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Original poster

school uniform - yes or no? anyone know of studies / evidence on this please?

75 replies

Abelia · 17/05/2011 12:17

I'm a Governor at a small primary school, very mixed intake in terms of family income and we were thinking of reviewing the school uniform - we currently have uniform but may get rid of it.

It was only a casual discussion in a sub-committee, but I think we may get ahead of ourselves in going ahead with asking parents / pupils, and wondered if anyone knows of any evidence or studies about uniform, costs, social divisions etc?

Alternatively if anyone has experience of their school going from uniform to none, or vice versa, why and how it worked, that would be really interesting to hear.

The brief argument is of course that on one hand, uniform costs money (although ours is standard supermarket fare, logo'd things are available but not compulsory). On the other hand, uniform is a good leveller. I can't work out which would be best.

I would hate for the uniform to be a worrying extra cost for parents (and it is very hard for parents to say they need help of course and I don't think we have any right to set out to ask that question of parents, even in confidence). On the other hand, does having your own clothes make it all the more competitive to wear the right stuff, and therefore even more tricky for those on low incomes to help their child feel comfortable at school?

Argh. Help!

OP posts:
TalkinPeace2 · 17/05/2011 13:10

UNIFORM
UNIFORM
UNIFORM
schools brought them in across the board because they stopped school being a competitive fashion parade.
having the 'right' bag / coat / shoes / skirt
wearing the same hand me down clothes each day

if you get rid of uniform get ready to have your bullying policy tested to destruction.

Only after age 16 should uniform be abolished.

IndigoBell · 17/05/2011 13:12

Uniform like you describe is far cheaper than non-uniform.

Also, you can give uniform out of lost property to kids who don't seem to have any.

crazymum53 · 17/05/2011 13:42

I would say that a uniform is best. Your school's policy sounds fine if logo'd items are not compulsory.
But if you want to change this you really do need to ASK the parents. As school governors it would be good practice to do this before you change anything.

sahm3 · 17/05/2011 13:52

Only after 18 should uniform be abolished!

Original poster
Abelia · 17/05/2011 14:04

Thanks for views so far. I take it the competitive clothes / bag thing still applies at primary level not just through secondary then?!

We would definitely always ask the parents, and the pupils, but you know, you set hares running and if the idea is a bad one in the first place, no need to.

It's not an arbitrary thought about why we should get rid, there is a good reason to do so, but I can't say what it is as that would identify the school.

OP posts:
mousymouse · 17/05/2011 14:10

no uniform, but a sensible dress code would be my favourite.

greenlime · 17/05/2011 14:14

Definitely keep uniform.

Even M&S uniform - got DS 2 pairs of short trousers for £4. Those 2 pairs will last the whole summer term no problem and perhaps be brought out next year as well (adjustable waist).

Re competitive bags - yes definitely at primary level - you could get a uniform bag. Our bags are £4 ish (can't quite remember) I think and every child in the school has one.

Uniform only becomes a worrying extra cost when items are very specific. Like logos. Personally, I would just make sure that everything required is available very cheaply and when sending uniform lists out, put on the bottom the names of shops which have the required kit for not much money.

I would personally find it far far far harder and much more expensive to dress DS in mufti everyday. Currently, he can wear his polo and jumper for days in a row until they get dirty. If it was mufti, it would be embarrassing to wear the same clothes over and over. So you just simply need more. Uniform stuff is so cheap that I have bought multipacks of the plain t shirts as home clothes wear in colours that are different from the kids' school colours.

Madsometimes · 17/05/2011 14:22

Really, even at primary school level uniform is a good idea, especially if your school has lots of children from low income families.

There is immense pressure on children to have fashionable clothes or the right trainers. Even with younger children that do select their own clothes, it is so easy to see the haves and the have nots. There really are schools that have the Boden children at one end of the playground and the Primark children at the other.

I know that such differences can be seen with school uniforms too. There may be children with pristine white polo shirts, tucked in with neatly ironed collar, and then others with grimy grey polos that are looking worse for wear. However, these differences will be magnified many fold with no uniform.

maisiestar · 17/05/2011 14:25

As a parent who has experienced both I would say no uniform or at least a non-compulsory uniform. My DS's first school had no uniform and I thought I'd hate it, but i loved and so did the children. There was none of the competitiveness i thought there would be - but the school did foster a very healthy attitude to making sure that clothes were about personal expression and anyone should be able to wear what they want and it was very out of order to make personal comments about any aspect of what someone looked like, ie it was on a par with making racist, fatist, etc type comments.
At his next school, uniform existed but is non-compulsory, sometimes he wears it and sometimes he doesn't but again it is very much a non-issue at the school.

I love the fact that he gets to choose, he feels like he has some control in this area of his life (apart from the fact that I refuse to buy clothes that i don't like!).

Bullying and singling out will happen regardless of what they choose to wear and i feel it gives children a stronger sense of themselves to have the freedom to choose.

The only benefit I can see of having a uniform is that the school looks more corporate to the outside world adn that the children are just cogs in that machine.

cookcleanerchaufferetc · 17/05/2011 14:25

Uniform!

Instead of insisting parents buy jumpers etc with the school logo, how about offering badges which parents can sew onto M&S/Asda etc jumpers at a fraction of the cost?

Hullygully · 17/05/2011 14:27

Plenty of countries seem to manage just fine without it.

One thing in favour of own clothes is that they don't go roll in the mud in them if they are wearing their best jeans.

MollysChamber · 17/05/2011 14:30

Uniform!!

MoreBeta · 17/05/2011 14:31

Uniform. However, if I could issue a plea to make sure that parents are not delivered into the hands of some school uniform shop.

For boys a a standard pair of black M&S/Tesco/Asda trousers, black socks and black shoes with standard blue school shirt under a logo sweatshirt (bought direct from school).

Having a set of logo sweatshirts printed up is not expensive at all.

Our DSs school(private Prep) basically change uniform quite often and there is only one shop we are allowed to buy it from. The cost is 5 x what it should be and hence lots of parents buy non standard bits and pieces or not bother at all.

WowOoo · 17/05/2011 14:34

Hully, mine would.! But he still is only 4.

I prefer uniform. He and I know what he's wearing and there's no argument about what he wants to wear or strops if his best top is in the wash as we have in holidays or weekends.

I like the fact that they all look the same.

juuule · 17/05/2011 14:36

Having a uniform doesn't stop there being pressure to have the right trainers, coat, bag etc.
Unless you dictate and distribute the exact same uniform to each person from head to toe and include bags and other stuff and strictly enforce it then they will always find a way for there to be the 'right' sort of clothes.
In fact, having uniform can make more hassle all round. Parents nagging, teachers nagging, kids rebelling. Uniform lost and having to be bought again where if it was own clothes it would be easier to identify when lost and possibly would be taken better care of in the first place.

OneMoreMum · 17/05/2011 14:45

Be aware that people will make judgements about other aspects of the school if you don't have uniform. It will be assumed that your school is less serious about learning and discipline and some parents won't send their children there because of it.
I'm not saying that those assumptions will be right but they will be made I'm afraid.
As a parent I much prefer uniform, much less hassle.

Original poster
Abelia · 17/05/2011 19:33

Ooh interesting late arguments in favour of no uniform!

I have tried searching on the internet but finding it hard to get some specific evidence about this. I have found one useful but largely anecdotal short study by CAB which states that where uniforms are ludicrously quite expensive, supplied by one shop etc there is cause for concern, but where uniforms are available from supermarkets, logo not required or can be sewn on etc that this is thought to be easier than the competition / pressure to look right. Perhaps I will wave that at the meeting.

OneMoreMum, I absolutely take your point but funnily enough the most sought-after, tiny-catchment, Ofsted-outstanding school round here has no uniform. I find it looks a bit chaotic and messy myself but clearly has nil impact on learning, results and general perception of said school!

OP posts:
DilysPrice · 17/05/2011 19:40

I'm a pro-uniformer too. Cheap, easy, thought free. Dark trousers, coloured polos (the white ones get too grubby), coloured sweatshirts.

sunshineatlast · 17/05/2011 19:42

Keep the uniform.
Fosters a sense of belonging, great equaliser, easy for parents.

ivykaty44 · 17/05/2011 19:44

I have never seen a child in France, Netherlands, German or Scandanavian countries wearing uniform and yet their school results put ours in the UK in the shade very seriously, so possibly the uniform wearing Uk schools could look to why it helps results not having a uniform?

usualsuspect · 17/05/2011 19:45

No uniform

ivykaty44 · 17/05/2011 19:54

I would say get ride of the school uniform but have same sports kit for students to have a sense of belonging to a team and representing a school in sports.

MovingAndScared · 17/05/2011 20:16

Personally as a parent I find uniform much cheaper than normal clothes - and even my 5 year old is more aware of what people are wearing and comments - and primary school children love wearing it!
do you have some kind of facility to sell 2nd hand uniform - I wish our school did
sure the reasons that other countries have better results is not to do with uniform

generalhaig · 17/05/2011 20:59

the only non-uniform school around where I live is very, very middle-class in a bohemian, media, arty type of way (it's a state school, but very sought after)

When uniform is so common a school without it is making a big statement about their ethos, and about the families who send their children there

My dc's primary used to be non-uniform (with a dress code which was widely ignored) but changed (after balloting pupils and parents) to uniform, because in the upper years there was an increasing tendency to wear inappropriate clothes (especially for the girls in years 5 & 6). I thought I'd hate it (being middle-class media etc ) but actually it made my life so much easier and we had far fewer tantrums in the mornings (ds1 was only 7 when it changed but already had very fixed ideas about what he would or wouldn't wear)