Why is 6th form thought of more highly than attending FE college ?

[Summersunshinee]

I can never understand why if you say that you attend 6th form at school you are thought of more so than if you attended FE college.

I would feel that if anything it would be more impressive to attend FE college as you made the decision to go somewhere else and try something different /

They are being prejudice, but they are just very polite about it.

Back to this post. You do realise that the Brit school is partly funded by the government ?

Which given were in a cost of living crisis and a recession or economic slow down is more than likely on the horizon.

Then yes close it as tax payers money could be better used elsewhere.

Get out of that one.

So nothing is stimulating about creating some good food, building a nice flower bed out of bricks, making a nice wood carving ?

When someone has tools in their hands they can`t get up to any mischief.

So nothing is stimulating about creating some good food, building a nice flower bed out of bricks, making a nice wood carving ?
To me, personally, no. Especially not bricklaying. I did get a certain satisfaction from rebuilding our garden wall when DD reversed into it when she was learning to drive I suppose but I think that was more the satisfaction of not having to pay a builder, I didn't enjoy the task itself. But I don't have an issue with other people loving such things and I certainly don't think they should be prevented from doing them. All sounds a bit frivolous for you though, I thought you only believed in people learning entirely functional skills? Food, I'll grant you is essential for life, and we need flowers to maintain healthy eco systems, but it doesn't need to be particularly tasty food to meet our nutritional needs and flowers don't need to be arranged in beds to do their job. And wood carving - "nice" wood carving at that - sounds positively decadent. Hang on..it couldn't be that people like tasty food, aesthetically pleasing gardens and wood carvings because things like that enhance their lives and improve their well being could it? You know, like some people enjoy music, dance and drama? Why is planting flowers in an attractive way or creating a wooden ornament on your approved list of activities but learning an instrument or reciting the words of a great playwright is a waste of time and money? There is no logic whatsoever in your arguments. Along with...
When someone has tools in their hands they can`t get up to any mischief.
Really? Nobody ever got up to any kind of mischief with a Stanley knife or a claw hammer in their hands? I kind of doubt that. I can think of rather a lot of nefarious uses for tools actually. I'd say it's probably harder to get into mischief with a cello in your hands but I still wouldn't call that a strong argument for universally enforced string quartet membership. Because for about the billionth time, not everyone is the same and a functional society requires a wide range of individuals with different aptitudes and interests. Our goal should be to value people for who they are and the talents they have, not to try to shove square pegs into round holes. Treating people equitably does not mean treating everyone identically. There are inequalities in society for sure and improving training and opportunities for those with more practical skills is a very good idea. But it doesn't need to involve making academic education worse. Why is this so hard to understand?

@Summersunshinee yes I know the Brit School is a state school. That’s what is fantastic about it.

@Summersunshinee to make a “nice wood carving” a person is more likely to want to go to an art school rather than a vocational trade school. So if (under your plan for utopia) art schools similar to the Brit are closed down where are they going to learn their skills?

@Summersunshinee you know you have made me angry now.
My child is autistic and has anxiety and other issues including (thankfully not at the moment) suicidal thoughts.
What she loves is musical theatre, films, tv shows, books, computer games and being creative. It’s her way of escaping a world she doesn’t understand and feel she fits into.
So if you want a world that takes all that away go and live on an empty island somewhere and start up your amazing utopia. I am not sure how many people would want to join you though.
Whatever happened to you to hate 6th Form so much please go and get some therapy about it.

@Summersunshinee One of the skills in discussion / debate is to be able to see the other persons point of view, even if you disagree with it.

• We understand that you think kids are pushed into A levels & 6th form at school rather than being encouraged to look at vocational qualifications.
• We understand that you think that college broadens experience for students and is therefore always a preferable place to be for all children.
• We understand you think all students should be made to do at least some vocational qualification even if it means it reduces time for academic qualifications they are really interested in and have more aptitude for.
• We also now understand that your view of suitable vocational qualifications does not include 'arts' such as drama and music.

Now, please do us the courtesy of explaining back your understanding of our position in as neutral a way as possible.

@TeenDivided not holding my breath here... I didn't get the quotes I asked for, just a load of point-missing resentment.

What makes me laugh is OP calling us prejudiced against college at all times. The quote about the mote in God's eye springs to.mind.

The OP is now private messaging me asking me to contribute, after I already said we had already been here. The OP knows why I am sensitive with regards to arts provision from earlier on in the thread (similar reasons to needmorelego) but still won't let it lie.

They are being deliberately goady whilst pretending to be nice.

@Comefromaway Can you block users on PM? I would do that and then hide this thread. I hide it every now and then, and only come back for amusement when I'm feeling strong enough, the OP isn't worth getting upset over.

They are being prejudice, but they are just very polite about it.
No, they're not being prejudiced. They are just disagreeing with you and describing their personal experiences. Not the same thing.
Let's look at a few definitions of prejudice which can be found easily on line.
"unfounded or pigeonholed beliefs"
"any unreasonable attitude that is unusually resistant to rational influence"
"feeling, favourable or unfavourable, toward a person or thing, prior to, or not based on, actual experience"
"transfer of a value-laden meaning content onto a socially-formed category and then on to individuals who are taken to belong to that category, resistance to change, and overgeneralization"
"dislike, hostility, or unjust behaviour deriving from preconceived and unfounded opinions"
"unfavourable opinion or feeling formed beforehand or without knowledge, thought, or reason"
I particularly like the second definition. Ring any bells?

@MrsAvocet I think OP's definition of 'prejudiced' is essentially 'does not agree with me'.

Also uner @Summersunshinee 's proposals, nobody will be learning advanced maths and sciences, so environmental conservation will be toast. No more avocets!

No problem.

>I feel that they should consider not options 6th form and college. They should at least go to a taster day at college to see what it`s like so they can form an opinion.

>I feel that post 16 school can be a confiding environment and that going to college is more grown up environment. No uniforms, no detentions, no younger kids messing around.

>I feel that a vocational subject could open new doors and perhaps uncover skills and interests they didn't realise they even had and could even help academically wise.

>Mabey I was abit hard on arts, music and drama.

The Mumsnet user base is small c conservative in many ways. Evidence:

• the fetishisation of universities such as York, Exeter and Durham over red bricks in post-industrial cities for no good reason
• the work section headers focussing on very traditional “professions”
• the over-representation (vs the general population) of parents sending their kids to private and even boarding schools!

I apologise if I have upset you. I have to admit my knowledge of the autism spectrum is limited.

Outside of theatre, films, tv shows etc what else interests her.

I held out the olive branch.

@MrsAvocet So you got satisfaction from building a wall. That`s good so you must have enjoyed it.

Also if someone has tools in their hands they can`t do things like gamble or take drugs.

@Madeintheshade Have you read the thread? A lot of the posters have kids at college doing vocational courses, myself included.

However (for the umpteenth time)

• Some areas only offer A levels at school 6th forms, so if they want to do A levels they need to stay within the 'school' system.
• College can be considered and dismissed quite quickly if it doesn't offer desired courses
• Some teens are not quite ready for a college environment - people develop at different rates
• It can be preferable to some to stay at a school they know where the teachers know them and vice versa
• Sometimes schools are the only 'local' offer and the down sides of length of travel do not make up for other benefits
• Mix and matching vocational and academic is not only not generally possible, but often would harm an academic student from progressing as they wouldn't have the right qualifications for the next step

In summary students should be encouraged to do the course they wish to do at the institution they wish to do it at whether that is 6th form or college, A levels or vocational or apprenticeship.

They should not all be forced into vocational at college.

Also if someone has tools in their hands they can`t do things like gamble or take drugs.
Well that is just rubbish.

@Summersunshinee but lots of people manage to live life without building walls and yet also avoid drugs... Vocational training is not a vaccine against addiction. If it were,my late husband wouldn't have ended up hooked on alcohol.

There are plenty of 6th forms without uniform and separate from the younger kids. Ours is like that.

Conversely, at DD's college a lot of the students have 'uniform' for practical days. DD's includes overalls and steel capped boots, no makeup, nail polish or false nails.

Outside of music nothing interests my son. Without music & drama at school he would not have attended school and so would not have his maths & English GCSEs. (He still failed science)

Music, not holding a hammer, kept his friend away from drugs and getting into trouble with a bad crowd, he was on the verge of being expelled; discovered music, the music teacher gave him a safe haven and a sense of self worth and he ended up with good GCSEs.

My son can earn between £250-£500 per week PART TIME whilst at Uni from music.

Yes, I work in the construction industry, plenty of people with alcohol, gambling and substance abuse in the industry.