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Divorce/separation

Here you'll find divorce help and support from other Mners. For legal advice, you may find Advice Now guides useful.

Original poster

Is this a good custody agreement for the kids or just him?

59 replies

BookArt · 14/01/2024 06:57

Please see attached image. 'P' is me, 'R' is my ex.

Split up with kid's dad 4 weeks ago, still living together, very much struggling with what is right for the kids.

Ex has always prioritised work, so wants the custody agreement of our 1 & 5 year old to work around that. He leaves the house at 6.45am and returns at 6pm. Wfh on a Monday and Friday afternoon. Currently takes the kids to school/nursery on a Monday and Friday morning and collects them both on a Friday afternoon.

I think his suggestion isn't best for the kids. I think the random Thursday night would be tough for the kids with routine. And I want to have the kids for the full weekend, so don't want him to have the Sunday night of my weekend.

Ex also would wants our 5 year old to stop football on a Monday night because he can't facilitate that. I can and have been taking him to football, and our child loves it. However the agreement he wants is about squeezing in as many nights as possible, even if it means him getting them 10mins before bed time. I assume for CMS reasons.

He also wants the plan to completely change during school holidays because I'm a teacher, where I would have them during the week and he would have them at the weekend. I understand the reasoning with this, but does mean during the summer holidays my kids would not see family/friends on my side because they're only free at the weekend. I also couldn't take them away for a full week as he has said he wouldn't want to miss anymore time with them. He will not use his holiday for the 6 weeks holiday...

There's plenty of other things but I'll start with these basics. Eg Christmas he wants 5 solid days with the kids to go to his family, but on my year I'm not allowed 5 days because it's not fair for him to not see the kids for that long because I'll 'just' be at home.

Any advice appreciated. Please be kind, so new to this. I could be completely unreasonable and wanted some impartial advice.

Is this a good custody agreement for the kids or just him?
OP posts:
spearthatbroc · 14/01/2024 07:07

is he suggesting an alternative football day to monday? if not, that is appalling

either way - you two need an independent third party ie mediation or you need to get yourself legal advice. pronto. Not mumsnet

Original poster
BookArt · 14/01/2024 07:13

Thank you! I asked him to look into a fun football team (the current one is relaxed and fun) on another day or at the weekend and he has declined. Because he doesn't want the kids having activities at the weekends.

I'm seeing a solicitor this week. I was just really doubting myself after he told me I was selfish yesterday for not agreeing immediately to his proposal.

OP posts:
TeddyBeans · 14/01/2024 07:15

Custody agreements are always about what's good for the children. In that respect, football shouldn't stop for your 5 year old because it's what he wants to do, the adults need to work out how to facilitate it. The Thursday seems very random and wouldn't make any difference to CMS...

My son sees his dad EOW and has a videocall during the week every week. Same for summer holidays. If he requests extra time I'll do my best to facilitate it but he tends to leave it to the last minute when I've already made plans for my time with my son. Christmas is the only time that has it's own schedule. As long as you can prove you've got your children's best interests at heart you're all good

Mindymomo · 14/01/2024 07:17

Definitely no to the holiday situation, you should split this time into bigger periods. Regarding 5 year olds football, I don’t think that’s fair, I don’t see why there’s a problem picking him up. Also if your ex has DC every weekend, when are you going to get to spend days out with them, I think you have to have a re think before agreeing to this.

spearthatbroc · 14/01/2024 07:20

BookArt · 14/01/2024 07:13

Thank you! I asked him to look into a fun football team (the current one is relaxed and fun) on another day or at the weekend and he has declined. Because he doesn't want the kids having activities at the weekends.

I'm seeing a solicitor this week. I was just really doubting myself after he told me I was selfish yesterday for not agreeing immediately to his proposal.

Edited

so has he found one during the week that is not “fun and relaxed”?

EliflurtleAndTheInfiniteMadness · 14/01/2024 07:21

I wouldn't agree to that especially not the no weekends on the school holidays. Nor him getting 5 days at Christmas and you not. Ir sounds like he's only thinking of himself, your days dont count less just because they'd be spent at home. It's not about him and his needs or yours either its about what's in the best interests of your DC.

EliflurtleAndTheInfiniteMadness · 14/01/2024 07:22

Thank you! I asked him to look into a fun football team (the current one is relaxed and fun) on another day or at the weekend and he has declined. Because he doesn't want the kids having activities at the weekends
And yet he's calling you the selfish one.

Original poster
BookArt · 14/01/2024 07:23

He hasn't look for anything, it 'isn't important'. I've explained how it is important to our son, that he is settled there (he has a facial disfigurement so meeting new people is difficult for him) and he's going to have enough change in his life without removing football too.

OP posts:
Theunamedcat · 14/01/2024 07:24

Nope it's just serving himself not the children

TeddyBeans · 14/01/2024 07:25

BookArt · 14/01/2024 07:23

He hasn't look for anything, it 'isn't important'. I've explained how it is important to our son, that he is settled there (he has a facial disfigurement so meeting new people is difficult for him) and he's going to have enough change in his life without removing football too.

Your ex sounds incredibly selfish. Your son's activities are important even if your ex doesn't think so. Make this the hill you die on, your son needs to know you've got his back here

mouseychick · 14/01/2024 07:25

No that's absolutely not fair. If he wants 50/50 he has to do it properly

Original poster
BookArt · 14/01/2024 07:28

Thank you for this! I know it sounds silly but I was doubting myself, the Monday night was my hill to die on just because of football only. If football was another night I'd agree to him having the Monday night.

OP posts:
Sodndashitall · 14/01/2024 07:28

I think he's forgetting that these arrangements are both to make sure the children have access to both parents AND have their lives facilitated.
So absolutely needs to be putting the needs of the kids, football etc. It also should give you both weekend and enjoyment as well as the chores of school.
Holidays, half terms, Christmas etc should all be split on an even basis What if you want to go away for Xmas? If he has 5 days you have 5 days end of story
Fwiw if I am at home and so is my ex then yes the kids can see him over the Xmas period and vice versa but it's not a formal guarantee as I may decide to take them away and vv
Don't feel bullied just write back and say no that is not going to work for me and write down. What you wanr

TeddyBeans · 14/01/2024 07:28

What would your ideal be OP? He's stated his, you need to state yours so the compromising can happen

WaitingfortheTardis · 14/01/2024 07:37

The poor children won't know whether they are coming or going with that nonsense, he is clearly thinking only of himself and his needs. It's good that he wants to see them regularly of course, but there must be a better way. Can you change it and send it back? I also think with so much change going on your ds deserves to keep going to football, especially if it's somewhere he's comfortable and makes him happy.

mintmagnum3 · 14/01/2024 07:47

Wow, your ex sounds very controlling doesn't he! You all have to change and make sacrifices... yet he doesn't!!
Few considerations from me

  • do not agree to the holiday situation. You should have to miss weekends despite being off work. Liek you said, you have a family. Weekends are the fun part of the week, he has to share
  • consider whether in the long run whether him having every Friday is fair.
  • your son can go to football because you can take him. If ex can't work around that then he shouldn't take the Monday.

From experience I think some form of EOW is fairest for the children. They still see both parents and the quality time with those parents is better. They also get a stable routine as opposed to being back and forth. This is obviously just my opinion and what comes above this is obviously a routine that works for all families. You just have to be careful agreeing days set in stone because that means you'll never get those days, whereas have some for of alternation makes it more fair.

I would also say be careful agreeing things around his work. Jobs change. I did this with my ex and he changed his job a year later after being in that job for years and years!

Meadowfinch · 14/01/2024 07:48

Absolutely not. The man is a self serving arse who clearly only cares about his wallet !

The idea is to provide your dcs with as much continuity as you can. To reassure them that their lives will still be as normal and settled as possible.

NOT separate them from their friends, their hobbies and prevent them from seeing their mum on summer weekends.

Solicitor and mediation....then court.

Goldbar · 14/01/2024 08:05

What a self-serving arse! He clearly just wants to shoehorn in as many nights as possible to reduce his CMS liability.

No real advice, but I would make football on a Monday one of your "non-negotiables" on the basis that it's good for for DC. I'm not sure what I'd suggest for the holidays - maybe week in, week out, but if in reality you've been primary carer to date, that's a long time for your 1yo to go without seeing you. And whatever other arrangements you agree, weekends definitely should be split EOW so you each get a whole weekend to do stuff with the kids.

Goldbar · 14/01/2024 08:09

And it would really upset me to remove a shy 5yo from a group where they are having fun, keeping fit and blossoming socially, just so your ex can save a few £££ on the child maintenance, so I totally get you there. Especially since he's unwilling to facilitate any weekend clubs. Appalling!

Original poster
BookArt · 14/01/2024 08:30

I want a full weekend, including the Sunday night.

I want our eldest to continue with his football.

I've offered dad to come and do/help at a midweek bedtime as long as we are civil, because I know it's a long time to go without seeing the kids.

I'm more about what the kids need. Dad still came to Christmas day at my mum's house because it's about the kids, everyone thought I was mad. Moving forward on my 5 days at Christmas I would most likely let him see them, however it should be at my discretion and not his demand... if that makes sense.

The school holidays I love having the kids, but again I feel like the agreement should be maintained throughout the 6 weeks holiday too because of routine for the kids.

I'd already offered every other week but he can't facilitate that. I don't want the kids away for a whole week but I think it would be better than so much back and forth.

I want to maintain playdates, friend's parties and family meet ups. I am the only one that does these, it's not his job apparently. So taking away the summer weekends would really impact the kids. Obviously I'd have them EOW but then they wouldn't miss out on everything.

Thank you for this advice, it has made me realise that I'm not mad or as selfish as I am being told. Wanted to get my head straight with my requirements before I see the solicitor.

OP posts:
bobomomo · 14/01/2024 08:43

Custody arrangements are about the children but also will take into consideration work patterns - so if Monday is the day he can do the nursery run it's reasonable to try and change football, every other weekend is fair but they need to stay with whoever is taking them to nursery/school Sunday night perhaps. A random weekday as you put it is fine, but again only if they are able to do the school run, Thursdays on the week that's not his weekend perhaps? As far as holidays, splitting 50/50 is norm, and yes you will get 50% of weekends and he needs to put them in holiday camps or take annual leave to cover his 3 weeks in summer, 1/2 of half terms and Christmas Easter split or every other (he can't have it both ways). I would write down before mediation what you feel is fair, long term sustainable and give you time to yourself, remember you deserve a life of your own including time off!

GreenFrog13 · 14/01/2024 09:00

I wouldn’t agree to that schedule. It’s too complicated. I would look at it simply Your night, your school collection, you facilitating activities. I think for young children neutral handovers work best. What happens if kids are sick? You have work to and also need to be able to maintain a work schedule.

I don’t see what anyone gets from getting a kid at bedtime.

Would you consider splitting weekends? Eh one has Friday overnight and one has Saturday Sunday, alternating each week. I also wouldn’t be wanting equal weekend time and tbh it’s very unlikely if you went to court.

My DP did go to court and he has a child arrangement order. It has a term time and then holiday plan. He splits holidays 50:50 but you could look at 4 weeks each and then term time arrangements for the rest?

And finally start responding to ex with this is / isn’t in the children’s best interest and outline why. Whilst it’s best to avoid court, this is what court look at and the apply a welfare checklist.

Theunamedcat · 14/01/2024 09:03

It seems somedays that ds is doing everything with one parent and going to the other parent for bedtime? What is the point in that

Lovelynames123 · 14/01/2024 09:07

We do 50/50, days worked out over a fortnight. So week 1 I have them Tuesday to Friday then week 2 Wednesday to Sunday. They get a full weekend with each of us, and school holidays are the same. We are amicable so are flexible if things need to change, it's best for the dc to see adults working together for their wellbeing

Original poster
BookArt · 14/01/2024 09:34

Couldn't agree more. Both kids should be winding down for the day only to be dropped off at the other parent's house 30mins before their bedtime. I can just foresee meltdowns, I don't want that for the kids.

This has given me lots to think about, thank you! I am really hoping we can be civil and flexible with each other, but it's not looking hopeful right now.

The house sale made it go from civil to awful within 5 minutes. I see them as separate issues in the sense just because the house situation isn't agreed it doesn't mean we can't put that to the side and the children's arrangement can be civil.

OP posts: