Son possibly being excluded for throwing object ar teacher - advice wanted

[Stressyball]

My son (year 11) got into a dispute with a teacher yesterday during school and threw an object at her in anger. I’ve been invited in tomorrow and I’m worried he may be getting excluded and don’t know what to do.

BG my son is a hot head but lovely. The teacher had separated him from his friends in the class due to them previously mucking about (what kid doesn’t right?) and received the normal warnings that they get before a detention. He admitted he got frustrated at her when she told him to get to work instead of asking her to move seats (literacy is not his strong point and he hates it.) After he threw the object (which did NOT hit her) he received the detention and he thought that was it but now school are saying it’s serious.

i personally think the detention is enough as he understands why it’s wrong. How can I convince the school not to exclude him over this? And advice on dealing with this?

Thank you - unfortunately not. My mum has terminal cancer and my brother is in Dubai so no other people around to help, which is part of our reason to move here. Whilst not condoning violence he has a history of getting very frustrated with schoolwork, and struggles when he doesn’t understand. Again not an excuse but we are living in a very bad area of glasgow so he has been attending a good school (we went private), and I know that he feels very stupid (his words not mine) compared to his peers. I’ve been doing everything I can to keep him in the “right” crowd, as locally there is a lot of youth violence and I just feel like I’m failing in every way. I’m trying to be optimistic that the sweet boy I knew is still there, and this whole situation makes me very sad.

Sadly it’s absolutely not. I honestly came here for support, as I have no one to talk to about this at home.

OP, if you have the money to send him private, why not just move to a nicer area?

Most private schools don’t have great SEN provision, and I’m sure if he is illiterate in a private school he does feel “stupid” compared to his peers. I’m surprised he passed the entrance exam if he is illiterate? Also surprised a private school has a literacy remedial programme.

I also think the likelihood of a private school keeping him on the roll after assaulting a teacher is zero - I wouldn’t be worried about exclusion so much as flat out expulsion. Certainly no private school I know would keep a violent child on the books.

I don’t know if you are changing details to avoid being outing, embellishing because you are getting slated, or if you are just taking a really odd approach to schooling, but this story is not making a lot of sense.

Stop minimising his behaviour. He deserves to be excluded

Completely agree with this.

OP I hope today goes well, you need to stay calm and not minimise his behaviour in the meeting. No who doesn’t muck around, dispute, it missed etc…

I am assuming the school do know his background and they are offering SEN support (for those who say private schools don’t - there is a huge variety). This will be taken into account. No school wants to permanently exclude in the last year of education.

He needs to acknowledge his mistake, with no justification, “I’m sorry, but…”is not good enough. Discuss the plans for anger management.

I don’t know how often he is in trouble but if this was unusual then a conversation and a detention might be sufficient, (another detention the first was for being disruptive the second is for throwing something). If this is an escalation of previous behaviour then I would expect a fixed term suspension. However if this is the last in a long line of incidents then yes permanent exclusion will be considered.

Remember to you he is your little boy but most year 11 or S5 boys are bigger than the female teachers and the situation like you described is scary for the teacher (and often the other students a well)

I find it slightly ? that the OP has paid for private education to avoid the wrong sort of children! He is obviously one himself.

The advice above is good. It’s best to explain what his frustrations are and definitely plead for him to stay at the school as it’s y11. No child mucked around like this at private schools I know do they may well decide he’s too much trouble. It sounds like the school is not selective so ask what can be put in place to help his anger management. In a private school I suspect not much. They are more likely to help with dyslexia.

Do not condone his behaviour. If he’s allowed to stay, you must talk to them about what help he needs and what he must do.

Again not an excuse but we are living in a very bad area of glasgow so he has been attending a good school (we went private), and I know that he feels very stupid (his words not mine) compared to his peers.

Then he does need to try to keep his place. Turning up at a local comp in the wrong end of Glasgow could be a nightmare for him.

I can see why he would feel the way he does if he's not living in the best part of town & isn't academically too of the class. I imagine lots of the kids are from privileged backgrounds.

I don't think his behaviour is acceptable but I also don't think it would be a permanent exclusion tbh. I think they will issue a stern warning & maybe a few days home learning.

Of course a private school can do what it wants regarding asking pupils to leave. Why would they tolerate this behaviour? However in y11 I would ask for him to stay as going elsewhere will be difficult.

A private school still has to follow its own procedures.

How did you get on today OP?

You need to stop minimising his behaviour and trying to help him get away with things, this is not ok. Hopefully he will have a short fixed term exclusion and then be back at school very soon. This sounds like a terrible set up for him though, it's awful that your mum is terminally ill but this move sounds like it is not good for him at all. I would have put him first personally and not dreamed of moving a troubled child to a very rough area, very far from home and then put him in a private school where he feels stupid due to his SEN. It's quite simply a recipe for disaster and he has many, many years ahead of him to pay the price.

Anyway you say he is dyslexic, and hot headed with a temper - how is his concentration? His sleeping? Energy levels? Just asking because often people have more than one ND diagnosis and I'm thinking ADHD could be a real possibility here - the kids I've known with ADHD I would also describe as hotheaded and having a temper, easily frustrated etc. I would seriously start looking into it, not as an excuse for his behaviour but so he can hopefully get the help he needs to manage it.

@SkygardenTower
Yes. OP should have been given them. They are often less clear than state ones which operate within a legal framework.

Your son has to learn to control his temper, he should not be throwing things at his teacher.

My advice would be to back the school all the way, and make it incredibly clear to him that his behaviour is completely unacceptable and that you do NOT condone it.
Until this page, you have just been excusing and 'normalising' his behaviour. You even seemed to think that it didn't matter that he threw something at a teacher simply because he wasn't accurate with his throwing

Long term, in terms of parenting him in to adulthood, the best you can do for him is to get him to understand this is completely unacceptable.

Lots of teens have parents who divorced. Lots of us parents have had cancer. That does not mean you can a) mess around in class b) not move when asked c) throw things at people. You have now admitted he has a history of poor behaviour.
Why do you think the other pupils should have their schooling disrupted by him ?
Why do you think anyone should have to put up with being physically abused in their workplace?

Do not try and minimise this. You are doing him no favours at all.

What a deeply unpleasant comment.

Why do you say it is unpleasant ?

It sounds quite feasible for a person whose poor behaviour is being excused by his mother at 15 or 16, to grow into a 25 yr old who thinks it is okay to tantrum and throw things when he doesn't get everything going his way.

@Kite22 There's a new set of parody insult posters who pop on to nearly every thread at the moment simply to berate others, telling them that comments are unpleasant/unkind and often suggesting therapy/counselling.

If they're ignored, perhaps the regrettable fad will pass sooner.

It’s more the not too subtle suggestion that he’ll end up abusing / bullying his wife.

Someone asks for advice after their son throws a pencil sharpener and gets comments like that implying he’s an irredeemable, nasty piece of work and that the parenting is to blame.

What outstanding powers of judgement some people have. It must be down to that breadth of view from their high horse.

OP. For what it’s worth; he needs to take the punishment. Hopefully it will shock him and upset him. If so, good. Tell him to never, ever do it again and if he feels that level of anger and aggression to simply stand up and walk away.

When I read the title of this thread I thought it was talking about a 4-5 year old Reception child! Your son is just a short few years away from employment.. yes he knows it's wrong (I should think a 4 year old would know it's wrong!) but he needs to learn to control his anger in a different way otherwise how will this play out when he is working and someone tells him to do something he doesn't want to do.
The best way to deal with it is to get your son some professional help for his anger - as he is already lashing out at a person in authority - will it be the police next?
School wise you want to explain that you are getting your son help for his anger and ask if there also anything they can do in school to help with that (may have people he can talk to or things he can access) & that if he is excluded he is just likely to fall further behind and you don't want that, and your son doesn't want that either and is (hopefully) willing to make a real effort in school this year with his work and his behaviour.
I hope your son understands not that it's not only wrong - but how serious this really is.

If he’s dyslexic, what help does he get from school for that? It often leads to frustration.

If he’s dyslexic, what help does he get from school for that? It often leads to frustration.

OP has covered that.

He is dyslexic and this was a specialist intervention class to support dyslexic students or those struggling in other areas.

He threw the pencil sharpener after being moved from his friends for pissing about. Then there was a 'debate' about him not doing his work after which he lobbed a pencil sharpener.

DH is dyslexic, he never threw things around at school (mainly because MIL would have gone ballistic instead of trying to make excuses for him).

Teachers should feel safe at school and so should other children. Kids who throw objects deliberately at others should get a fixed term exclusion. Your DS is very much in the wrong.

Wonder if this is just designed to get a reaction.

However, If genuine, OP sounds like one of those nightmare parents who will always fight against school and defend their child regardless of what they have done. They will always argue their child is lovely and there are justifications for the behaviour and minimise it and look to wheedle out of whatever punishment or sanction is in place.

Does it actually benefit DS? OP thinks so, but actually it just teaches him that there are no consequences for his actions. Today it’s throwing a pencil sharpener at a teacher and who knows what will be next if the message is that they are like Teflon and nothing can stick on them. And then this kind of parent thinks all authority is out to get their child. What about when it’s the Police…will she be arguing he should be let off then?

Honestly, when kids have done wrong, they need to be taught by parents to own it and the consequences. That is the best parenting. That is the thing that helps them grow and stop doing that kind of thing again hopefully.

He has a history of anger and misbehaviour, and this demonstrates that he is not managing to get that under control. He had a detention warning for not working, and rather than act on that warning, not only did he not get down to work, he let his behaviour deteriorate further. Just a detention is obviously NOT enough, as the warning of it was not enough to prevent this happening. I think you need to recognise and accept that. If you were taking action at home as well, that might help, but otherwise they need to move beyond just a detention at school.

So it does look like there might need to be some sort of wake-up call to get him to realise how important this is. He probably does need some help with anger management, and you might ask the school whether they are able to help you access this for him.

If he's lucky, it might be a fixed-term exclusion and accessing some help with controlling his behaviour. If it's a permanent exclusion, then he can still count himself lucky - because if this had been on an apprenticeship, he'd be straight out without anyone having any responsibility for finding him any alternative (if he's in a private school they don't have that responsibility - but at least the local council will).