Parents won't discipline children, schools are not allowed to discipline children, so grammar chools are the way forward.

[Longlost10]

The whole comprehensive system is dragged down by the financial, spiritual, moral, educational and professional cost of the huge number of total wasters in the student body. Those who disrupt lessons, ignore teachers, distract students, talk back, waste time, make paper aeroplanes out of worksheets, dawdle in late, don't bother to do their homework, don't come equipped, chat and fidget and generally make no attempt to learn. They are utterly selfish and just tink of nothing but enjoying themselves.They are pandered to and spoilt, offered endless chances, suck the system dry of money, time, energy, and resources. Teachers are held responsible for their imbecilic behaviour, and grind themselves into dust trying to work to change behavior which is under someone elses control entirely.

This is why I support grammar schools. It gives the top 25% the opportunity to get away from these yobs, and and incentive to behave well, and keep behaving well, as a grammar school student needs to maintain certain levels of behavior and achievement to remain a grammar school student.

So overall, the poor behavior goes down. Because a grammar school place is an incentive to behave properly, and so some bad behaviour improves.

In a comp, badly behaved pupils have nothing to lose. That changes in a grammar system.

And a large number of students can get away from the poor behaviour too. Of course there is some bad behaviour in grammar schools, but it isn't comparable.

So less bad behaviour, more learning, and fewer students affected by bad behaviour in others. Whats not to like??

Of course it doesn't solve the problem of having to put up with bad behaviour in secondary modern classrooms, but it doesn't make it any worse either.

I mean you kind of proved my point.

Bobochic Parental input will always make a difference, no matter what type of teaching is used, in my opinion.

I think the point of what I posted is that the gap between advantaged and disadvantaged children might be reduced with the right sort of curriculum and teaching approach in primary.

Perhaps. Banning h/w is definitely not the way forward. Experience and research in France has clearly demonstrated that banning h/w increases the attainment gap. Educated and/or engaged parents supplement their DC's education using their own cultural capital, money and efforts while other parents do nothing and their DCs do no supplementary work outside school.

Just ban it. It's a tier of admin and work for teachers and assistants that isn't necessary.

Banning h/w actively disadvantages yet further the already disadvantaged.

No it doesn't. Absolutely not.

The disadvantaged will not get help at home, they may not even do it, they are more likely to be reprimanded or do worse in their homework, and giving out homework in such situations is setting up children to fail.

That is absolutely not what the French research concludes, WinchesterWoman.

Bobochic the French research was undertaken in an entirely different education system.

As its findings are wholly counterintuitive (as well as self-serving for any educational establishment) you will indulge with some scepticism.

They aren't counterintuitive. They make perfect intuitive sense.

Even this:

Educated and/or engaged parents supplement their DC's education using their own cultural capital, money and efforts while other parents do nothing and their DCs do no supplementary work outside school.

contradicts this

Experience and research in France has clearly demonstrated that banning h/w increases the attainment gap

Both from your post.

Bobochic

How does trusting to work at home and contribution for parents reduce the equality gap when some parents do nothing and some parents do everything?

By magic?

Those statements make exactly the same point, WinchesterWoman.

They contradict each other.

They absolutely don't. Think harder!

No I'm afraid it's up to you to explain.

If 'Educated and/or engaged parents supplement their DC's education using their own cultural capital, money and efforts while other parents do nothing and their DCs do no supplementary work outside school.'

then requiring homework of pupils will not advantage disadvantaged pupils. It will disadvantage them further because

'Under educated and/unengaged parents do not supplement their DC's education using their own cultural capital, money and efforts..outside school'.

It will advantage those children already advantaged by parental help.

This is not difficult to understand.

"The Daily Mash is a satirical paper that publishes spoof articles. She didn't actually say any of this." Oh great I didn't look at the source just took the article at face value. Gah! Thanks for clarifying ,glad she didn't say those things, i was genuinely shocked.

But WinchesterWoman if the school sets the homework. The school can provide a homework help club for those children whose parents can/do not want to complete it at home, which is exactly what you think should be happening. No child is left behind.

Please refer to my earlier post about what happens if you set no homework at all. The teacher can not possibly know what 30 children are doing at home independently and therefore for those with less engaged parents they will be left behind.

What's the point? Children are in school for six hours. Do it in that time.

All our DC did a lot more than six hours of academic stuff per day.

Indeed, my DD spent 10 hours writing an essay yesterday and then watched a very improving film for relaxation. I am more than aware of the family values and structure that enable her to make those choices.

Did you explain your contradictory post and I missed it?

There is nothing for me to explain. You need to read what is written!

The point is no homework = more time for tutoring = bigger attainment gap.

homework = engages parents with school = potential issues can be caught earlier = intervention can be started sooner.

When I say homework I am not talking about craft making etc, which I do not think should be completed outside school or pointless worksheets but reading, times tables, number bonds, counting forward/backwards. Support that the MAJORITY of parents can give their child. It doesn't take long and it doesn't cost money.

Lol ok. Post nonsense and blame people for not understanding!

Why does 'more time for tutoring' = bigger attainment gap.

Parents who become engaged with school through hw are not the don't won't can't parents.

You are extending the gap.