Do your homework and work hard or you'll end up working in a bloody factory!

[mids2019]

This message was a lot in the 70s where I grew up.

Absolutely inappropriate now but is there a grain of truth in this approach (rephrased of course?)

Cannot BEAR phrases like that. If you don’t work hard you will end up a binman/stacking shelves/flipping burgers.

I could never instill into my children that these jobs were wrong or beneath them or that the people doing them had somehow failed at life.

Instead I remind them that choices are the most important thing in life and that working hard gives them more choices to do whatever they want. The more choices they have, the more options they have.

I could never single out an occupation and tell my kids…’ If you don’t work hard in school you will end up doing THAT’. That’s disgusting.
They could have friend’s parents that are doing that job. I never, ever want my children to look down on anyone for the job they do.

It didn't take long did it?
From 'society' supposedly appreciating 'key workers' to using the fear of ending up in one of 'those jobs' to keep middle class kids motivated.

Why are you bringing class into this? Most people want their children to have options open to them, and instilling a good work ethic is important whatever job someone does.

You are not going to last long working on the bins if the rest of the team is having to carry you because you are the only one not putting in the effort.

I used to say 'stacking shelves at Tesco'. Actually working in a supermarket is not a bad job at all and my sons' mates who do (gap year) are earning quite well and the work is very varied. Plus opportunity for advancement!

That is such a dated thing to say...

It is perfectly possible to encourage kids to do their best at school but simply pointing out if will give them more choice and control over their lives.

There is no need to denigrate certain jobs in the process.

Manual work is needed to get the economy to function. You only have to look at the impact of the worker shortage created by Brexit to realise how key to our lives these roles are...

I think Covid also showed us that society does not really need another accountant or lawyer but would fall apart without delivery drivers, supermarket workers, healthcare professionals and factory workers (who do you think helped produced all this PPE equipments, vaccine packs, masks and so on...).

I always think anyone who goes out, does an honest job and does it to the best of their abilities should be applauded. The rest is snobbery.

What a shit thread! People are out doing an honest days work! Not everyone is ambitious. What about the gold diggers who marry for money? I see plenty of these around. Never done a data work in their life’s. I work in a warehouse because it suits my life. I work school hours, four days a week.

Maybe the modern equivalent should be to suggest that if they don’t try their best they are much more likely to end up on benefits and / or unemployed.

I don’t really care what job my children do (and yes, that includes working on the bins) as long as they are happy and healthy.

Teachers always say they’re overworked and stressed etc - but they try and put off people from becoming teachers. Then teachers complain that there’s a shortage of teachers, under staffing and that nobody wants to train to become one.

What do you want them to do? Lie and say it's all fine? Encouraging our children or others to go into teaching will not solve the problems in the education system. The shortage of teachers is a symptom, not a cause. Teachers who advise others not to go into teaching are probably hoping that if the shortages get bad enough, the government will realise it will have to try addressing the underlying issues rather than papering over the cracks.

@Goatinthegarden - that sounds like a grearlt life lesson!

To what extent does parental background (and arguably) privilege have in the advice given to children about their future life prospects?

A huge amount. We are not wealthy, but are teachers with a mc background and went to top universities. Our (teen) dc are very bright, but there's no doubt their aspirations and expectations are very much affected by their upbringing and our attitude to education.

GCHeretic
yes that’s what I tell my kids. What would I be teaching them if I was shaming other peoples jobs?

The best job that I ever had in terms of feeling valued by management, actually doing something worthwhile, low stress, and there being a huge bonus in having great colleagues, was when I worked in a factory. The pay wasn’t bad either.

I have never been ambitious, but always worked, never claimed unemployment benefits in my life. Worked in menial low paid jobs as others have put it since I was 15. I suffer from very bad anxiety, so this suited me. I’m happy I have a lovely big detached house, newish car and happy. Of course I tell my kids to work hard at school, so they don’t become unemployed and on Benefits. I would never tell them to job shame anyone.

I don't tell my teens study hard or you'll end up doing X job ( stacking shelves, bin men, retail, etc) because society needs people to do those jobs and there's no shame in doing them.

But I always emphasize that if they enjoy their current lifestyle, they need to study hard and maybe more importantly, consider carefully what they're studying. In our current climate, I would not encourage my teens to spend such a vast amount on university unless they are doing a rigourous STEM degree at a RG university (with possibly a few exceptions). It isn't worth spending the money on university otherwise. If my DC weren't academically inclined, I would encourage a trade like plumbing/ electrician, etc.

My strongest advice to my DC isn't to avoid factory work, Tesco, etc. But rather avoid the military, the NHS, and public sector jobs in general because the perks like great pension won't exist by the time they're working.

My eldest is 14 and goes back and forth between wanting to be a scientist, barrister, Dr, taxi driver and chef at the minute lol - all his interests, he loves law and 'rules', loves science, driving and cooking.

The only thing I reinforce constantly is to choose something that will make him happy but ensure that he retains this level of choice - and that going far in education is what will give him that choice.

There is a big difference between choosing to be a taxi driver at 25 and being forced to be one because you have no other options. Dc1 gets this I think and plans to go as far as possible in school whilst he decides.

I’ve already given my views upthread but it surprises me how many people are still telling their children ‘work hard or you’ll end up stacking shelves / being a bin man’ etc. It just seems so mean towards people doing essential jobs who - yes - also have to work hard to earn an honest day’s pay. Are you expecting your children to treat people in these jobs with respect after talking about them so disrespectfully? It’s not nice at all.

@Fairislefandango

I noted from your reply that you said you weren't wealthy ; is there a sense that having been to a good university remuneration would be better or have you chosen a career deliberately that was fulfilling in other aspects?

I get an underlying feeling in this thread that public sector jobs that require good academic qualifications plus a host of other skills deserve greater pay.

With regard to the 14 year old who quite understandably has a range of potential career options from barrister to taxi driver is he quite aware careers are not really 'choice' but are dependent on academic qualification and rather disappointingly sometimes family connection?

I’ve already given my views upthread but it surprises me how many people are still telling their children ‘work hard or you’ll end up stacking shelves / being a bin man’ etc. It just seems so mean towards people doing essential jobs who - yes - also have to work hard to earn an honest day’s pay. Are you expecting your children to treat people in these jobs with respect after talking about them so disrespectfully?

Motivating yourself to work to fulfil your potential at school in order to avoid ending up doing a boring, low-skill job when you had the academic potential to do something more stimulating does not mean in any way that you have to have disrespect for people who do those jobs.

'Work hard or you'll end up doing a low-paid, unstimulating job (such as X) even though you are capable of much more' is a perfectly sensible piece of advice. It's not 'mean'.

I noted from your reply that you said you weren't wealthy ; is there a sense that having been to a good university remuneration would be better or have you chosen a career deliberately that was fulfilling in other aspects?

The latter. Most of my university friends went into extremely lucrative careers, whereas I decided age 12 that I wanted to be a secondary school teacher and never changed my mind. Dh similar, though I don't think he decided quite as young as me, and he has in fact just quit teaching (in his late 40s), whereas I'm about to go back to full time age 50 for the first time in years.

You could certainly argue that teachers and various other public sector jobs deserve better pay. However, in teaching it is not really the pay that's the problem imo. Most teachers I know would agree.

Fair enough, but I don’t agree. I think it’s dismissive and a rude way to talk about other people and their jobs and life circumstances. My parents both worked low paid, minimum wage jobs and had two children who went to university and became ‘professionals’ but when they were encouraging my sister and I do our best at school they never would have spoken about their jobs and lives this way.

I accept that other people may not mean to be rude or dismissive, but that doesn’t make these kind of comments harmless. There are better ways to encourage children to try their best academically than to talk about some jobs as almost being the lowest of the low. I don’t think it encourages children to respect people in these essential jobs when they are spoken of so dismissively.

I think it's a fair piece of advice.

I've worked on factory production lines, in retail and as a cleaner while studying, so I have a lot of respect for those job, and I enjoyed every one of them to be honest. I enjoyed the manual aspects, the low responsibility, the finished product, the team work etc.

But many of the people I worked with did not have the choices that my education gave me and were not doing it to tide themselves over. Many of them hated the work they did.

If you have always been in low paid jobs how have you managed to have such a nice house?

It sounds as though you could have some good advice for people who post on here saying that they can’t afford anything.

LivingthedreaminScotland This is it - exactly. Scotland has some cheaper housing, in exquisite surroundings, and you don't need to follow a narrow formula to have choices and a fulfilling life. That's even before considering a work/life balance. Going off grid - with the good life, would be another way.

I've always encouraged education to further choices with my children. DD1 and DS are both doing apprenticeships - one is doing a degree (level 6) apprenticeship in engineering, the other is in a level 4 apprenticeship. Education isn't just about school, it's about continuing development through your life. It's also important to remember that school qualifications are only half the story - you need soft skills and experience to push forwards.

If you'd told me aged 21 that my degree would take me into a career in manufacturing (working in factories) and I would love it, I'm not sure I would've believed you. But as Henry Ford said "never turn down an opportunity dressed in overalls".

Id never say it because it's condescending and rude. Plus i did really well at school and probably earn less than I would stacking shelves. Dp on the other hand left school without doing any exams and earns double what I do so I don't necessarily believe it anyway. Especially nowadays when you need a degree to be a receptionist and get paid 18k a year.

I will always push my children to do the best they can and to aim for a job or career they want. However, I will never ever diminish any jobs to do that. None of this shit ‘work hard or you’ll end up being a cleaner/factory worker’ (using examples from the thread). It’s so rude and snobby and I would be embarrassed to raise children who think like that.