Late Grammar School offer: over the moon but stressed/flummoxed

[PermaShattered]

What a 3 days we've had - any insightful comments welcome. In short:

1. Our daughter was offered 3rd choice (her 11+ score was about 30 down on passmark);
2. 3rd school is outstanding but we appealed to 2nd choice school as was our preference;
3. Last Friday took calls from our local Ed admissions authority saying why appealed when have offer from grammar school?
4. Said we hadn't. She made further calls to other relevant admissions authority and came back and told us we definitely have an offer and it would be in post next day (Saturday just gone);
5. It duly arrived, and we posted our acceptance same day (they should have got it today) - verbal acceptance of place given by phone on Friday;
6. On Friday the Authority also withdrew both our place at 3rd choice school and our appeal to 2nd choice school;
7. Today i take a call from a friend whose daughter got substantially higher score than my DD - and she is 188 on waiting list;
8. I call our admissions auth to check they received our acceptance (they said still in posttray but will be dealt with this afternoon);
9. I query whether there could possibly an error and i'm told categorically 'no'. And if there was, we have a written offer, accepted it and they can't take it off our daughter;

10. Finally, my other DS is that grammar school.

I'm perplexed. What could be a possible explanation?

You and your daughter will always know that you went the extra mile, gave it your best shot and stood up for her when it mattered. Nobody will ever be able to take that away from either of you.

I hope your daughter is ok.

I'm not pleased perma and I definitely feel sorry for your daughter but I'm afraid that in the grammar school context the outcome is the one I expected, even though I was firmly shot down and told that it was completely open and shut.

Surely you'll re-instate your appeal for school No. 2? A fair hearing for that school is the least they can do.

I just can't see how they've come to that conclusion, Perma. The appeal should have stopped at the point where the mistake was established.

What did they say about the late withdrawal and the mistake?

I can see exactly how they've come to this conclusion lougle. I've just dipped back a few pages and I think their reasoning follows near enough exactly what I said, that the admissions criteria are different for selective schools and that therefore means that the cases relating to non selectives aren't quite square on.

Perma I am sorry to hear this, and hope that one of the legal experts sees it soon. Very unMN-ey (especially in grammar school thread context) hug to you and your dd.

I'm stunned that they've ignored the length of time it took to correct the mistake. So sorry to hear the outcome. X

Didn't someone say they have amended the rules this year so they do not need to honour mistakes.

I'm sory your daughter will be upset.
Did you also post on the 11+ site? Maybe some of the experts there could shine a light on why/how they ignored the 'mistake' rule.

Sorry that this isn't the outcome you were hoping for. Hope that your dd isn't too upset.

BUT, it doesn't appear that the school has treated this as a maladministration case, and you are correct in going to the LGO equivalent. I certainly wouldn't treat this as the end of the line, but almost a negotiating stance by the school. They are probably very conscious that this appeal decision would be an unpopular one (and potentially give rise to other appeals). It is more face-saving for them if the decision is imposed by a third party. Not fair of course, and forces you to go through more hoops, but not a surprising outcome. I think that you need to steel yourself, accept that it isn't a "straightforward" outcome, and go onto the next step - referral to LGO-equivalent.

For your dd's sake, it is fairer to suggest to her that this is the end of the line however. She should have time to come to terms with her new potential school, and she isn't required to be involved in the next steps.

I really hope you take this to the next level - wrong, wrong, wrong that they should get away with messing people around like this.

I'm appalled by their decision and so sorry for you and your daughter.

I agree that the incompetence is breathtaking but the fact remains that the child fails to meet a critical admissions criterion.

I disagree, (still, and inevitably) with that line of reasoning, Yellowtip. The Code does not give special dispensation for Grammar/selective schools to deal with appeals differently, save for appeals directly dealing with 'exceptional failure', which this was not.

I'd agree if there was a pass mark and a fail mark - but it's not... it's a case of the top 150 or whatever, so a child could get a place one year and not get one with the same mark the following year depending on the cohort.

I think the OP has established that her DD is certainly of the calibre that would benefit from a GS. I don't think that her DD will struggles, or have a negative impact on the learning of the other children or anything of that nature.

However, case law shows that offers can only be withdrawn within a certain amount of time. The LAs failed to do this. The law needs to be followed, or else a new precedent needs to be set through the courts.

The OP and her daughter should not have been messed about in this way. The LA needs to do the correct thing, admit the mistake and reinstate the place.

I agree that the school may well be looking for the decision to be forced upon them. Good luck!

Pyrrah that's only on the margins, not where a child is thirty marks below the pass mark and 180th or so on the waiting list.

lougle it seems the Panel line of reasoning was along the same lines as mine, however much you disagree with it. In what sorts of cases has a child not fulfilled a critical admissions criterion and yet been admitted on appeal? Does it happen? Surely one has to look at the criteria for each school and then apply the Code? Not simply say that the same case law applies regardless of different criteria for different types of school.

"In what sorts of cases has a child not fulfilled a critical admissions criterion and yet been admitted on appeal?"

LGO case 99C01876, Yellowtip. The children in that case weren't even in the Council's area and there were other children who were in the area waiting for places.

The LGO still upheld that they had a right to a place because the mistake which afforded them the place (the actions of the Head Teacher of the school, who had no right to offer places in the first place) was not corrected quickly enough. The LGO did not accept as a good enough justification that the HT had no right to offer a place and ruled that the Council had to 'suck it up' because they had vicarious liability for the actions of their employees.

I think this case ties in very well with that, actually.

Well except for that the fact that the children living in a different area didn't affect their suitability for a particular type of education, as determined by an entrance test. Other than that it fits. But that's a big but and I'd say it overrides.

I nevertheless agree that the whole situation is a mess and I hope the OP isn't penalised by losing her right to appeal for her second choice school. That certainly would be outrageous.

except for the fact that etc.

Which clause of the Appeals Code are you relying on to justify your argument, Yellowtip?

Perhaps I've missed a page, because I thought I'd read it (several times) from cover to cover and there is no exception made in Stage one of the appeals process for grammars (other than the clear 'my child failed but is a genius really' process).

I'm sorry for your DD too, Perma. I can't understand how the appeal seems to have been focused on capacity of school buildings and entrance criteria when the clear issue was that a place had been offered and withdrawn too late. Did you get any sense from the Appeals Panel how they felt about this aspect of your case?

Oh perma I am sorry you didn't get the result you wanted and should have got.

I hope you get the advice you need and take it further as tiggy and others have said, the wrong decision has been made.

How can this have happened at the appeal, they seem to have ignored the cock up over administration?

tiggy how quickly can this decision be overturned?

But you say it's irrelevant tiggy and the Appeals panel says different. I don't think you can be categoric that you are correct. I believe the correct decision has been made, on the grounds that this is a selective school and different considerations pertain. All of those experts on here have yet to produce a case which concerns maladministration of this nature in a selective context. But I do strongly believe that the OP should hve a shot at her second choice school.

That got sent before I intended, but the gist is there.