The Trinity-Whitgift-South London school 10+/11+ thread of 2014

[Ladymuck]

A few days early I know, but most of the entrance exams will be out of the way in a fortnight or so, and I'm sure there are a number of us who are in need of or or as we watch our (still very little) boys forget everything that they may have learned over the last couple of years. And there are many veterans of the process who will hopefully be around to reassure us that we will all come through this unscathed.

do you think boys need to do very well in all the papers for Whitgift

I don't know abut whitgift as DS2 had to write a descriptive piece which he can manage as there is no plot and thus not a lot of scope for death and destruction. For T, however, I know he scored over twice as much in his maths as he did in the English and still got a place.

Sorry poozie - didn't answer your question fully. Whitgift and Trinity to a certain extent are a funny mix as you have boys going for a full fee space, boys going for a bursary place, boys aiming for academic scholarships and boys aiming for co-curricular scholarships. I don't think you need high marks all round for a full fee or co-curricular scholarship by any means. The bursary pot is getting increasingly competitive, and I think you need to be a decent all rounder for an academic award.

I guess it would be interesting to know how much a bright sibling already at the school was a consideration in the selection, Soupy. Some schools have an explicit sibling criteria (eg Alleyns I think says that provided siblings make the top 300 called for interview then they're guaranteed an offer), others are more coy (eg Caterham states no formal sibling policy but they understand families want to keep children together). Whilst your ds2 clearly had an off day, the bottom sets at some of these schools have a statistically significant number of younger siblings.... And I assume ds2 did well in maths!

Equally I know of boys with co-curricular talent who scored below 50% on the Whitgift maths paper. If you are after a full fee place then the exams seem to be more of a screening tool, and some weakness is allowed, or at least further inspected at interview.

[The talk is over...]

Oh, he didn't have an off day :)

His maths was exceptional though. It just shows that they are prepared to overlook a bad English result - they were not at all bothered and were confident their teaching would rectify that. I wonder if they would be so forgiving the other way round though.

Re T and sibling places I have heard that something would have to go spectacularly wrong for sibling ( in the instance I know about ) not to be offered a place.

Re T looking favourably on a very good English paper and a poorer/poor / awful Maths paper - yes, they would ! ( I have one of those strange creatures that loves creative writing )

Ladymuck, enjoying your son's way of chilling out away from the books. Mine is now stuck on the playstation, grr!! Difficult to keep the motivation up (for all of us) after a long summer practising for the grammars. How much work is everyone putting in this last week??

Also, do you think if applying for a bursary you would need top scores all round or no offer at all or you could still get an offer but with full fees?

Poozie, I'm trying to keep DS going on practice papers for 90 minutes to 2 hours a day excluding Christmas and Boxing Days, but to be honest his marks are dropping, not rising, and I fear he needs to stop (and we just need to nip up to the Cathedral and pray a couple of rosaries).

We are going to do a bit of VR tomorrow and the next day, as we're staying away, and then he has his English tutor Thursday just for a technique chat on the Dulwich sample papers, and his Maths tutor on Friday for a bit of a go at NVR, though it's a bit late really. Over the weekend, we are not doing ANYTHING unless we play some gentle times tables games. Monday is his first exam (Dulwich).

I have told him that we're on an electronics ban till 14th January which is his last exam. He can then play on the xbox until his eyes blister, and read Percy jackson till he speaks in nothing but percy pastiche if he so wishes.

His Dulwich practice paper implies that he is going to struggle to finish, as he spends so long poring over the passage to find the answers. So I'm really hpoing that the maths tutor's advice is spot on: "The maths is the thing. Tthey don't really worry too much about the English as long as they can put a sentence together. They just don't want to spend too much time having to bring your DS up to speed on the basics." (paraphrased.)

We've had a break for a while. In fairness ds did well in grammar tests and has a sibling at what is still probably our preferred school, so I'm happy that he'll get a selective place. We are now gearing up to work for these last 10 days because it is fairest to ds if he sits as prepared as possible. We'll do a VR paper a day as many questions get rechurned. Probably a variety of maths papers though he is fairly strong here. As with most boys, English is his weakest area, so we're spending time on that, and he has two one hour sessions to go through what he done with a tutor, as I'm not confident enough to help him as much here. So currently looking at 4 hours a day including going through answers, and working on vocab. Will probably reduce maths and include NVR as we get closer (only our 3rd exam requires it).

30 mins Maths a day, and 30 or so English every other day. No VR nor NVR since done to death for Tiffin test and Graveney - think he's peaked .....

each to their own, every DC is different I suppose, hope not let my DS down by taking it too easy

JustAnotherUserName Don't panic. I was equally inadequate :)

They don't really worry too much about the English as long as they can put a sentence together.

That was the impression I got from the T head when I spoke to him about DS2. He was completely unconcerned about his very poor English mark as they were confident they could fix that (and going by his last two reports, they were right).

English and maturity are very linked, I suspect... and DS is one of those 11-going-on-9 kind of boys... right, I'm on a NYE break from MN. Enjoy, y'all! xx

Wishing i had applied to Dulwich if maths and NV is their thing! Hoping Whitgift don't worry too much about the English. Off to embark on rows over a story- do we think Whitgift is going to be just creative writing rather than persuasive arguments/newspaper reports etc? We are putting all eggs in one basket as only applied to Whitgift. At least if we get to interview we can be truthful when we say they are our first choice!!

Poozie - my DS did much worse in English than maths for W 10+ two years ago. He was still called for interview, and we were questioned on why in our interview. We basically said he had a wide vocab, read alot, but just hadn't had much experience of writing essays due to his primary school. He was offered a place - I imagine his interview showed that he was fluent in the language (never shuts up ) We went with T in the end though...

I always got the impression that W & T tried to give more than one option for writing, and that essentially they were trying to work out what the boys could do, rather than what they couldn't do. For the grammars I know that sometimes SGS in particular would throw in only balanced arguments or a letter to the council etc, whereas W and T looked for more traditional stories or descriptions. But yes, they're essentially looking for something coherent and legible.

It is difficult because there will always be boys with blistering high scores in some subjects, but the actual range given offers is quite a large one. I think the main thing is to ensure that the boys have enough stamina to keep going for the 3-4 hours and to reach at least half marks across the board.

I think that we're at the extreme end of packing it all into the last 10 days, especially with lots of other children we know diligently going to their tutor weekly but it is what works for us, and I know some boys who are still away on holiday (skiing of course) who will certainly be bringing the average daily revision minutes down.

Thanks Seeline, feel a bit better reading your comments. Same applies- not enough practise writing stories and just prefers straightforward work like maths/ Vr/Nvr with right/wrong answers. He can put a story together with beginning/middle/end but doesn't wow on the vocab front!

Ladymuck, spent ages over summer preparing persuasive letters for Sutton which of course didn't come up this year! Hey ho.....

Told myself after prep for grammars and all the stress they brought that I wouldn't worry about this. Hmmmmm!!

Oh no it doesn't!

Oh yes it does!

Hanging in there ,10 days and counting ..... avoided going out tonight as can't lose a day with me being hung over !! so far so good trying to do 2x 90 mins sessions a day now any longer and it becomes unproductive as DS starts losing interest VR ( hangjng around the 70-80% ) with a bit of non VR (for reeds on the 12th DS seems to consistently get 86% for last 4 weeks and no higher but figure that's good enough at this stage ) DS is now glued to minecraft will drag him out to get some fresh & wet air then another 90 mins at 5pm DS did make the comment that he best pass as his spent so much time on it !!! can start to see the light at the of the tunnel for revision anyway ...... I guess after the exam is when the stress for us mums takes over ....

Lol - that made ds smile.

Can anyone help me with numbers sitting for Trinity please. The blue sheet we've been sent are the instructions for applicants 1411161-1411320. I'm assuming that the numbers are (20)14 entry, 11+ sitting and thus there are at least 320 boys sitting. Anyone got the next sheet up out of interest? We applied close to the deadline, and I know that the candidate number hasn't been allocated by surname.

I guess after the exam is when the stress for us mums takes over ....

Oh yes :) On that note...

1. There is absolutely no method/significance in how early your DS is invited for interview.
2. Boys are invited for interview for a good few weeks following the exam.
3. They will all say your son is lovely and you should be proud of him (which doesn't make it any less true! :o)

Sorry, cross posted teddingtonmum. Anything over 80 is very good indeed. Certainly we're spreading out our papers during the day. Most of the schools we're looking at do 2 in the morning and 1 after lunch, so that's what I'm tending towards.