why did you choose private school at reception?

[mumat39]

Hello

there are so many comments on Mumsnet about the fact that Private school from reception age is unnecessary so I was wondering why those parents that chose the private route did so?

We have a few good state primaries locally but all go to Y2 only. there seem to be fewer junior schools and even fewer secondary.

There is a good private school nearby that goes from reception through to a level, so for a number of reasons that is the one I'm leaning towards. But as there are so many views that inthe early years its not money well spent, i'm windering why this one is still popular and what ultimately are the reasons for parents to choose private over state.

I am genuinely confused so any views would be greatly appreciated.

Many thanks.

Sorry Mabs and word factory of course don't mean to criticise all parents who go private and would not draw sweeping generalisations like that (my parents and many friends privately educated). But as a state educated person who happened to fall in with the public school set at university then worked in the City as a lawyer I have over the years got heartily sick of ignorant bigoted people spouting nonsense about state schools despite never having set foot in one. Seeing it all set out in Xenias post just sets me off .

I agree with Pagwatch's first comment. My children don't go to private school because I want them to get a 1st at Oxbridge. I wanted them to go somewhere where they would be treated as individuals and able to realise their potential whatever that may be. I like the fact that potentially they could be at the same school with the same group of people for the age of 4 until 18. The whole school has a lovely atmosphere and everyone knows each other. It's like a small village.

I actually have never thought private/reception as a waste of money. I have always thought of it like building a house. The most important years as far as I am concerned are the early ones and they learn the most important skills of reading, writing and numbers. Like a house if the foundations are firm and secure the whole thing will come falling down.

There is actually a school of thought that if you can't afford private for the whole of their education it is better to pay for kindergarten/ primary than secondary as if you have got the foundations including a love for learning you're not going to really put it right when they go to secondary.

Dexter that is what we are doing. DS is now in Y7 at Prep, and in Y9 he is going to one of the 3 outstanding state uppers in our town (affluent, very "middle-class") - all 3 beat the local (non-selective) public upper school at GCSE / A Level results, coming second only in sporting events.

I think the early and mid years (up to 13) are the most important but I get a bit scared sometimes that it will all go wrong. We can't afford another £80K+ for secondary for him though.

We've see some children who used to attend his Prep during our visits to the state upper school's open evenings, and they are the children who are doing really well there, involved in every club, in every top set, and with many like-minded friends, so I think it will work out well.

Dexter this is our plan too. Our DD is joining a prep school in yr1 and the plan is that she will go onto our fabulous local comprehensive at 11. Hopefully state educated DS will already be there. It has incredible results, almost all children go to Russell Group unis with approx 15 a year to Oxbridge and I am not paying for private secondary if i think that she will get on well there, it would be madness but the prep should give her a good academic grounding, a small environment in which to grow in confidence, she is ncredibly shy and a belief that as long as she works hard she will achieve anything. DS is naturally confident and has all the above in spades hence doing great in his state school.

That's our plan too, can't afford the whole lot, but primary and university are important. I also feel that the public/privately secondary school educated people I have spent time with are less tolerant of others in society, generally speaking, which is unfair as not everyone is lucky enough to afford it.

word and diabolo comments from narrow minded bigots like Xenia do not make those of us who were not privately educated prejudiced against it - far from it. Her comments just highlight the fact that wherever you go or whatever you do there will always be a small minority of people who 'spoil' things for the majority.

Of course the only problem is even if you do plan to go state at secondary having to separate your child at 11 from all of their friends is a major issue which is why DS1 has just started private senior secondary and we literally have

no spare cash.

Having said that there are no decent state schools other than a Catholic one which we had absolutely no chance of getting into (total and committed athiests!!!) so beans on toast it is for the next 5 years!! This also added to the fact that none of his friends left the private for state. I think if you're in a catchment area for some outstanding state schools more children would leave the private system at 11 and it would be less of an issue for the child.

I have already prepared him for the fact he will be going to a state sixth form but the local ones are fantastic and I know his best friend's Mum is thinking on the same lines so hopefully less of an issue!

Just to correct my sentence in my previous post 'Like a house if the foundations aren't firm and secure the whole thing will come falling down.

Mascara I don't actually agree re the comment 'public/privately secondary school educated people I have spent time with are less tolerant of others in society' although I do think there is a difference between a proper 'public' school rather than just the local private.

The private school my sons go to is large (nursery age up until six form, including separate girls and boys schools). It is at the heart of the community and they do a lot of work in conjunction with the local community including local projects such as Rathbones which provides support for children excluded from school. They carry out projects in the local community with these kids and both get an insight into the other's point of view. There is certainly more of a problem in my area with the private school kids being harassed and bullied to and from school by the state educated kids rather than the other way round. On one occasion I went to pick up my son (I had my six month old in the car) and my car was surrounded by a group of youths from the state school next door and one put is hood up and mimicked shooting me with a gun.

I think the fact that most parents who do pay for private education would rather admit to necrophilia than admit to having gone private backs up the point. A lot of parents I know will be deliberately vague about where their child goes to school to avoid the situation of having to justify their choice (why people, sometimes almost perfect strangers think this ok I don't know) or being negatively judged. I remember on a private v state school thread where some actually said they ' would never be friends with someone who sent their child private'. However there was little comment against that view. Imagine if a someone said that the other way round??!!!

DexterTheCat, thanks for getting this thread 'back on track'. There are so so many threads on MN where this whole topic has become a bit of a slanging match between the state school vs private school camp.

dexter I am sending my child to private primary but I am still entitled to say I have met several people from public and private school who honestly couldn't appreciate different lifestyles to themselves. Thee are downsides although I expect those who have been, can't see them.

In fact this is why the whole debate gets so heated... The whole looking down your noses at people. Not an attractive or useful trait, IMO.

Alan Sugar etc as well as being as common as muck hasn't changed class just because he hwas wealth and accent in many many careers holds people back. We judge people immediately on their accent and their grammar and words used. It's crucial. It's a fact. It's not snobbery. It's just how it is and we do children a disservice in state schools if they are told it's fine to have strong accents no one can understand and employers will hate.

Xenia, I judge people on what they say rather than the accent they say it in. I am judging you very harshly at this moment.

I think in general people feel entitled to comment on things that appear out of the norm in some way, and especially if this makes them feel uncomfortable.

I think Xenia has an unpalatable yet valid point about accents as it was on the news recently that allocution lessons are at an all time high as young people feel their accent gets in the way of securing a decent career promotion/job opportunity.

Clearly we can all think of places where this is not a problem but there is still a perception of having to moderate accents and sound articulate for certain careers.

Having said that, most private schools do not correct accents and in fact where I live I would say you would not be able to tell between a private and state school from the accents their children speak, unless it is an inner city school.

With regards to "living in the real world" comments, my children attend a state school in a middle class village in a very rural area and I can honestly say they are not in touch with the "real world" either and they do not realise how priviledged they are, no matter how much we tell them.

Agree usually the accent of the child follows that of parents surely? Anecdotally have found that to be the case (brought up in deepest Somerset went to local comp speaks received pronunciation).

Agree with the above posters its not as simple as private/good but terribly snobbish state/bad full of regional accents and low achievement. There are brilliant state schools and deeply average private ones and vice versa. My school had better results than the local private school.

Again anecdotally at my sisters wedding recently her friends (from the local comp) were all tossing blond hair and cut glass accents with jobs as doctors and lawyers. The grooms friends from the private school had very regional accents, some didn't have jobs the others had very low grade ones so generalisations just don't hold true.

Would love to see Xenia vs Alan Sugar!

I agree that you're better going private for primary than secondary if it's a choice of one or the other.

Although, I would sound a note of caution about being in the same school from 3-18. It really depends how separate the Junior and Senior schools are. At my school (7-18, I went at 11) they're quite integrated and I know people who went all through, who said they didn't have the same chance of feeling like 'the big girls' in Year 6, and wished they had.

Then again, it is easier to get into an academic secondary from their junior section. Interestingly, people were moved out of my prep at 7 to go to the junior part of the senior school. (I think the people who went at 11 were more well rounded, having not been 'babied' for another 4 years, but that's just my opinion.)

Accent and class were only a small part of my list of reasons but the debate over how you are helped at work and in life if you speak properly is very interesting and it's true that it helps as said above.

I don't watch television or virtually never so would not have ever seen AS on screen as it were but from pictures in papers he looks a bit fat and I imagined he was a bit common but I might be wrong. Now in many trades that doesn't matter at all but in plenty you need to speak a certain way to be understood by those with whom you deal.

Xenia - you have never seen Alan Sugar, apart from pictures in papers, you say.

From that you deduced he is "common as muck" (to quote your earlier phrase up this page).

Are you saying you can tell if someone is posh or common from looking at their picture? That is an amazing talent. You should market that!

I am just wondering where the parents' input is in all of this Xenia? I went to my local comp, but by even my DD1's private school standards I am very well spoken amongst the parents there. I put this largely down to my upbringing. I guess if you choose to hand off most of the care and responsibility for your child to others, then you will absolutely make sure that those responsible (in this case your children's school) will share the same sentiments as you, however out of touch those might be.

In my experience, balance is an underrated virtue. Find some balance in your life and these things will become less important to you. My wish for my two children is that they are happy and achieve all that they are capable of achieving - and this is not necessarily a double first from Cambridge.

Oh, btw Xenia - I am sure, as you have not been introduced, he will be Lord Sugar to you

Speaking with a regional accent shouldn't (and mostly doesn't) hold anyone back, but bad grammar certainly does. Inarticulate and ungrammatical speakers have a hard time showing their native intelligence.

Xenia Again you make very large assumptions based on very little evidence.

You are wrong about Lord Sugar being "a bit fat". He is actually a keep fit fanatic who cycles around 150 miles a week.

He also flys his own plane and is 56th richest man in Britain.

Not bad for a working class boy who is now a Lord.

dia, yes sadly one can tell and it is a huge issue for the generation of graduates applying for jobs at present. Employers often do first ionterviews by phone to hear diction, accent etc. Also they like to see photographs and video as then they can assess class by clothing or rather if the clothing of that person will fit into that company. Obviously if you're working down the cuoncil tip you might need an accent that willfit with that etc.

This is a key and very interesting issue - that yes no a look never mind hearing people can be assessed. It's fascinating.

AS looks fat. He genuinely does. Yes you can be fat and exercise but he is not a great weight. I am not suggesting he hasn't done materially well but I really don't think he has changed class.

I certainly read quite a bit about him before his television days, early Amstrad days etc. Good for him but he is East End made good etc .

I can't do this any longer.

Goodbye sane people of the thread.

Obsessing/competing over accent in English is so parochial. What matters in these global times is how many languages and cultures you are able to function in.