If you are at a fee paying school, do children know?

[Parky22]

DD is 6 and currently Y1 at a fee paying school that ends at Y2.
I have been to open days for the next schools and a headmaster has said how they want the children to know they are in a privileged position.
Also heard another mum state that if her child gets a scholarship she has promised them 10% of what they save.
Should the children know about fees/scholarships/bursaries and at what age should they know?

My child knows both mavis as do all the other children in his class.

DS knows and knows he was offered a scholarship. His friends know if they are on a bursary and the parents have mentioned it too.

Agree with Pagwatch, on all points.

It is neither hidden nor belaboured.

I too had to answer questions about different schools from when my dc were very young (my eldest is at a SN school), it just becomes second nature.

I was aware of being at private school from a reasonably young age - I didn't realise when I first started, at 4, but we moved when I was 7 and I then went into a state school, and the differences prompted questions, so I knew from then.

From 8, I was involved in educational choices - my father wouldn't pay for private school for me ('no point paying for girls' ) so I sat scholarships. I was aware of how lucky I was - to be able to gain the scholarships, and to be able to attend private school.

For secondary, I was also aware that my father had stopped paying the remainder of my fees and that my uncle had stepped in. I again felt very lucky. But no pressure, beyond th expectation (from school and family) that I would take full advantage of the opportunity offered. I didn't feel pressured in any way. Some minor annoyances re: school expectations, but they were actually reasonable enough (basically just 'try your best') and they were massively understanding about some home pressures I had, and really did give me space to work it out.

I don't think being aware of being at a fee paying school automatically equals feeling beholden and huge pressure. It all depends how it is handled.

I honestly don't recall ever sitting the kids down and telling them but nor did I hide the fact. I just don't think it occurred to me to say or not say.
I think it's just something they gradually realised very early on.

DS knows that we work to pay fees and understands that he is lucky.

He's also aware that the local state secondary (well 2 close ones) hasn't got a brilliant reputation - and has had a fair few kids sloping off to join daesh (which scares the shit out of me tbh).

My children didn't know until a friend's daughter very accusingly asked them, not me, why they went to a private school. I was very cross about it at the time. I can't remember how old they were but they are both still in primary and it was definitely a few years ago so maybe yr1 & yr2.

Their school is about a 2 min walk and definitely the closest school to us, so the issue about not going to a local school making it obvious doesn't apply to us. They could have gone to the local Catholic school which is also walking distance but the non faith catchment school is about 2 miles away.

I think the reason it annoyed me so much is the way it was said and the fact that I know our choice of school has been negatively discussed in that family as the Mum strongly disagrees with private education but thinks private health care is fine especially as 'it gives access to better drugs should any of us get cancer'. I'm not sure if this is actually true but the fact that she feels that being able to buy a different education is wrong but buying better health is fine seems very hypocritical to me and their children still regularly comment on it to my DC, when in fact which school they attend is our decision and not the DC's (at least at this age)

I regularly tell my children how lucky we all are, not because of the school they go to but because they are growing up in a home where the parents love each other, our housing is secure and permanent, we can afford to heat it, buy food & clothes, go on days out and holidays (I'm talking camping not safaris or long haul!) and this is not the case for a lot of children. So I fully agree with everything mouldycheesefan said but I don't think that means they shouldn't know they are lucky.

A view from the 'other side of the fence', from someone who could afford to use private schools but haven't chosen too (so my DCs have many of the 'other' trappings of privilege in terms of house, ability to holiday, pay for extracurricular activities etc ... not cars, we run cars for green-ness and economy, not image)

We live very close to a large, floridly Victorian Gothic private school with prep, and routes to my DC;' primary and to other daily activities led past its extensive playing fields, astroturf, sports hall with swimming pool etc etc. So my DCs, from their earliest years, could see that there was a school very close to their very normal state primary that was different and had different facilities (the private school is, incidentally, where my DH was sent to board from the age of 7, something he is profoundly affected by). So very very early, in general conversation, we explained that some schools are state funded and free at the point of delivery, and some schools are paid for directly. Also, as they grew older, we talked about what that money clearly bought - great facilities, sports fields etc - and about what it might not buy - particular excellent teachers from their own school, friendships, character traits like kindness. Still older, we talked about why we choose to send them to state schools - better results, better provision in the community rather than in the private schools for their particular 'things' - and how lucky they anyway are in comparison with other children whose state schools may not be as good, who may not be able to access or pay for extra curricular activities, who may not live in a nice house etc etc. I have taught in very deprived schools, so they are aware that even within a few miles of where we live there are children who are hungry and neglected.

They both mix with privately-educated children at a variety of activities - sport, dance, music - and don't regard them as 'privileged', just as children whose parents have made different choices. They would regard themselves as lucky.

In my town I would say all children know there are state schools and private ones, and from a pretty young age know which are which. Its just as children know that "Poppy" table has all the brightest children on it, and "Rose" has the ones who struggle; children will suss this out.
Some schools do even have a habit of telling children about how privileged (or smart) they are to be there.

So if you want to give your children a different message then I'd suggest you get in early. I have heard some horrible comments from some children at private schools (which their parents would be horrified by).

I don't like the thought of drumming into a child the notion they are "privileged." It seems like brainwashing to me - eg this is a privilege you have a duty to accord your own children in future, this privilege means you have been groomed to be a leader in society, etc., etc... It's not at all the same thing as saying they are lucky, as a privilege is only accorded to special people, not normal people...

We know people who are 'privileged' enough to have had enough money to be able to buy next-door to a good state school, re-find religion in a big way, or get extra tutors to help their kids with grammar school entry. All the same really.

I know how tough the exams were, and how much competition there was to get into DSs school, so know that it's not all about depth of pocket.

Not sure I get your point, originalmavis. Are you saying all such children should have their "privilege" drummed into them or aren't you?

Just that there are different types. No drumming required.

Privilage is all relative. Mahala was nearly murdered just trying to get a basic education. Lots of children do not have access to food, shelter and a safe environment.

I am not sure I like the word privileged, I feel that blessed is better way of expressing the situation. When private school he head tell private school kid they are privileged, they are inferring that the local state school is inferior. It's a horrible form of marketing to suggest fake pity for state school kiss. It is patronising to state school families to suggest that third children are less privileged because the parents have made different choices.

My friends kids go to a couple of state schools with amazing facilities in a very nice part of town. The parents could afford to move to a good £1.25+million house in the catchment area. They are lucky.

A relative bought a house ages ago (pre marriage) and now finds himself in a situation where his kids can have a good shot at a fab grammar school on his doorstep. Also lucky.

I don't think either set of parents call them privileged, but the kids know that they go to bed with full bellies, whereas other kids in the UK for not. As does DS.

I was unlucky because I went to a crap state school but my parents didn't really realise it. It was back in the dark ages and I think they really just expected me to get a little job until I got married and had kids.

reallytired Malala attended a private school in Pakistan (her father owns a chain of private schools) and now attends a private school in UK.
She is from a privileged background. Her childhood was very different from the large majority of Pakistani children, though I don't think currently any of them have access to a safe environment.
Of course, being shot in the head is not something anyone should have to deal with, of any background.

Mahala could not get an education in Pakistan in safety. My daughter who attends a uk state school that requires improvement is getting a better experience than Mahala had in Pakistan. She is not at risk from flying bullets.

A uk state primary is reasonably well resourced. It is probably better resourced than many Pakistani private schools. My daughter's school had 30 children in a class, the toilets work and there is electricity. Boys and girls have equal access to education which is certainly not the case in the Swat Valley.

Attending a private school in a third world country cannot be compared with attending a private school in the uk. People in the third world use private schools as a way of accessing an education of any description. Mahala did not attend a private in Pakistan for snob reasons.

I gave no idea who pays Mahala's school fees in England. I imagine that a young Nobel prize winner probably could get a full scholarship and take her pick of the best private schools.

Well, she was on their roll well before her NPP, but that's by the bye.
I'm just wondering why you chose to bring Malala into a thread about fee-paying schools and privilege, that's all.

Mahala did not attend a private in Pakistan for snob reasons.

My children don't go to their private school for snob reasons either!

My dd knows as do most of the other children in her school.
It is different though in their case as very few people pay the full fees.
She knows that we pay a small percentage dependant on income, usually tax credits cover this. The rest is paid from the MDS government scheme.
They all know they are very fortunate and that they are expected to work hard and reach their potential.

"My children don't go to their private school for snob reasons either!"

Plenty of private school kids do attend private school so that they don't have to mix with the Sen children off the council estate. However parents who buy an expensive but tiny house in catchment of posh state school or those who attend church are no different.

Another one is parents who think their little darling is either too bright or delicate to cope with a state school. Or those who automatically see state education as inferior whatever teachers or resources the state school has.

ReallyTired, my DS is SEN and attends a private school - I don't know what you are implying by your blanket statement about SEN children and "the council estate"!

So are a few of my son's classmates over the years (SEN). And my dad dad grew up a council estate in Glasgow so you can't just generalise on motive, or even assume.

2 close state school have the dubious notoriety of having had kids skip off to Syria and behead people, so trust me, mixing with council house kids is not even on my radar.

We have no right to question another parents "motivation" for sending a child to any school. I do notice you rarely if ever read threads on here questioning a parents "motivation" in sending their DC to a state school.
Most of the friends and families we know with DC's of similar age to my DS's have sent them to independent boarding schools, IMO most don't have any particular reason for doing it, they do it because that's what they're decided to do. The state sector is no more on their radar than a week in Butlins (no criticism of either intended). A small minority will give reasons, but mixing with the kids from the local council state or those with SEN are not reasons I've ever heard given.
It seems that many get their knickers in about independent education, or even other types of education e.g. Steiner we currently live in a free society, I just can't help but feel that as long as they're not ramming it down you throat morning noon and night and heavily criticising you choice them as a society we need to be more tolerant of parents who choose a different route, for what ever reason.

My dd school is ss and she has wonderful support and the SENCO is terrific.
There is no way she would have this support in our local state schools as they really don't have the funding and so many children need support coming from a deprived area too.
I can't speak for other geographical locations, obviously.

The day I called she acted immediately as she had just witnessed something in dd behaviour that worried her. We were her next call, but got there a little in front.
No fobbing off, but getting the ball rolling immediately with a gp appointment next day and ed psych the next week.