Teen Eating Disorders Thread 7

[Lottsbiffandsmudge]

We have managed to fill the previous Thread here https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/eating_disorders/4471980-Teen-Eating-Disorders-Thread-6?page=40

So I thought I would start a new one.

Everyone supporting a young person with and ED is welcome here for advice (non professional but lived experience) and support.

Hoping everyone can find us...

Lovewinter oh lots of love to you. It sounds so frightening for both of you. Sending huge positive vibes for your dds recovery from this horrendous illness and the awful time she's been having.

Basilbrush well done to your dd with her weight gain. It sounds like she is in a good place mentally right now so just keep that food going in while the going is good. I'm always told we're aiming for 95% - 105%.

Girliefriendlikespuppies mental gymnastics sums it up well. My poor brain is so taken up with dds illness I can't seem to concentrate on much else.

My dd will often get something while we're out, a smoothie or iced coffee and I think 'Yay extra calories' but she will then say (after I've bought it) 'that's my snack for later' and I'm deflated. I'll get the extra cals in by putting more fat in her dinner but I know I should push for the snack but some days it's just too hard 😞

Is anyone else eating more because they're trying to model eating freely? Biscuits etc, I'll take a few and eat them going 'yum yum these are so delicious' when I don't even particularly want them. It's very much like trying to get a toddler to eat their veggies 🙄

@Girliefriendlikespuppies mental gymnastics sums it up brilliantly ! I can relate !
@Lottsbiffandsmudge yep ! My gluten intolerant husband yesterday ate a massive slice of gluten containing cake as he knew it was D old favourite so sat there saying all the right things and then D about an hour later said dad I really want to challenge myself to have cake please could we have a slice together so of course he had another I may add very large slice ! Probs tmi but he was on the toilet all night last night

lovewinter What an amazing dad. I hope he's feeling better today.

Why since dd was diagnosed I've eaten more than I've ever eaten in my life, I think I've gained around a stone and a half in weight as well 😕 apart from anything else we always have tons of food in the house now. I spend a fortune on food as well, my friend told me she spends around £30-£40 a week on food for her and dh and I was like 😒 I spend £80-£100 a week for the two of us plus take aways and meal outs to encourage her.

No wonder I'm so poor!!

Dd being s complete pain with food today, pushed her lunch around her plate with lots of 'I'm not hungry' protests. It's so fucking wearing and I know it's push back because she did well ystd.

Being out of routine and off college (half term) doesn't help either.

@lovewinter What a horrendous experience to go through. Glad it's proved to be a bit of a turning point for your DD though.

@Whyisthishappeningtous re. the calories while out and about replacing snacks etc, I was always inclined to let this one go. My rationale was that ultimately good habits (eating normally, with friends, spontaneously etc) were going to be more important than exact calories in the long run. One of the few advantages we had when DD was at her worst was that she would go to restaurants, have takeaways, get lattes etc and that was a lifeline.

Re. the % WFH to aim for, I'm a bit of a stuck record on this but it's not a fixed percentage. I agreee that 85% is far too low to aim for. However, I'm guessing that DD is only just over 85% now and she looks really well, eats freely, has had regular periods since Christmas, is pretty much recovered. I think it's just where she sits naturally (throughout her life she's been 75th centile for height and 25th for weight). The psychiatrist wanted her to be a 100% as best evidence shows that's what works for the majority. However, I think for her it might trigger unhappiness and dieting and the whole carousel.

Everyone's different and I don't think it's helpful for clinicians to specify like this (either high or low).

Lastly, yes to my weight gain! Menopause and eating with pantomime gusto was a bad combo.

Hi all,

I haven’t been back here for a while - I posted back in June when I’d become really worried for DD whose weight had dropped to just over 6.5 stone - I got some really helpful advice from the people who replied. My dd was referred to CAMHS by our GP (after he took advice and realised he should have referred her rather than telling us just to keep monitoring her) and they diagnosed her with Anorexia.

We’ve honestly had an awful few months since then. My husband was not the most helpful at taking control of the situation ( he’s a bit of a bury your head in the sand type) and this ended up causing a massive argument that our marriage never really recovered from. I guess he was already considering leaving us but having to deal with this was just too much and after a few months of him withdrawing from family life, he walked out about 6 weeks ago.

DD had been very slowly putting weight on up to this point, it was very slow progress and many weeks were plateaus but it felt like we were going in the right direction. Since he left she’s dropped weight and has developed an absolutely debilitating level of OCD (prior she had a couple of small rituals she would do but now her entire life is ruled by routine and order). We’ve seen her therapist this morning who says we have to go right back to basics and the emphasis needs to be on me now to get this sorted and take control. I’m struggling with depression since my husband left and he’s not been good with the kids (drops her at school as she can’t walk but hasn’t arranged proper contact, hasn’t done anything with them on weekends/evenings until I insisted this week) so I’m feeling a bit overwhelmed with it all at the minute.

Has anyone else had to deal with other major life changes at the same time as the anorexia? How did you cope and how much should I be pushing her when she is already so upset about everything going on around her. I would be happy with very small gains but going in the right direction. Her therapist wants to see significant gain and quickly. Every so often they talk about taking her out of school or stopping her musical theatre classes if she loses more weight but these are the only things keeping her going.

I honestly feel so beaten down by all this at the moment but I know I have to stay strong and take control for her sake.

Oh Peggy that sounds like an awful few moths, I'm sorry your h couldn't step up and has now checked out. That must be so hard.

How much is your dd eating at the moment? I agree with valley that a blanket wfh is not particularly useful as all kids are different. That said I do think for most children with anorexia they need to overshoot where the would normally sit, apart from anything else, to give them a slight buffer.

I've seen a few ED behaviours creeping in this week (half term here) which is giving me that sense of impending doom 😕 dd has been leaving more and more of her lunch and walks seem to be getting longer as well.

Ffs.

So sorry to hear your update

Sorry posted too soon.
So sorry to hear your update @AndPeggy08 your situation sounds amazingly tough.
Do you have any support from family and friends?
In terms of pushing your DD I think the therapist is probably right but that doesn't make it easier. I can see your dilemma with all that is going on. And also how hard that must feel to you shouldering all the burden yourself.
I don't really have any advice for your specific situation. Only what I would say to anyone: take control, take each meal at a time, forgive yourself mistakes, try to find the determination each day to get the food in, buckle up for the long haul and look after yourself too. Rely on family and friends for a little respite, get signed off work if needed, see a GP for meds if it gets too much.
The OCD should improve with weight. I let my DDs (non food) rituals slide whilst refeeding as the weight gain was more important. We made conscious decision to tackle the ocd 'later' under medical advice as her ed worker told us the treatment would be too hard whilst under the AN grip (CBT). In the outturn it resolved itself with weight.
I guess I prioritised treating the life threatening illness...

@AndPeggy08 echoing what's been said, your life sounds incredibly challenging and I'm so sorry that you're having to go through it.

A friend had something similar - husband just threw up his hands and bailed (to another country at that). I think it's that old chestnut that is said of men who walk out on children with disabilities or other issues - why do men leave? Because they can. While mothers just plough on. God I had moments when I just wanted to walk out and escape the awfulness but we don't.

DD never had OCD but then with the anorexia developed behaviours that seemed like it to me (but were never diagnosed and I have little knowledge). The rituals around eating, the examining crumpets and bagels to find the most perfectly round, the scoring avocado on toast relentlessly. So many. And now that the anorexia has abated, so they have. There's so much that I thought had become part of her which has turned out to be the anorexia and has now evaporated. Violence, meanness, anger etc.

So I guess I'm saying that the therapist is probably right - you need to plough on with what you're doing and hopefully as the weight goes on, the behaviours will improve. We never had great weight gains - the very most was I think a kg in a week but usually it was more like a few hundred grams interspersed with loses. I got to the point where I was just relieved if it wasn't a loss.

I'm a big fan of judicious use of antidepressants, seeing how they helped DD. Would it be an idea to talk to your GP about some for you if you're not already taking some?

@Girliefriendlikespuppies
So sorry to hear that ED behaviours have been creeping back in for your dd. School holidays are so hard aren’t they and I can totally understand the feeling of impending doom. For my dd, weekends and holidays are always the hardest because of lack of routine - yet now she has OCD I need to try to break routine more often which is going to be hard.
My dd started off quite well, following the plan suggested by her therapist but over time has started leaving bits of meals, trying to tell me she doesn’t need snacks etc because she’s already had something and ia still totally ruled by needing to know how many calories are in her food ☹️ I would say she’s eating regularly but clearly not enough to stop her losing weight.

@Lottsbiffandsmudge
Unfortunately, I am not close to my family - haven’t spoken to my mum since my dad passed away and have never had a close relationship with siblings, so now that my husband has left, it feels like I’m dealing with this alone.
I absolutely understand you concentrating on the eating and tackling OCD behaviour afterwards, which is what I’m going to have to try as the eating and OCD must be linked. However, her OCD is bad to the point of having an exact ritual about timings on a morning and she will literally stand in the same spot in the living room staring at the time on the thermostat until it’s time to move upstairs, then will shout at an exact time for her toast to be put in etc - any deviation from the times and she’s convinced she’ll have a bad day ☹️

@Valleyofthedollymix
It’s good to hear that your dd’s possible OCD behaviours abated as the ED was treated - this is what I’m hoping for.
I probably do need to get some anti-depressants. Have been off work this week and considered asking for some but read the side effects online and that put me off. I asked for anti-depressants a week after he left as I couldn’t function without crying but the doctor told me to wait and see how I feel as the way I was feeling was a very normal reaction to being left after 20 years - I wish I’d started them then as I might have felt a bit more able to deal with this now if I did ☹️

@AndPeggy08 So sorry to hear. That sounds awful. Hang on in there. @Girliefriendlikespuppies - Half term is so hard to manage, isn't it? Can't wait for term to start next week!
As I'm usually all doom and gloom, I thought I'd share a positive. We went away overnight for DH's 60th birthday. D pushed herself really hard and ate in both a pub and the hotel breakfast room. Just small amounts, but eating in public is a massive thing for her, so I'm really proud she did that for her dad.

Yay Nan that's great, well done to your dd!

Peggy that sounds so tough, I found the ocd behaviours dd had annoying more than anything. Hers were more outdoor behaviours and included jumping if she saw a sign, walking into a corner rather than cut across, jumping on a bench if she saw one. It felt like I was going out for a walk with a bloody kangaroo!!

She is much better now although some of the behaviours still linger they're not as extreme.

I've had to manage dd on my own, her dads not about and in some ways I think it's easier as there's no one to undermine me and dd can't play one off against the other. There's obviously been times when it would have been nice to have a partner for support but you will be be okay.

Dd had a terrible day Ystd and I was freaking out a bit but has been much better today. It's so hard to know when it's just them naturally not feeling very hungry vs the ED raising its ugly head.

Valley which antidepressants did you dd go on? That's interesting that you think they made a positive impact. I've always been on the fence about meds but not sure if that's just made dds life more difficult 😕 I had s bad reaction to fluoxetine which has obviously clouded my judgment a bit.

Sertraline - started off with 50mg, went up to 75, now back down to 50 and hopefully onto 25mg by Christmas and off all together after that. I don't know whether it's definitely had a positive impact, but her starting on them did coincide, I think, with her decision to get better. She decided to go 'all-in recovery' at some point for some reason.

Having a bad day, I think it's a result of doing too much the last few days and letting DD13 stay up at a party she was having fun at last night.

Total food refusal today, and this is the longest it's been so not sure what to do next. My usual fallbacks of playing games, watching tv, gentle encouragement, bribes just aren't working.

I know the life stops mantra but what does this play out like in reality? Could really do with some advice as I'm struggling to keep positive and a brave face on now

Sorry to hear about your day @LittlePickleHead - for my DD ‘life stops’ meant no school the next day - she was desperate to see her friends there so this was a big stick I could wield. Practically it was difficult, hiding keys and school shoes so she missed the school bus, DH had to gently restrain her when she tried to climb out of the window. It was horrific but she got the message that this was not just an idle threat and she couldn’t go if she had not eaten, as she would not have enough energy - that way we tied food and sanctioning her activities together.

DD was in a really bad place, you may be gentler with say removal of phone - we found sticking to the boundaries the only way for DD (and her ED) to know we weren’t backing down and holding the line.

This is so hard. She's just got upset and apologised saying she wants to eat but she can't. I've just said I can see how hard it is but I'm here for her no matter how long it takes. But I just feel at sea

@LittlePickleHead so difficult - I was met with DD’s anger rather than her sadness and that meant whilst she raged I remained cool, calm and consistent and stuck to my guns. I don’t know how you deal with sadness and someone may be along with experience and advice. The sadness may turn to anger if you ‘force’ her to eat, and that is when sanctions may be used.

My experience is that you have to stick to the three meals and three snacks regime, it’s non negotiable but so bloody hard - keep pushing the food, it is heartbreaking but necessary.

LittlePickleHead Does she respond to being told what not eating will do to her body and her future? I've been quite graphic about hair and teeth falling out, bones breaking, organs failing etc which seems to get my dd's attention. I also threaten to cancel things we have planned and tell her she'll likely never ski again as her bones won't be strong enough and certainly no concerts or anything that requires a lot of standing or walking. And yes no school/college and no seeing friends. I say the longer she refuses the longer she'll just have to sit around doing nothing.
It's heartbreaking listing all this stuff but it does get through to my dd and usually within a day we're back on track.

@Whyisthishappeningtous she's not really responding to that no - she's just saying it's only one day and she's not going to drop dead

I think this is a reaction to me not telling her whether or not she's put on weight this week (I told her I wouldn't disclose as it's not helpful to her) - it almost feels like she's stopping eating just in case.

@Whyisthishappeningtous We do similar to @LittlePickleHead and that can help in particular the long term effects such as osteoporosis and this means she can’t ski and infertility. We have also flipped it a little and pointed out she has not always felt this level of mental anguish and pain ( also validating her pain) and pointed to the fact that when she was healthier in weight terms she didn’t feel this and while yes she was deeply unhappy that can and will be addressed when her brain is able to cope . However this is often far too rational for he ED state of mind a log of the time but has worked a couple of times.

LittlePickleHead yeah spelling out the health risks doesn't work for all of them. The only chink in my dds armour is that she's a bit of a hypochondriac and I can use it to my advantage when I really need to. I hope things get better for you there and you can find a way of getting dd to eat.

We had a family member come and stay Friday night. It was all planned and thought through and dd was informed of everything that would happen. But trying to cope with someone else in the house with Dds routines and rituals had me on edge for the whole 24 hours. I was bending over backwards trying to make life here seem normal and not making family member feel unwelcome whilst keeping dd happy enough to eat. Never again. I hate how isolating this illness is and feel like life is never to feel normal again 😞

Yes it's so isolating. I've had to cancel so many plans, including a girls holiday I've had planned for a year. I'm really worried about Christmas. DD wanted us to plan to be with family but I'm so worried it will be too much. But being alone will be very depressing for her do it feels lose lose

So hard to remain resilient and positive when feeling really down and depressed yourself