Are top private schools getting fewer oxbridge offers?

[Ijustwanttoask]

Just read in the papers about the drop in Oxbridge offers to Eton in the last few years. Is there a same trend for other big name public schools and top London day schools too?

In the past years, these schools generally happily announce the numbers of Oxbridge offers they get around this time of the year but I haven't seen much for 2021.

* Title edited by MNHQ by request* **

Interestingly the numbers admitted to elite universities have fallen but the group that are receiving contextual offers are specified by postcode, first generation to go to university etc the children in middle income families have no advantage afforded them. I am well aware that one argument is the fact they are from middle income families means they have an advantage - however that isn’t necessarily the case just as those from low income/certain postcodes etc are necessarily disadvantaged. It seems that the middle group are now at a disadvantage as they don’t have the money for private education etc but don’t receive the advantages the less well off receive.

@sonnysunshine

Yes they are going down and should continue to do so. Very very slowly it is being realise that the mechanisms of deciding the best students isn't necessarily by knowledge gained through an exclusive education and upbringing but by intelligence and application. There is still a huge way to go before the gap is properly bridged though.

Too slowly. Frankly I’m appalled at how much the old guard system still benefits the privileged (of which I am) rather than the un.

It’s about bloody time.

This is overdue.

Oxbridge should be working towards 20% max intake from private schools (which only make up 7% of pupils).

Pupils at state schools are just as clever.

I concede defeat... and I’m all right, Jack.

@twelly

Interestingly the numbers admitted to elite universities have fallen but the group that are receiving contextual offers are specified by postcode, first generation to go to university etc the children in middle income families have no advantage afforded them. I am well aware that one argument is the fact they are from middle income families means they have an advantage - however that isn’t necessarily the case just as those from low income/certain postcodes etc are necessarily disadvantaged. It seems that the middle group are now at a disadvantage as they don’t have the money for private education etc but don’t receive the advantages the less well off receive.

Very good point Twelly!! But it's going to fall on deaf ears on this thread - seems like folks are just in to one dimensional bashing of kids from independent schools

I suggest you read the "Another path to greatness" part 1 thread on Higher education for the parents of dc who didn't get Oxbridge offers in Jan this year, these parents were broken by their dc's rejection. It's really difficult to get an Oxbridge offer from any background, 1 ds had won a commendation from Trinity College Cambridge for a history essay in a competition the college organised and then didn't get a history offer from them. It's impossible to know what they are looking for but equal opportunities for all must be a consideration.

@Cloudymornings96

I suggest you read the "Another path to greatness" part 1 thread on Higher education for the parents of dc who didn't get Oxbridge offers in Jan this year, these parents were broken by their dc's rejection. It's really difficult to get an Oxbridge offer from any background, 1 ds had won a commendation from Trinity College Cambridge for a history essay in a competition the college organised and then didn't get a history offer from them. It's impossible to know what they are looking for but equal opportunities for all must be a consideration.

Equal opportunities for ALL must be a consideration......well put Cloudymornings96

Also, consider that the essay may not have been the work of the child....not saying it's true but should consider the possibility.
I know lots of foreign parents that have tutors for their DCs that get the tutors to help with routine homework and essays set by schools.....of course this is not right but just raising the issue.

Equally not right, I know some (as some posters put it) from disadvantaged state students that have plagiarised off the internet.....somewhat equalising the tutoring when it comes to work being set

All children should have the same opportunities, if not necessarily the same outcome.

Regardless of so-called class. As stated above, I am an immigrant to this wonderful country. But the class thing? No.

We have one who went private. The three others are in state schools.

None of my personal experience matters. If there is a system that is skewed toward a particular educational candidate, that should be changed. Oxbridge etc must change its ways, and seems to be striving to do so. Slowly.

Shouldn't that be "fewer"?
Just saying.

@ItsIgginningtolooklikelockdown Yes! English is not my first language, please accept my excuse :)

@Cloudymornings96

I suggest you read the "Another path to greatness" part 1 thread on Higher education for the parents of dc who didn't get Oxbridge offers in Jan this year, these parents were broken by their dc's rejection. It's really difficult to get an Oxbridge offer from any background, 1 ds had won a commendation from Trinity College Cambridge for a history essay in a competition the college organised and then didn't get a history offer from them. It's impossible to know what they are looking for but equal opportunities for all must be a consideration.

I think it's incredibly sad for the children if the parents were 'broken' by rejection from Oxbridge. It's a wonderful opportunity if it happens, and if a student is broken, I get it - but would hope that a parent would normally see that this is not the only path, that their child is still worthy and can have a great Iife ahead. It's not helpful for a parent to be that invested in something that is always a bit of a gamble, their child will always know and then it will hurt more.

To the point of @FreiasBathtub, I do worry a little about the 'squeezed middle', particularly students who might be at or near the top of their ok comprehensive, but still significantly disadvantaged vs a pupil at a private school (either in school experience, home life or both), however not from a lower income postcode etc to meet the criteria for priority admissions. It feels like these students fall through the cracks in terms of getting into the best unis, even if they're as good as the independent pupils.

I'm less worried about the independent pupils, statistically they're doing ok, and parents have a choice to pull them out if they really feel it's social engineering gone mad.

I don't think it matters which of the top schools your child goes to in terms of Oxbridge - if they are top candidate they are top whether they go to Charterhouse, Eton, or Kings. I don't think they have the same cache anyway - my husband went to Oxford and it didn't matter in terms of his career (City lawyer). Most of his equally successful colleagues did not go to either and are doing just fine.

@OverTheRubicon , the Mumsnet education pages are full of the most over invested parents ever only to be topped by parents lurking as students on TSR and anyone posting on eleven plus exams forum.co,U.K.!

@PersonaNonGarter

This is overdue.

Oxbridge should be working towards 20% max intake from private schools (which only make up 7% of pupils).

Pupils at state schools are just as clever.

This stat is so misquoted. Circa 17% of A-level students are privately educated. 7% is all students including primary school age children. When discussing university admissions the proportions in 6th form is more appropriate.

ioelondonblog.wordpress.com/2019/11/06/paying-for-a-private-sixth-form-education-how-much-difference-does-it-make/

I agree with contextual offers and the evidence for them being fair is strong and compelling. I just wish the press didn't intentionally mislead people about the stats.

The percentages change as many who will be educated privately still go to state school for primary years which skews all the figures. Also, most students who don't finish schooling at all are in the state sector.

I would imagine there is a real push to recruit state school applicants. Colleges full of ex public school applicants looks dreadful. Cambridge are being very proactive at dds state school - talks sessions etc. They need to show they are diverse. It isn’t 1860 anymore.

Yes, it's a good thing

I would be very happy as I would assume a child that managed to get Bs despite attending a poor school would be a much higher quality candidate than one that got As from a top school with all the advantages that goes with attending a top school.

I'm sure I read that state school kids actually performed better then private ones at Oxbridge.

I think OnlyTeaForMe is right and the independent school children will be told to focus on other universities such as Bristol, Newcastle and Durham and they will no longer be seen as the fallback choices. There will also be more focus on American Ivy League colleges such as Harvard and Yale. As this happens, they will still be mixing with the people who are in the ‘right’ social groups and networks will remain in place. It isn’t fair but for many people, university is more about making contacts than education.

Also banks and law firms getting much stricter on entrance criteria as they seek to be diverse too. Who you know won’t help you (guess dh and I are every private school parents nightmare we both ended up as City lawyers and dh went to Cambridge both from different bog standard rural comps with zero contacts 😁)

18% of those taking A-levels are at private school. 34% of Oxbridge applications are from private school. 42% of Oxbridge places go to private school pupils.7 Dec 2018

Take for example a mechanism called A to B......where a leading medical school would allow students from certain postcodes & backgrounds entry to the medical course which requires A's but would let you in with B's......I wonder whether those that implemented this sub-standard mechanism would allow those students that benefited from this system to treat them should they every find themselves on the surgery table?? - Doubt it but they are happy for the rest of us to suffer this fate!

I would be very happy as I would assume a child that managed to get Bs despite attending a poor school would be a much higher quality candidate than one that got As from a top school with all the advantages that goes with attending a top school. Plus the I would have concerns the person from the top school might not have the ability to relate to and understand the average person.

This.... They're called contextual offers and they play an important role in social mobility.

Let’s hope so!!

Oxford called my father (head of 6th at a comp at the time) as candidate not been great at interview. He could tell them the candidate was from the poorest part of the city and was the daughter of a single mother who was a cleaner. Looked at in that way her lack of “polish” was understandable she was an incredible applicant and she was in!

Private school parent ex Oxbridge here - delighted if fewer offers go to Eton etc. It’s as it should be. My college was 50%+ private school when I was there and I’m really glad if that’s changing.