state schools in london. did you rent in the catchment or know people who did?

[cheapandchic]

I have realised that where my home is positioned I most likely have no chance at getting into any of the schools that I want. I do not want to send my child to the school nearest me.

is it worth letting my house and moving closer? has anyone done this? how far in advanced to you have to do it? can you move out once that are in?

schoolsnightmare Yes, I understand all that. But how can assessors tell whether you own a property or not from your ctx statement? All it will show is when you stopped paying council tax at your previous address - ie, when you moved. So long as you move by the required date for admissions, what can happen?

Should also say, these parents don't leave their family houses standing empty for years - of course they rent them out. Which means their council tax is covered by their tenants.

KandyBarr - If there is any doubt as to whether or not you still own your previous property a quick check with the Land Registry will supply the answer. Indeed, it is even easier than that these days. There are plenty of websites around that will tell you when a property last changed hands and the price paid. And, as the LA, they know that they will have received requests for searches if the property was genuinely being sold.

That's just off the top of my head. There are, I'm sure, plenty of other ways the LA can establish ownership.

Ok wow. I am really shocked that some of you have mentioned this idea of moving to a certain area for a better school as immoral. Really?

First of all I am not talking about a 'fake' address. My husband works in property and in London we have been here 5 years and already lived in 3 properties. Its London... people move and certainly now that I have children I would like to move to an area where there is a great state school. I see absolutely nothing wrong with that. I was asking how long we have to stay in order to avoid some sort of investigation...

I do not see how renting out the property that I am in now has anything to do with that. After my children are in the school, if we choose to move to another rental, sell our house, or move back to it...that should not affect the school nor should it be any cause for investigation. We are a family that move house a lot, what is the issue?

If you want to talk about immoral...well one school that I was looking at and was hoping to move closer too is also a Cof E school. We already attend a lovely church in one of the neighbouring boroughs (where we use to live). I asked the admissions lady if we could get into this school if we lived close by but attended a different church. Her reply was "no". Apparently you have to live close AND attend their church. She advised me to alternate sundays between my church and this one for the school and then I would qualify and most likely get in!!! Another parent told me its a fact that parents pretend to be Cof E to get into this school! Pretending to be christian is far more offensive to me than renting a home near a good school. The latter I do not feel bad about at all...but maybe that just me.

Moving into an area with good schools is not the issue. Keeping your permanent home and renting a flat in the catchment, to move back to your permanent home once your child has a place is what is being described as immoral here. Having seen the upset it cause when a child just misses a place it does seem very unfair that some people can effectively buy a place.

I would be inclined to agree with you about those who fake a faith and I am an atheist! My childrens' music teacher also mentioned that she quite often gets enquiries from parents of very young children who want their children to start young to be able to fit 5 music grade in before they are 11! One of my colleagues started her daughter's tutoring for Henrietta Barnett school at the age of 5! Everyone has their own idea about how to get the best advantage, whether moral or not...

LAs are wise to the fact that people rent out their own house to fund the temporary rental of the catchment house, and will want to see the rental agreement for the catchment house. If it has only just started they will ask where you lived before - if you own the house and have not sold it they will see it for what it is. very easy these days with 192.com etc to find out where people are registered for voting, and a qucik search on land registry to see who owns a property.

'having seen the upset it causes when a child misses a place'

so I am stealing a place from who? the child who lives closer deserves that school more than my child because of their postcode? why? how?

I feel sorry that where I currently live I have no choice of a decent school.

The girl I was thinking of when I wrote that lives on a council estate and cannot move. She ended up at a school an hours journey away by bus where she was bullied. Her mother works but is in a low paid job and couldn't afford a private rent. The catchment for the school suddenly shrunk this year - she would have got in easily last year. The school got an Ofsted "outstanding" about a year ago which is probably why. The school's admission policy is ultimately based on distance - that is their criteria not mine. It is not a question of who is more "deserving". In my opinion "cheating" by renting nearer the school is not playing by the rules - admissions authorities also seem to think so.

Cheap I agree with you. Renting, truly renting and living in a place is not immoral.

Meh

Do what you need to do

BTW going to the "right church" is not unusual. I recommend you get the booklet with the entry criteria for the schools you are interested in and check the criteria closely. That way you will know what you are doing. If you do decide to move you are going to need to know the distance last year + try and hazard a guess as to how many siblings will be in your year etc. Distances can vary enormously year on year.

schoolsnightmare all your plan does is means that the wealthy get what they want

That's not exactly moral or ethical either

OP doesn't rent and place goes to someone who could afford to buy nearby

I wasn't aware that it was against the rules to rent, either.

A child at my daughters school lives in a rented house near to the school, there has never been any issue with that as far as I know.

SchoolsNightmare "which in turn makes only wealthy (and wealthy cheaters) able to get places"
So make the entrance criterion something which is not entirely dependent on family income: academic ability, say?

Exactly Sardine. Since when is renting not allowed? Especially in London.

I am pretty sure that in many many school areas there are many families that rent. Renting is short term or long term and it depends on the situation at the time whether I choose to move from that property and when I choose to do so.

The places are not allocated due to wealth. Why would I be cheating or stealing a place from a poor estate child? That is not true...if anything I would "lose" my place to someone with a sibling...or as I mentioned above someone pretending to be christian. And those children with true needs...already get priority in most schools I have seen!

And from what I have researched this "driving out the less fortunate" is already happening in London and in fact in many major cities in the world. I don't believe that trying to get my child a decent education is somehow disadvantaging others.

OP has not said she is going to "scurry" anywhere.

She asked how long she would have to rent near the school. I don't know the answer - one year, two years, the whole of primary. I don't know the answer. Neither does the OP, which is why she asked.

The solution is to ensure all schools are excellent so that there is no need to 'cheat' at primary level.

Yes more schools/places and improve standards across the board
I do think that publishing league tables in the way they are published has made things worse as well