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Original poster

Pagan faith school / college

258 replies

DaughtersofFrya · 06/04/2023 18:28

There are many faith schools, but no Pagan ones, and I'd be interested to hear some opinions on the subject. Would you like to have attended one, or would you consider sending your children to one in the future, for example?

OP posts:
Original poster
DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 08:49

Hobbi · 08/04/2023 08:47

@DaughtersofFrya

"And what about parents who home school and have more than four children?"

A somewhat facetious question. Are you suggesting you know of a viable, registered organisation with unpaid teachers in classes of four or less or with classes entirely of siblings? And again, seeing as you are correcting other's terminology, there is no 'homeschooling' in England.

When people teach their kids at home, what term would you suggest, then, instead of home schooling?

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Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 08:52

so 7/8 of you live in a house, and want to start taking in children as boarders to live as pagans while receiving their education? Mostly, lessons will be in the garden. The 7/8 don't have any qualifications, and will teach without being paid. The parents will pay you something. Am I right so far?

How many bedrooms do you have empty? That is one question! but also, where is your current income coming from, and what will happen to it when you are teaching instead? Whose house is it? And what happens if one of the community fails the DBS check? Do they have to leave their home?

What about all the other stuff, catering, food hygiene certificates, fire exits, first aiders, home insurance, exam fees, SEND?

What sort of discipline policy will there be? How many children are you wanting to take? It cant be more than 3-4, can it? In the sort of set up you are describing. Do you have children in mind already? Do you have interest from parents?

Has this started being planned, or is it just an idea right now?

Mumoftwoinprimary · 08/04/2023 08:52

I’m really confused. So you currently have 7 of you who live together, are female, pagan and celibate plus a few others who come and stay?

Are there children in the 7? Is it them that you are going to be educating? Because that seems fine - it is just home ed - a fairly common practice that enables people to (for good or for ill) shape their children’s education.

But I can’t see how you get from that to being somewhere that people are happy to send their kids to?

Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 08:58

DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 08:32

Once the school is established, we will look into the possibility of hiring premises for things like science experiments. There's a school near us that hires its facilities out, for example. Insurance will also need to be looked into.

With regard to celibacy, its a prerequisite for members of our group.

Show quote history

but you would have to pay a qualified teacher too, that is what \I am saying, you cant run a science practical class without a qualified science teacher in the room, in this country. Where is this teacher coming from?

And it isn't just a case of renting out a lab, either. Where are all your chemicals and resources coming from? YOu need specific chemicals as specified by the exam board, you need someone qualified in handling them (a technician, not a teacher) and you need storage facilities that conform to stand safety requirements. You will not be able to store radio active sources, for example, or agar jelly, on your premises, or in someone elses school

Hobbi · 08/04/2023 09:00

@DaughtersofFrya

"When people teach their kids at home, what term would you suggest, then, instead of home schooling?"

The legal term, elective home education. There's a reason for that specific wording. Are you intending to register as a school or have groups of 4 or less EHE children? If you offered the latter, but took payment for it and housed all the children, you may run in to some legal problems. If the former, you haven't answered anyone's questions about DBS checks or an unqualified person's capacity to teach formal qualifications.

marcopront · 08/04/2023 09:04

A typical lesson will be conducted outdoors, either in the open, or in a large tent/small marquee depending on weather and time of year.

I really hope you are not one of the ones planning on teaching.

I am not convinced you know what the standard subjects are. You keep adding more subjects you might "teach"

Your focus is on the venue of the lesson not the content.

Any thoughts on differentiation?
That could be either the idea of students having varied needs or the mathematical concept.

Original poster
DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 09:05

Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 08:52

so 7/8 of you live in a house, and want to start taking in children as boarders to live as pagans while receiving their education? Mostly, lessons will be in the garden. The 7/8 don't have any qualifications, and will teach without being paid. The parents will pay you something. Am I right so far?

How many bedrooms do you have empty? That is one question! but also, where is your current income coming from, and what will happen to it when you are teaching instead? Whose house is it? And what happens if one of the community fails the DBS check? Do they have to leave their home?

What about all the other stuff, catering, food hygiene certificates, fire exits, first aiders, home insurance, exam fees, SEND?

What sort of discipline policy will there be? How many children are you wanting to take? It cant be more than 3-4, can it? In the sort of set up you are describing. Do you have children in mind already? Do you have interest from parents?

Has this started being planned, or is it just an idea right now?

Most lessons will be in a nearby nature reserve, rather than our own garden.

As for parental payment, we're still considering alternatives to this. One thing's for sure, if parents have to contribute, it will be on an ability to pay basis, and some, at least, won't have to.

Currently two bedrooms are empty but there are other rooms that can be put to different uses.

I'm confident that none of our members would fail a DBS check.

Catering will be done by us. We already have communal meals.

We are thinking of about four to start with, and already have interest. It's already in the planning stage.

OP posts:
Original poster
DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 09:06

Mumoftwoinprimary · 08/04/2023 08:52

I’m really confused. So you currently have 7 of you who live together, are female, pagan and celibate plus a few others who come and stay?

Are there children in the 7? Is it them that you are going to be educating? Because that seems fine - it is just home ed - a fairly common practice that enables people to (for good or for ill) shape their children’s education.

But I can’t see how you get from that to being somewhere that people are happy to send their kids to?

No, we have no children here.

OP posts:
Original poster
DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 09:08

Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 08:58

but you would have to pay a qualified teacher too, that is what \I am saying, you cant run a science practical class without a qualified science teacher in the room, in this country. Where is this teacher coming from?

And it isn't just a case of renting out a lab, either. Where are all your chemicals and resources coming from? YOu need specific chemicals as specified by the exam board, you need someone qualified in handling them (a technician, not a teacher) and you need storage facilities that conform to stand safety requirements. You will not be able to store radio active sources, for example, or agar jelly, on your premises, or in someone elses school

Show quote history

These are considerations for the future, when the school is established. We won't be holding such lessons to start with.

OP posts:
Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 09:08

I think you have the basis of a really lovely idea, but are being unrealistic in a number of ways.

I think you should look into setting up a free school, and you are going to need to employ qualified staff.

Also, you should look into teacher training yourselves, then you could be qualified staff.

Also, opting out of modern education because you dont like it is not necessarily in the interests of the child, because the qualifications needed to have choice in your life are those acquired through mainstream education. Archeology and astronomy sound like lovey GCSEs, but in reality they are hard academic work, and I am not sure this is what you are looking for

I think you need to commit to a certain number of specific GCSEs, say, 6 maybe, maths, English, 2x science, and two more

There are theatre schools that dived the week up, 3 days academic learning, 2 days theatre, or there are dance and music schools that divide the timetable up, mornings are normal academics and afternoons are something else.

You could maybe do that? Have part of the school timetable for academics and the rest for your pagan, outdoor, forest school type things?

Do any of your community speak a modern european language? It could maybe be a bilingual school? French/ English for example,

I think you are trying to set up a lovely school where children will be happy and fulfilled, and I am sorry, but in reality, children dont like learning much, a lot of the time! and they still have to do it.

I hope it works

Pinkdelight3 · 08/04/2023 09:08

Look, I love the outdoors but it's simply not practical to do a full school curriculum in a nature reserve, not even in a tent. It's a nice extra that you could do for a summer camp or forest school style stint, but not the full thing. Even the school in Summer Isle had a building with desks.

Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 09:10

I mean a "Free School" as in the legal entity, rather than a school which is free

Goodread1 · 08/04/2023 09:10

@Nimbostratus100

That's quite interesting how is steiner school pagan then?

First I have heard about that,

I didn't know that,

Is that officially allowed for a steiner school to mention anything vaguely pagan then?

Original poster
DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 09:10

Hobbi · 08/04/2023 09:00

@DaughtersofFrya

"When people teach their kids at home, what term would you suggest, then, instead of home schooling?"

The legal term, elective home education. There's a reason for that specific wording. Are you intending to register as a school or have groups of 4 or less EHE children? If you offered the latter, but took payment for it and housed all the children, you may run in to some legal problems. If the former, you haven't answered anyone's questions about DBS checks or an unqualified person's capacity to teach formal qualifications.

We expect to have four or less, at least to start with. Such legal issues can be dealt with later, when they arise.

I've already said that there is no problem with DBS checks.

OP posts:
Original poster
DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 09:13

marcopront · 08/04/2023 09:04

A typical lesson will be conducted outdoors, either in the open, or in a large tent/small marquee depending on weather and time of year.

I really hope you are not one of the ones planning on teaching.

I am not convinced you know what the standard subjects are. You keep adding more subjects you might "teach"

Your focus is on the venue of the lesson not the content.

Any thoughts on differentiation?
That could be either the idea of students having varied needs or the mathematical concept.

Yes, you're right, the focus is indeed more on the environment than the content. The latter will be decided depending on circumstances, so it's no surprise I can't answer specifically.

OP posts:
Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 09:16

Goodread1 · 08/04/2023 09:10

@Nimbostratus100

That's quite interesting how is steiner school pagan then?

First I have heard about that,

I didn't know that,

Is that officially allowed for a steiner school to mention anything vaguely pagan then?

The steiner beleifs are about worshiping the beings in the fire, and the soil, ( I have been told it is not praying!)and in reincarnation, and telepathy, and karma, and so on. Not all their staff, believe in all of this, because they wouldnt have enough staff, otherwise, but when I enquired about a job in a steiner school once, before I new what it was, the first question was "are you telepathic" and I was told at the moment they were only sending applications out to teachers who are... since then I have had more interactions with the school, professionally, and come across the chanting to the gnome spirit in the fire, and worshipping the soil, etc,

anyway, lets not distract from this very interesting thread

Original poster
DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 09:16

Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 09:08

I think you have the basis of a really lovely idea, but are being unrealistic in a number of ways.

I think you should look into setting up a free school, and you are going to need to employ qualified staff.

Also, you should look into teacher training yourselves, then you could be qualified staff.

Also, opting out of modern education because you dont like it is not necessarily in the interests of the child, because the qualifications needed to have choice in your life are those acquired through mainstream education. Archeology and astronomy sound like lovey GCSEs, but in reality they are hard academic work, and I am not sure this is what you are looking for

I think you need to commit to a certain number of specific GCSEs, say, 6 maybe, maths, English, 2x science, and two more

There are theatre schools that dived the week up, 3 days academic learning, 2 days theatre, or there are dance and music schools that divide the timetable up, mornings are normal academics and afternoons are something else.

You could maybe do that? Have part of the school timetable for academics and the rest for your pagan, outdoor, forest school type things?

Do any of your community speak a modern european language? It could maybe be a bilingual school? French/ English for example,

I think you are trying to set up a lovely school where children will be happy and fulfilled, and I am sorry, but in reality, children dont like learning much, a lot of the time! and they still have to do it.

I hope it works

The theatre schools you mention sound very similar to what we have in mind. We certainly don't wish to neglect the standard subjects, but our focus will be elsewhere.

Yes, one of our members is German.

OP posts:
Goodread1 · 08/04/2023 09:18

I think a Pagan faith/ Alternative faith based including indigenous cultural faiths too,

To have a college a place of learning

You could have a mix of online and face to face learning too

Could be a brief taster school course /workshops to a more longer course....

Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 09:19

I do think @DaughtersofFrya that you are not so far away from main stream teacher ideologically as you may think you are. I am no pagan, but very keen on outdoor education, and appreciating the natural world, and caring for the environment, and giving students different experiences, and a balanced education. I think most teachers are. I dont think you would have any ideological objections to the Free school model

Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 09:21

DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 09:16

The theatre schools you mention sound very similar to what we have in mind. We certainly don't wish to neglect the standard subjects, but our focus will be elsewhere.

Yes, one of our members is German.

Show quote history

well, that is one GCSE covered then, and the advantage is you could actually be doing some of youe pagan things in German, and children are learning towards their GCSE and your pagan curriculum at the same time. What are your colleagues qualifications Could she do a PGCE this coming year? then thats three birds with one stone, modern MFL, pagan curriculum and qualified teacher

Original poster
DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 09:23

Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 09:19

I do think @DaughtersofFrya that you are not so far away from main stream teacher ideologically as you may think you are. I am no pagan, but very keen on outdoor education, and appreciating the natural world, and caring for the environment, and giving students different experiences, and a balanced education. I think most teachers are. I dont think you would have any ideological objections to the Free school model

You may be right, but as I understand it, free schools are more restricted in what they can do, since they are government funded. Is that the sort of free school you were referring to?

OP posts:
Original poster
DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 09:25

Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 09:21

well, that is one GCSE covered then, and the advantage is you could actually be doing some of youe pagan things in German, and children are learning towards their GCSE and your pagan curriculum at the same time. What are your colleagues qualifications Could she do a PGCE this coming year? then thats three birds with one stone, modern MFL, pagan curriculum and qualified teacher

Show quote history

Yes, there is no reason why she, or indeed any of us, could not acquire such qualifications.

OP posts:
Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 09:26

DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 09:23

You may be right, but as I understand it, free schools are more restricted in what they can do, since they are government funded. Is that the sort of free school you were referring to?

Show quote history

I dont really know, but my understanding is very unrestricted, I have worked in a free school, they can set their own timetable and curriculum, and they did.

But of course, it wasn't that different to other schools because we were all working to the same end, 9 GCSEs, including the Ebacc. We did teach astronomy as aGCSE subject though - hard work!

As I understand it, you take tell the government what your school will be like, and if they agree that is ok, they fund it. And it is supposed to be lmuch less restricted

Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 09:28

DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 09:25

Yes, there is no reason why she, or indeed any of us, could not acquire such qualifications.

Show quote history

I think going and getting PGCEs could help a lot - of course it would put your plans back a couple of years.... and also, you would probably hate it, but it would be a worthwhile experience

Original poster
DaughtersofFrya · 08/04/2023 09:29

Nimbostratus100 · 08/04/2023 09:26

I dont really know, but my understanding is very unrestricted, I have worked in a free school, they can set their own timetable and curriculum, and they did.

But of course, it wasn't that different to other schools because we were all working to the same end, 9 GCSEs, including the Ebacc. We did teach astronomy as aGCSE subject though - hard work!

As I understand it, you take tell the government what your school will be like, and if they agree that is ok, they fund it. And it is supposed to be lmuch less restricted

Show quote history

In that case it may well be something worth looking into more, if the school grows beyond four.

OP posts: