Are private schools worth the fees you pay?

[lupo]

Hi

I was looking for some advice from those of you who send your kids to private school. I have one son and recently went to visit Staines Prep School and really fell in love with it.

The thing is we could just about afford the fees, but I will need to work more hours (full instead of part time)as well as few sacrifices along the way. not planning on having any more children, and would like to go private as classes seem smaller, and sounds like children get lots of help and support.

Just wanted to know of your experiences of independant schools and whether good ones are worth the money. Any advice much appreciated.

Like the school but am going on gut instinct, and it is one of the few we could just afford.

oh gosh how did that rusty pointy thing end up in my hand

My sister had down's, although she died young. Children with SN don't burden the planet. I don't believe in abortion and I had no tests done in pregnancy. Even the C of E today is suggesting killing off babies who will live and suffer.

The issue of whether it's helpful they be taught in the same class is a difficult one and many parents don't if the child is disruptive really want their own children's education damaged.

hw, don't agree with your analysis. I do think if parents pay they appreciate the school more and more likely to make the children turn up there. It's the argument put forward by many that if you had to pay £10 for each visit to the GP you might appreciate it more. Again not my argument. I personally think a vocher each parent gets to spend at any school they choose which they can top up if they want would help a lot.

Xenia,I think alot of what you have stated is right,and some wrong.
In my book you are certainly entitled to state your beliefs,opinions(even when being ironic!)and many people have fought wars to defend your right to do so.

However,some of the posters that are posting now will,basically,give you a pasting and in all probability "stalk" you on this site for some time to come(they have long memories) posting after you, then alot of "name-calling"will follow and eventually like others, you will be "bullied" away.

Sad,yet entirely predictable on this site.

I'm not sure about the accent thing but I would certainly accept DD being taught to speak properly if it would help with her writing e.g. in a local school they are having English hot topics each week and recently it has been 'could have' instead of 'could of' in the children's writing. If children don't understand 'could've' is not 'could of', they aren't going to write it correctly, are they?

Xenia- I do agree with you that for some children with SN a minastream classroom is not appropriate -my son spent 4 terms in mainstream and it was dreadful; but not intiniscally because of him- because the support he needed -namely experienced staff- was not there. However, he did not disrupt the education of the other children- he was not allowed to- he was kept away from the other children. His education was massively disrupted though- over a year was wasted (we tried to make up at home, but it's not really possible).

You've spoken a lot about parents fighting to keep special schools open. I would willingly campaign for this. If my son's school was threatened I would tie myself to the railings if I thought it would help. However, this arises from the experience of seeing the damage that mainstream education can (not always, it will depend on the child, and the support in the school) do to children with SN. This is far greater than any effect that a child with SN will have on a classroom (if they're too disruptive they get expelled and don't receive an education). Anyway these days the vast majoriity of special schools are more integrated with masintream schools which I think is fantastic. My son actually has far more contact with mainstream peers since moving to special school.

The issue is far more complicated than you have described here- and the concern for mainstream peers being damaged is misplaced- far more damage from an inappropriate placement is done to the child with SN.

Even removing the SN equation - so less likely to get behaviourally disruptiive (for non SN reasons) chidren in private schools is a massive oversimplification. My cousiin for example went to 2 private schools. At the first she was bullied so badly she literally couldn't function, she left (as did 2 other girls apparently - the bully's dad donated a lot of money to the school so she was going nowhere), At her second school she blossomed. It makes far more sense to comare individual school's rather than systems.

I pay for ds2's education, ds1's is free (will pay for ds3's probablly). I appreciate all his teachers and the work they do- I think we're very lucky with both schools-, but the school that I adore, that I will always be grateful to, the school that makes the biggest difference to this family's life is the free one.

We were just asked whether it is worth paying and I think it is so I wrote down the reasons. I certainly don't mind people criticising me. I want this to be a country where people come to express views I disagree with.

jj, on site unit for children with SN, but special arrangements can work well. Obviously a lot depends on the child's disability too.

The first question was whether good independent schools are worth the money and I think they are. It's not just exam grades that matter (there's another thread on whether people went to state or private schools, which university/degree and which job which shows how nicely meritocratic the UK is although I havne't analysed if there's a correlation between Oxbridge entry and school or subsequent career and life/relationships success and schooling on that thread) but also whether that school ethos fits your family, lifestyle etc. I've enjoyed sitting in fields, by lakes, turning up at places which have gorgeous buildings in an architectural sense too. A parent goes to schools and is involved with them. So you want one you will feel comfortable spending time in at concerts, sports days, plays etc.

Grammar - yes, the best of state and private schools will teach children not to say "haitch" and "should of" etc etc. The worst PC teachers will say dialect is great, write it and speak it. I don't think that benefits the children in life.

As several people say, many who go to private school don't seem to succeed much in later life. That's partly because genetics is a more than a bit random.

I haven't got any numbers for "relationship" succcess, but the database I own is very clear that grades/university affect careers big time. Xenia, the term you may want to use if you're going to extend your view is "real option theory".
(slight chance my name pops up on googling it).
Modern economics shows that the ability to choose has a value that you can map into cash.

Some private schools are small, which from this perspective is bad. Many parents seem to like this, but the problem is that it does not allow them to support specialities so well. They mask this by picking a few and obsessing about them.

That can work is your kid happens to fit that mould, but of course not only are they not likely to fit, it is actually very hard to forecast what they turn out to be good at.

The new specialist state schools are just as silly for the kids, yet are easy to spin to look like success. If you focus on something anything, and feed in a few thousand kids, you will get a few great success stories. Sadly you will squander the potential of the rest.

arf DC versus Xneia

DC and Xenia are husband and wife.

oh
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
noit really?
oyu ARE kidding
why dot hye goand TALK to each toher
weirdos

Of course I'm kidding. Do I ever take any of this seriously?

ARF!

They have strangely similar posting styles, however.

Blimey! This thread has moved on somewhat since I last looked at it!

Xenia - as I've said previously - I was privately educated but am happy to send my childen to decent state schools.

My reasons for wishing to avoid the private system involve the fact that my children would develop attitudes like yours.

You may be a wonderful person for all I know - helping out at your local charity shop, delivering meals on wheels etc. But much of what you have posted on this thread makes you sound like an insufferable snob.

she fits in meals on whelels and her kids and her job?
wow

I missed the accent post!

ARF!

Actually I'm pretty sure Xenia featured in a Mail on Sunday article about rich women paying massive settlements to their ex-husbands.

Would be the Mail on Sunday, wouldn't it? Bet she was gutted it wasn't the Times!

I haven't read the whole way through this thread, but I ask myself this question just about every day. We are in the catchment area for a very good infant school and a delightfully hippy-dippy, unstructured primary school. After endless dithering we sent DD1 to a small, non-selective, Catholic, prep-school mostly because we could afford it and, based on gut-feel, we thought that it would suit her better. I think we made the right decision as DD1 is clearly very happy and secure there. Aside from all the obvious stuff, the school has a broader ethnic mix than our local state schools, although there are no SN children there which I think rather betrays its Catholic principles.

In the round I think we've made the right decision but if I knew that we were going to find it financially very hard-going I think we would probably have opted for State education.

You sound most UNLIKE xenia!

Fortyplus: On the ethnic and SN thing? No grand claims here as it's partly "selfish" - the DDs are Asian and DH is in a wheelchair so some of this is about making them feel that school is part of a society in which they are readily included.

At some level these private v state at primary level threads are entirely pointless as there are so many factors that drive the outcome: quality and ethos of available state schools; quality and ethos of available private schools; personality and academic potential of DCs; strength of match between DCs and available state/private schools; comparative horror of school runs; social fit between the school and the whole family; level of disposable income; requirement for and availability of wrap-around care; horror of or affection for the boater, blazer element of private schools; choices at secondary level; availability of local friends; importance of adhering to parental social or political principles; special educational needs provisions; G&T provision (alcoholic and educational); extra curricular activities that DCs might actually want to do etc. etc.

By the time you have worked your way through that lot, even given the tens of thousands of MNetters, it's almost inconceivable that any two MNetters would share the same fact pattern.

Lovely summing-up, Issymum.
Tell me: do you spend an evening drafting your posts, or is your wit & lucidity (terrifyingly) instant?

Xenia you are outspoken and opinionated and appear to have no respect or regard for anyone's feelings. You say you come from a terribly musical family, my advice to you, go f*ck off and play your fiddle elsewhere, you suck.

Full!

Yes, so are we, Fio, but of course, Scots are plebs by birthright.

Couldn't agree more. Views on this subject will always tend to become polarised and the most important thing is do follow the route that you believe is right for your child(ren).
If I felt that private education would benefit my children then I would do what you have done and send them.
My sons' stste secondary school has a low % of SN children, but those who are there are valued as individuals. A child in his year has Duchenne Muscular Dystrophy so is confined to an electric wheelchair. From what my son tells me he is an incredibly popular child - and I can only say that whenever I see him he has at least half a dozen children smiling and chatting with him.
The ethnic mix within the school reflects that of the catchment area - around 5%. I can honestly say that my own children would not view the colour of someone's skin as any more or less interesting than what colour hair they had, whether they were tall or short or whether they wore glasses. In fact ds1 is nearly 13 and so has become much more aware of what's in the news. He is shocked that there are people out there who would kill you because of your race or religion. His favourite teacher at primary school had him for yrs 2&3 - she is a practising Muslim so always keeps her legs and head covered. She is the sweetest lady you ever met and he says that it makes him very angry that someone would dislike her just because if her appearance.

If I ever feel that my sons are being failed by the state system then I WILL take them out and send them privately - but I shall fervently hope that I don't cross paths with too many people like xenia!