Are your summer born children under achievers or high flyers?

[whoknowswho]

An article in the telegraph suggests August born children struggle at school by the age of seven and are more likely to take vocational quals than go to a top uni . My very late august born DD is thriving at school (Y2) top of the class and loving it but she's still very young so this could all change I guess. What are your summer born children like?www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/8860219/Summer-born-children-less-likely-to-attend-top-universities.html#

I was meant to be an August born but was 2 weeks late so turned up at the beginning of September. I was very tall for my age and ahead academically, so I felt I stuck out like a sore thumb.

It's all a bit irrelevant to parents though as how many people can actually act upon getting pregnant in a specific month? Some people try for years, I doubt people would leave off marital relations in November lest they have an August baby.

Aliceinboots, that's what my ds's school does, although for Y1 they are all thrown in together. It worked very well for him as it has given him time to catch up a bit.

My August born DS's attitude towards learning and school is the only thing i can see that is different from his winter/spring born siblings.He would plod along nicely but never enjoyed school. He never saw it as fun and interesting. His GCSE's were average i think a couple of b's, mostly c's with one d grade.

He would have left school in year 10 if he had been allowed, he had had enough of it. He got on well with all the teachers and was well respected but had had enough of school life by then. He has been at college doing a sport's course (he loves sport) for a few weeks but is already talking about quitting that and getting a job and trade.

My January DD has done really well, A* GCSE's, high IB score and she is now at uni studying Bio-med science.

All my other children (October/December//March) birthdays are doing well and love love love school.

So it is attitude rather than intelligence that i think has been the difference within our family.

I must say he is the most sociable out of my lot. He has a huge circle of friends and enjoys being with his friends so it was never the social side of school that he disliked.

Interesting also that DP has learnt on a recent Football coaching update that children born early on in the academic year seem do do better at football than the younger children too. Apparently an awful lot of the successful footballers were winter babies!

It's all relative though, isn't it? Some people are fretting about their Summer borns' being thick or are feeling smug that they got their planning right to have a super-clever Autumn born.
I just want my DC to talk and if I knew in the future she'd be able to live on her own and hold down ANY job I would be delighted and relieved.

I wonder why the kids couldn't remain separated by birthdays for the remainder of primary school?
Would it be that the teachers would be tossing coins/pulling straws to see how was unlucky to be teaching the thick0 summer kids for the next 7 years?

As you'd expect, lots of people have come on here to say they or their DC or someone they know are summer babies and have gone on to achieve amazing things. The study found patterns so obviously there will be many who do well, as well as many who don't etcetcetc. And we all love to disprove a theory, right!

Any of us with summer born kids who do struggle in school, despite lots of home input and support, will welcome the study in as much as it confirms our worries, that actually the age difference between them and their peers does affect things. My ds1, who is 8, is very good at some things but has always worried and struggled with 'getting' reading. He can run faster than any of the children in school and has the tidiest handwriting of all the boys in his year, is amazing at swimming and tennis (ok, stop me now ) but I know that realistically he would feel far more confident in himself if he was doing now the reading level he was expected to be doing a year ago in year 3. But what are you going to do, there needs to be a cut off point.

BTW Ragged - It's the Telegraph reporting the results of an IFS study, so not fair to say they are scaremongering in this instance, especially as other media are also reporting the exact same results.

Sorry for typos...shocking for an early September born.

My 14 yr old DD1, is August born - as well as 3 months prem, so should have been November!

Struggled with physical maturity in the early years, last one to get dressed and the like.

It helped that she started her education at 3 in a private pre-prep. They had a great system where the July/August boens started witht he previous academic year for the first term.

Moved on at 7 to a selective school, and struggled badly with handwriting and organisational skills.

Moved to state comp at 11, has been in top sets (for everything setted) ever since, G&T in several subjects (FWIW), although struggles with creative writing. My gut feeling is that this is more down to maturity than a learning disability.

9 year old DD2 autumn born, has always flown at school, especially in literacy. Frighteningly mature for her age, but part of that could be through having an older sister.

DH August born, and always struggled at school. Not helped by early years in a poor inner city area. ALthough he went on to do a degree level qualification in his late twenties.

My dd(8) is a late July baby. She is academically OK, but I do wonder how she'd be doing if she were one of the oldest in her year rather than the youngest girl. She definitely seems younger than her peers and is drawn to playing with the year below. She is easily crushed, confidence is a huge issue and she's never picked to represent the school in sports etc etc.

Hi Alice,
It would be interesting, in schools with two form entry, to think about having an autumn/winter born class and a spring/summer born class.
I guess there'd be advantages and disadvantages. But hopefully you could show with this research that it was an evidence based decision, and I think it might be accepted by parents as both fair and sensitive to the children's needs.

yes!!!! I am late August baby, and I actually failed first year at Uni!

agree, and know others the same

I'm an August baby...I did exceptionally well at school and university.

My dh is a December baby and didn't so as well.

I am a summer born child. I was put up a year early at school and was a high achiever at school. I also have a (male) friend whose birthday is at the end of August - he was also put up a year early and was very high achieving.

but Alice - 'Some people are fretting about their Summer borns' being thick or are feeling smug that they got their planning right to have a super-clever Autumn born.'

nobody is saying that August born children are thick. They are saying that the way the school year is set up in England and Wales will disadvantage those born in August. Just as it will be an advantage to those born in September. Over the population as a whole. So an individual child will not necessarily fall into the advantaged/disadvantaged category just because of their birth month.

As I said upthread, I am glad that (through luck, and poor contraceptive choices!) DS is a september born child - it may be that he is one of those children who will be disruptive because he is that much bigger and older than the rest of the class, and thus will be disadvantaged by being the oldest. I am hopeful, though, that he will be advantaged by being emotionally more ready for school than I was when I started (at 4.5 years, in Scotland), as he so far seems to be quite a feeble child, who drops to the ground howling if someone looks at him funny. (DH, on the other hand, is horrified that DS will start school when he is 5, as in his country they start school at 7, and even then often debate whther this is too young!). Only time will tell.

Just answering a query from somewhere further up - Irish Twins are when you have two children both in the same academic year but not actually twins (so maybe one born in October and one born in August). Not sure why they are called Irish Twins though - my guess is that it is somehow connected with Catholics not using contraception but could well be wrong.

My eldest son is an August born and way ahead of his peers, but it was not apparent this would happen as when he started school he could not read and could not hold a pencil.

Within a few months of starting school he was about a year ahead and then by Y1 about 2 or 3 years ahead - I remember teachers telling me that he surprised them all as he was almost freakish in his ability to focus on a task for such long periods of time.

I nearly kept him at home as I thought he was too young and that he would struggle both socially and academically, but that hasn't been the case at all and I am glad I reluctantly sent him as he was very happy at school and has made some lovely friends.

True though about football as he has no interest whatsoever in football or any other sport really, he much prefers to read a book or play chess. This is maybe because he has always been smaller than his peers and perceives sports as threatening, especially football. We've encouraged him to take up tennis and he seems happier with that.

My other children are all autumn and winter born and again very different experiences. I do truly believe that it is a lot about personality in the end, as developmental issues to even out as it was the case in my young son.

I would be interested to know if there is any similar research on Scottish children. Here the cut-off date is the end of February for admittance the following August. So no children start just after their fourth birthday. Does that reduce the disparity over the year?

DD1 was born on 29th August and started school the day after her 4th birthday.Her reading has always been exceptionally good,as has her general knowledge,but she struggles a bit with her handwriting and maths is her weak subject.But I suppose that could be true whenever a child is born.In sport,she used to get disheartened because she was so much smaller than her school mates and was afraid of being knocked over,but in year 3 she discovered cross country running and is the fastest girl in year 3 and 4,which has done wonders for her confidence.She can also beat all the boys at arm wrestling and is such a super confident rider that people who don't know her have commented how good she is.

I on the other hand,with an Oct Birthday,am the least qualified person in my family.All those with summer birthdays,DH included have more qualifications than me.

I am Aug born, as is my mum, as is my DD ( 5, y1 ).

I did well, and so did my mum. DD is doing very averagely at the moment. DS ( 8, Y3, Oct bday ) has always been top of the class.

They are incredibly different children though. DS is very competitive, DD much more social. DS has a sense of urgency, DD does things at her own pace.

DD is getting there. At her own pace, in her own time. So who knows? We'll see. She's happy, and thats what really matters at the moment.

Have now found out Irish twins are any siblings born less than 12 months apart. So they could well not be in the same academic year.

CrystalQueen, on the radio 4 interview they said that similar research had been carried out in other countries with a different academic set up (although Scotland not mentioned) and a similar pattern was seen. The youngest in the year were always less likely to achieve academically.

Meh, I've got two summers, two autumn and a winter. I think it depends on the child and the parents/teachers more than the time of year they were born although maybe for a first born being a summer baby might be harder than if you are a younger sibling. Or something. But as a general rule I guess being younger (in some cases barely 4 when they start) has to have an effect at least on a national scale.

In answer to the OP, my summer born DS2 is doing as well as his autumn born big brother. The only difference I found was that in reception DS2 was more tired after school than DS1 had been.

My DSis has a late august birthday and it's never held her back... She had the highest Mark in the UK for geography A-level the year she did it. She got a 1st at uni and got invited to exhibit at graduate show (only a select few were allowed)
She flew through school & uni with little effort . After a bit of dithering she now has a really amazing job which sounds so cool
I however was born in January and had to work really hard to get through school, and after illness struck me down at school and then again at uni I had to take an extra year in each but now I'm doing really well in the career I really wanted but it was a real struggle.
I guess all I'm saying is we're all different and feel that surveys like this are so generalising that they are pointless.

This generalisation just pisses me off. It is only England that runs Sept to Sept.

Here in Scotland we are March to March so you would be fine to be a summer born kid - it is the winter kids born Oct - Feb who are most disadvantaged. You can automatically defer if Jan or Feb - it is the norm now to do so.

So on the whole, Nov/ Dec are the youngest in the class up here.

DS (31st Aug) is in yr2 and doing really well, top set/table in everything. He is finding some of the work a bit easy (spelling)

However I do think he is socially immature compared to most of his class.

And we have also had problems with bullying as he is so much smaller than the rest of the class who all seem to be sept/oct/nov birthdays