of boys had parents in engineering, and I suspect many went on to degree apprenticeships rather than just a degree.

The only person I know who went to college after an independent school dropped out of A levels. I don't think he was particularly academic, and probably shouldn't have started A levels. His parents were very angry/disappointed with him and were not at all supportive of him going to college, and I think he ended up on a level 2 course, and then couldn't complete the level three. He eventually found himself an apprenticeship as a HGV mechanic and now seems very happy. I think he'd have probably have ended up in the same place had he gone to college in the first place but his teen years would have been happier if his parents had accepted that was the right route for him. And he could have completed the level 3 BTEC.

I think it's a proven socio economic thing that certain students are more likely to go to uni with BTECS.

That`s sad his parents didn't support his choices.

My son knows someone who went to local super selective grammar then sixth form college for A levels but dropped out, now doing a carpentry apprentiship. Most have stayed there for sixth form. At his independent most also stay for sixth form, a few go to grammar or a different school for sixth form and one or two to sixth form college if they don't do well enough on GCSEs to stay at the school for sixth form - either generally or in certain subjects they want to do at A level. The school says they have to have a 7 in the subject if doing it at A level, college says 6.

People often think college = vocational education. And this country does not properly value vocational education. The Gove reforms have not helped this perception.

It also doesn't help that provision is so varied depending on where you are. In my patch, there's only one standalone 6th form college that provides A levels - all the other colleges are purely vocational and if you want to do A levels, you need your school's 6th form (most have one). In other places it's completely different. Personally I think that what matters is what's right for each individual student depending on their future plans and their talents.

Very true regarding vocational education.

Why don`t more middle class parents encourage vocational subjects ?