Union say schools won't be fully open in September. Goverment say covid will be here till spring, so will schools fully open in spring 2021?

[947EliseChalotte]

Goverment say s hooks will be fully open in sept 2020 but unions are saying no they won't ! Goverment say covid we need to livewith covid and prepare for another wave, it's likely to be here till spring. So will schools reopen in spring 2021 when covid has gone?

They haven't said there will be 1m distancing in schools in September, as far as I can see? I don't think they've published their guidelines for schools yet. They have said that 1m distancing, plus other measures such as hand washing, now apply. And they have said schools will be back in full in September. I expect we will do what France has done- 1m, where possible, but other mitigating measures where not. Desks side by side, not face to face. Frequent hand washing/sanitiser. Possibly masks in corridors, that kind of thing.

If I’m totally honest, I think our school were a bit foolish at the start of things in February / March. I realise not wanting to cause unnecessary worry and upset, but for me, newly pregnant, it was counter productive as I would listen to frightening announcements on the radio on the way in, then in school morning briefing was bright smiles and trilling about the upcoming trip to Italy, the PSHE trip to meet people who’d recently returned from China, the parents evening (lots of people crammed into a damp fetid hall - great!) I honestly wouldn’t be surprised if the rapid spread in our area was at least partly to do with my schools actions in early March.

However it is done now, and they have been reasonable about most things. And in fairness, advice about What To Do In A Pandemic is limited!

I do understand it’s been difficult for some parents, but I really think some of the fuss has been a bit silly. When we look back, it’s four months - end of March through to end of July - it’s not ideal but it was pretty extreme circumstances and I think by the second week of September it will be a distant memory.

The biggest thing schools (and work places) can do to reduce the risk of transmission, and which will happily be a natural outcome of this, is to stop the pressure to send children in to school unwell, on the basis it's 'just a cold' and one day off school will make them fail their ofsted ruin little Jonny's chances of becoming a doctor forever more.

I’m hoping there might be a slightly more relaxed approach to attendance as a result of all this. Attendance is important but (for students and staff) you shouldn’t feel obliged to come in with nasty colds and some viruses can really knock you out!

It would also be nice if some of the things like open evenings and parents evening could have their day but I won’t hold my breath!

@iused I agree. I'm not sad that parents being expected to be in schools most weeks for class assemblies/harvest festivals/phonics workshops/listening to kids read/PTA meetings might be a victim of this. It's nice to feel included, and all, and I get a lot of it is fundraising and will need to be replaced in a different way, but....yeah, I won't be sad :)

I am not allowed in school until we reopen next week. My head hadn't got a clue what is going on. Promoted well above her station; and her deputy. Have had no input in reopening.
I would have worked the extra week and would have relished an extra week I October but no one asked me.

I am a teacher. I am soooo fed up of the online learning. I try my best to find and set interesting and relevant work. 1/5th of my class do it.

It's not what I trained to do, and although I don't miss the paperwork and the commute and the wranging of behaviour management, I do miss standing in my classroom with my children, actually teaching.

I very narrowly missed the shielding letter, by one additional prescription of steroids, yet the Welsh gov risk assessment places Asthma as a 1 on their risk list. So despite the advice being 'work from home if you can' etc I'm in as the risk assessment says continue as normal, with caution.

I believe the children really need to get back to school.
But I also believe that ALL staff in schools deserve the same health and safety considerations as those working in other places. If 2m (or 1m) is to be advised and enforced in other places of work, it should be in school too.

The GOVERNMENT need to step up and find places and staff to provide the extra room to allow all kids in.

This situation is ridiculous.

It's months away. Cases are dropping weekly.

By sept we may have minimal cases. Which can be tracked.

Unions need to get on with it. The risk WONT be there.

Schools have been open to high risk kids (parents work in nhs etc ). No second wave so far.

(My bet is a second wave will be in late October if at all) if that happens deal with it then.

Can someone explain something to me.

If a class of 30 needs to socially distance by 1m, then each child needs 1m squared of space. So 30metres squared in total.

5m x 6m gives 30m squared.

That's only 2 metres bigger than my bedroom.

Surely classes are bigger than that? Aren't they?

Not teacher bashing or whatever, just generally curious about the maths.

Lol there’ll be a load of storage in the room filled with resources that hardly ever sees the light of day if the 5 schools I’ve worked in is anything to go by. If the powers that be dictated a national cull of old unnecessary shit I reckon they’d have a canny bit of extra space lol

I am not sure how it will work and I feel for the teachers attempting to make it work. I assume social distancing will drop to 1m or not at all.

It's important to keep the very vulnerable teachers safe though.

I just hope all involved can come together for the good of all and make things work. Money will be needed for extra tuition, some smaller classes etc - supply teachers/recruit more TA's to support teachers.

I really hope that since there is a couple of months to sort this it will happen and all be back by Sept.

I think lulujakey has a very small piece of the full picture when it comes to the reality in most schools. I work in a very popular secondary which has over 1500 pupils and no spare rooms or teachers.

Pick, desks are approx a metre long. They would only be able to seat one child instead of the usual two. You would also need space in the classroom to walk around.

Unless there is a second spike, schools will be open as normal in September with no social distancing I think/ hope.

PickACoolUserName - you need circilation space (eg child in far corner needs to loo) plus the equipment, and the teacher and TA takes up space too. However i think that 1m will have vanished by september so im not investing too much time in thinking about it.

@Mostpeculiar

Lol there’ll be a load of storage in the room filled with resources that hardly ever sees the light of day if the 5 schools I’ve worked in is anything to go by. If the powers that be dictated a national cull of old unnecessary shit I reckon they’d have a canny bit of extra space lol

Haha yes, we got rid of all of our unused things last year. Classrooms are now all just desk, teacher desk, one filing cabinet.

PickACoolUserName it's a bit more complicated than that for all premises.

By that logic, my local Tesco would be allowing about 100 people in at a time, rather than 30.

Yes, lots of classrooms are tiny. Victorian buildings tend to have smaller rooms, as do the modern, purpose built schools.

Additionally, it's logistically impossible to have pupils sitting 50cm away from each wall and door as your working suggests. They need to be able to enter and exit the classroom easily (fire legislation) and see the whiteboard and teacher.

When they or the teacher moves around the class eg entering or exiting, they will need to be 1m away from all desks, so the desks effectively needing 2m between them.

The 1m also needs to be included in working out how pupils and staff will move around the building (some esp secondary schools have very narrow corridors), use toilets, enter and exit, eat lunch, have break time etc.

In primary, social distancing also needs to apply to drop off and picking up arrangements.

This is what is giving teaching staff a headache at the moment!

@Mostpeculiar

Lol there’ll be a load of storage in the room filled with resources that hardly ever sees the light of day if the 5 schools I’ve worked in is anything to go by. If the powers that be dictated a national cull of old unnecessary shit I reckon they’d have a canny bit of extra space lol

Until the next curriculum change comes along and that unnecessary shit is exactly what we’re returning to. Approximately every five years in my experience.

@Thanosatemthamster

Lulu is entitled to describe her own (well her husband's, she doesn't teach) experience. I'm sure she can see the issue being that her post is immediately jumped on by someone who wants to view it as representative of all schools and all teachers, when I'm sure Lulujakey would claim nothing of the sort.

That isn't what she did- she used the phrase "most schools" repeatedly. That is not your own experience - that is making sweeping generalisations. There is a difference.

Different schools will have different layout issues.

But what all will need is a plan for continuing to teach (or recover lost teaching) if:
a) there is a national, regional or local lockdown in response to a wave, spike or cluster of cases
b) shielding or other protective measures need to be reimposed firna while
c) if a pupil or staff member tests positive and a class (or more, if specialist subject teacher) have to go into thebstandard 14 day isolation

All of these could happen on no notice whatsoever

Only somewhere just short of 1/3 state schools had adequate online systems during this lockdown.

Clearly we will do what they already have in plan for France for July - social distancing will be scrapped for schools and they will be opening fully. Maybe additional hand washing and hygiene measures at most.

We will protect teachers by ensuring transmissions remain low in the community, hence transmission mitigations elsewhere until the vaccine.

If it is very unlikely that children contract covid from other sources, then it is very unlikely that teachers will catch covid from their pupils.

That is the only way to manage it in my opinion.

All my storage is in a built in cupboard at the back of my room that can't be easily removed. And is only 75cm deep anyway.

With 2m distancing I can get 7 kids in my classroom. With 1m I'd get 15.

The children will be in normal class sizes and just expected to stay in bubbles. This is two months away and should be more than safe BUT we’ll have to see what relaxing lockdown does.

The unions need to be planning for reopening. The government is being crap in not communicating it.

But all this talk of it won’t work. Surely every school in the country should be able to come up with two plans:

1. How things would work if 1m distancing is still in place, acknowledging that this may well mean part time school

2. How things would work if they are back in full class sized bubbles

I have seen a letter sent to members from one union for teachers to copy and sign which states that teachers are not even going to attend meetings for planned reopening until the government does this, that and the other. That annoys the hell out of me. Put your plans in place and then kick up a fuss if it’s not workable. Refusing to even think about it or engage shows the pathetic way the unions are blocking a return to school. You know you’re going to have to open at some point!!!!!

Anyway, I Waffle. Bubbles are happening, of that I am certain. There will need to be exceptions for the very vulnerable, but get your finger out and start planning (before all the teachers break up for the summer!!!)

Only somewhere just short of 1/3 state schools had adequate online systems during this lockdown.

Everyone has free access to The Oak Academy online school and most have access to BBC Bitesize daily lessons.

Yes, the Oak Academy was created and rolled out by the govt specifically to address learning during lock down.

Given that it was them that decided to close the school premises to all but children of key workers and all.

I find it really perplexing that so many posters on MN can't grasp this. The 'few links' that they're so dismissive of their school providing are these established (Bitesize) and purpose created (Oak) platforms.

I often wonder if posters have actually looked at them. It would take half the time that repeatedly posting about their child's school 'offering nothing' takes them.

Zodlebud

I have seen a letter sent to members from one union for teachers to copy and sign which states that teachers are not even going to attend meetings for planned reopening until the government does this, that and the other.

If you are going to post this at least post some evidence.