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Divorce/separation

Here you'll find divorce help and support from other Mners. For legal advice, you may find Advice Now guides useful.

Original poster

Is this fair? Paying back house deposit.

115 replies

lurchersforlife · 17/02/2023 15:04

I am getting divorced after a ten year marriage and we are working on a settlement. stbx was unfaithful and was originally guilt-ridden and saying he wanted nothing, but now that's changed, maybe because ow has dumped him and he's in the shit. We've actually been separated 2 years but only now moving to a divorce. I've stayed in the family home and he is staying with friends.

I'm the main earner and he earns very little. He was a sahd as lack of career made it a no-brainer that he would do that role and not me. He's also 9 years older then me so no career not one he have up.

We have very little in terms of assets - a car probably not worth £2k that I need to get to work. About £30k house equity and no savings. I have quite a decent pension.

I can borrow £18k to take on the mortgage on my own (only my income was taken into account for it anyway) and he wants that minus fees plus £20k when the dc leave uni. HE doesn't want any of my pension as he thinks he's too old to really benefit (early 50s now).

I think it's too much - it's more than the assets we have now but he says because his dm gave us £60k 12 years ago when we first bought a house he's being more than fair. I think that shouldn't come into it as it's not my fault that's mainly gone - he made all our financial decisions when we were together and wasn't exactly great at it. Solicitor thinks we can negotiate him down but is also worried about a judge not signing off on it as he has nothing really and won't get a mortgage.

Any thoughts? With the additional mortgage payments now and him paying nothing for the dc I feel like I'm going to be subsidising him for ever now.

OP posts:
taxpayer1 · 17/02/2023 19:29

You need to add your full pension + equity and divide by 2. That is the fair share. If you want to keep the pension, you need to give the equity. He was a SAHD and sacrifice his career to raise your children so you could continue working. That happens to men every single day.

OhBeAFineGuyKissMe · 17/02/2023 19:54

You don’t need to add your full pension. Just how much has been accrued during the marriage. Which is why it is more complicated than a 50/50 split.

HazardaGuest · 17/02/2023 20:02

The fact that you are not willing to list the value of your pension is very telling. I suspect you need to swallow your pride and take his offer.

FloydPepper · 17/02/2023 20:20

OhBeAFineGuyKissMe · 17/02/2023 19:54

You don’t need to add your full pension. Just how much has been accrued during the marriage. Which is why it is more complicated than a 50/50 split.

This isn’t true. In a “long” marriage (which is not defined) it’s all in the pot.

autienotnaughty · 17/02/2023 20:20

Yes all assets would be taken in to account and divided 50:50. So that's any equity , savings and any pension on both sides. If what he's asking for is less or even equal to that amount I would agree as they will only increase in value meaning he would get more.

FredaFox · 17/02/2023 20:20

I'm astounded you can't see why this is the same regardless if it's a sahm or sahd
Both put their careers (or working of whatever kind) to support the other parent
Of course he is entitled to his fair share

Christmaspyjamas · 17/02/2023 20:21

I mean you're welcome to come here and vent but at some point you will need to listen to your solicitor and accept that a fair settlement as judged by an outsider (and by a judge) doesn't take all your hang ups and opinions into account.

You're keen for him to take what you see as the consequences of his actions but much less keen to do so yourself.

Your husband is asking for much less than he's entitled to. Be gracious.

Original poster
lurchersforlife · 17/02/2023 20:21

Er no, just been away from the thread. My pension total is about £150k but I understand that he wouldn't have a claim on all of that as some predates the marriage. To be honest, I find it disgusting that someone who prided himself on not having a pension could potentially take a lump out of someone else's, if it does come to that. It's not a case of swallowing my pride either, more to do with worrying about costs going forward and being responsible for everything. If pride was all that was at stake it would be fine.

At the moment, I think I'll probably give him more or less what he wants, though would like to try and get the £20 k closer to 10-15. I assume it was his opening offer so he may go down a bit.

OP posts:
FredaFox · 17/02/2023 20:22

I never thought I'd feel sorry for the man but you are shafting him here, 10-15k?!

Original poster
lurchersforlife · 17/02/2023 20:23

And he hasn't given up any career.

Solicitor says it counts as not a long marriage but not a short one either 😕.

OP posts:
FloydPepper · 17/02/2023 20:24

lurchersforlife · 17/02/2023 20:23

And he hasn't given up any career.

Solicitor says it counts as not a long marriage but not a short one either 😕.

How long?

FloydPepper · 17/02/2023 20:25

lurchersforlife · 17/02/2023 20:23

And he hasn't given up any career.

Solicitor says it counts as not a long marriage but not a short one either 😕.

Every sahm on here has facilitated their spouses career by being able to care for children, freeing the spouse up to earn more. Why is a sahd any different?

Original poster
lurchersforlife · 17/02/2023 20:25

10 years, but separated after 8, which solicitor says is relevant. We were together 3 years before marrying, also relevant apparently.

OP posts:
FloydPepper · 17/02/2023 20:27

lurchersforlife · 17/02/2023 20:25

10 years, but separated after 8, which solicitor says is relevant. We were together 3 years before marrying, also relevant apparently.

About the same as me
my ex wife decided not to have a pension, then had half mine. The rules apply to men as well as women so I’d prepare yourself for him getting 75k of your pension and half the house equity

Original poster
lurchersforlife · 17/02/2023 20:35

It's different because I don't accept I wouldn't have had a career without him, which is what 'facilitated' implies to me. It would have been harder/more expensive in terms of childcare, but I would have continued my job. If he had worked we would have had to use childcare a lot more (ds1 went to nursery a day a week to give ex a break...) but I would have still worked. When couples divorce who both had jobs I assume they still have claims to one another's pensions if one is worth more than the other, despite no one 'facilitating' anyone else's career. I'm not saying he should leave the marriage with nothing - £28-38k isn't nothing, but I'm left with the children, which is what I want but sole financial responsibility is a lot.

OP posts:
LolaSmiles · 17/02/2023 20:37

Having a parent at home does facilitate a main earner continuing to progress their career.
The fact he didn't have a career before hand is irrelevant. You knew he didn't bring much financially to the table before children and we're happy with the SAHP arrangements during your marriage. That's a choice you both made and it should be reflected in the settlement.

He sounds like he's probably quite a lazy person who was happy to drift into being a SAHP in a half-arsed way and expect you to be default parent from the second you got in the door and through all the school holidays, so quite different from many SAHM, but him being lazy doesn't change the legal splitting or marital assets.

Original poster
lurchersforlife · 17/02/2023 20:40

Well, I suppose every situation is different. Age as well as length of marriage is a factor. I don't know how old your wife was but ex was in his 40s and had decided careers/pensions weren't for him when we married. Yes, it's okay to say I shouldn't have married him, but I also think he shouldn't be able to take my pension when he was well into adulthood without one when we got together. To be honest, not having a pension is such a point of honour with him I doubt he'll go for it, though I do understand that he does have a claim to some of it.

OP posts:
HazardaGuest · 17/02/2023 20:42

Honestly swallow your pride and pay what he is asking. If he does decide to lawyer up it will be well worth his while. He is entitled to some if not half of your pension, whatever his previous attitude towards pensions.

EarringsandLipstick · 17/02/2023 20:48

lurchersforlife · 17/02/2023 18:36

But he hasn't been a sahd for 2 years and he chose to leave - I didn't kick him out. He did keep up the morning and after school care but he hasn't been a sahd. And I resent the idea that he enabled my career. My career is down to me. Yes, had I had more time off when the dc were babies it would have slowed my progress perhaps but he doesn't get the credit for my career.

He's not a woman and I don't think he's conducted himself as the typical sahm does. Do their husbands typically take over everything as soon as they walk through the door at 4.30 and run everything at weekends and in school holidays? Do they tell their husbands that they see them (the husbands) as the main parents?

None of this is relevant to the financial issue

EarringsandLipstick · 17/02/2023 20:49

Your STXH is entitled to half the assets of the marriage less any debts - £80k (half the value of the house)

That's not true.

HazardaGuest · 17/02/2023 20:53

EarringsandLipstick · 17/02/2023 20:49

Your STXH is entitled to half the assets of the marriage less any debts - £80k (half the value of the house)

That's not true.

No but the pension is a similar size…

Autumndays123 · 17/02/2023 20:53

You need to take the emotion out of the situation OP. The courts work on facts, whether that upsets you or not is irrelevant

You can tell the judge he was unfaithful - it's irrelevant
You can tell the judge he was lazy - it's irrelevant
You can tell the judge you asked him 10 times a day, every day to ten years to get a pension and he wouldn't - it's irrelevant.

The law is how it is for a reason. They will not make an exception for you. Your argument that he was only a SAHD out of laziness and you would be exactly where you are without him is irrelevant.

If your pension is worth 175k I would definitely bite his hand off with his offer asap before he changes his mind or someone knocks some sense into him.

EarringsandLipstick · 17/02/2023 20:58

OP, I've read through your posts again but I'm still not clear.

What is he asking for?

Is it £20k?

Or is it something less now & the £20k is when the DC leave education?

In any case: if you can at all, facilitate what he is looking for in order to take over the house.

  1. It provides security for you
  2. It reduces any dependency and interaction with him
  3. You have choices in the future (stay, sell etc)

So do what you have to (if at all possible) to ensure this.

Regarding your pension, he is stark staring mad if he doesn't look for some of it. However, if he doesn't, and is happy to achieve a settlement, then go for it. If it goes before a judge, he will be awarded a pensions adjustment order.

Regarding maintenance, has any discussion been had? Is he in a position to work and pay maintenance? He will be expected to work if hr can, regardless of his previous employment status.

Finally, it's really really hard (I get this - been there) to separate the human, emotional issues from the legal situation. But you need to try - forget about infidelity & SAHD or not. Keep it focused on practicalities, finances & legal matters.

EarringsandLipstick · 17/02/2023 21:01

No but the pension is a similar size…

Yes, he'd be entitled to a share of the pension but not necessarily half. The judge will consider his capacity to provide for himself in the next 10 - 15 years to retirement.

EarringsandLipstick · 17/02/2023 21:07

Just to say OP, the emotions are entirely understandable. I'm in the midst of a divorce (Ireland. Very long. Protracted. He's doing everything he can to make it hell)

I've had to borrow a very significant sum in order to hopefully buy him out of the house. (He may not accept this). I railed against this for ages - it felt like rewarding his appalling abusive behaviour. I've got more clinical now.

Similarly, as he doesn't see the DC at all, despite looking like I will get a significant increase in maintenance, it's still likely to mean (despite a good job) I'll just scrape by. No treats, no meaningful savings. It's because I'll bear every cost for the 3 DC, educational, sports, medical & it's costly. He will still have a large amount of disposable income just for him. It's galling

But this is the system. I'm focusing on getting out the other side & reappraising everything, including getting a promotion / new role when I have the me mental headspace to do it.

My sympathies. It's brutal.

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