Divorce - assets split concerns

[Free83]

I’m currently awaiting my Decree Nisi and am trying to sort the financial split with my S2BX. We’ve been married almost 10 years and have two children, aged 5 and 6. I used to work in a well-paid position in an Insurance firm, but gave up to look after our kids (they’re so close in age it made sense to stay home rather than put them in childcare). I’ve since worked in childcare, as a TA in my daughters’ school so I can be there to drop them to school and collect them every day. I have also started childminding this year, offering wraparound care for children at the school to earn a bit more. Unfortunately, because I’ve been childminding for less than 2yrs, no mortgage provider will take my earnings into account, so all I can evidence is £370pcm as a part-time TA. My contract at the school ends next month and they don’t have a position available to keep me on. My husband earns £102kpa, plus a discretionary bonus (in the 5yrs he’s been at the firm, it’s varied between £22k-£35k). His travel and lunch is paid for by the firm as a benefit in kind. We have £400k equity in the house and he has a pension of just under £300k. My pension is £60k. He is proposing that we split the equity in the house, giving me £250k and him £150k. He said he will pay £1k each month in child maintenance and give me £600pm in spousal maintenance. A 3 bed semi (we’re currently in 4 bed detached) in this area is £450k at a minimum, so I accept that we need to move, possibly much further away. This may mean the girls changing school and will certainly mean I can no longer keep my childminding clients. We have our next Mediation session in a couple of weeks to try to sort out the finances. Is what he is proposing correct? I don’t see how I will house, heat, feed and clothe the girls on this basis, but am soooo determined to not end up in a fight with him about money as it is absolutely key that we remain amicable for the girls’ best interests. Just need to prepare myself if his suggested division of assets is the likely outcome.

I would research the cost of buying a decent 2 bed in your current area as well as cheaper 3 beds. This is the evidence of what the DC need for stability, to stay at their current school, familiar area etc.

You then have options in the future to buy a more expensive place such as increasing your earnings, relocating for secondary school etc.

When the court and he is faced with what a 2 bed costs it is harder to argue that you need less. Say that is £350k and you can get a mortgage for £30k then like it or not you need £320k to house his DC.

I know CMS is capped at a maximum amount, double check what that is as he won't be giving you more!

Thank you. I completely agree about working. I currently work 31.5hrs a week, as a TA in my daughters’ school (15hrs) and as a childminder providing wraparound care to the children attending that school (16.5hrs). This has been the best arrangement I’ve been able to find to allow me to earn a decent income and also be there 100% for my children too - I don’t have to rely on any childcare, which obviously saves a considerable amount of money. If we stay in the area, I can continue working, but or can seek a better paid job. If I move to a Jew area, that’s my TA job gone and my childminding would take time to build up (recommendations, Ofsted sign/off, etc). I have worked since my eldest was 2, despite STBX not wanting me to (his mum didn’t work when he was young) as I always felt I wanted to contribute financially and I also wanted to keep myself busy and useful and interacting with people. I feel no shame doing a low paid job as it has kept me productive and enabled me to contribute, without ever compromising on the time I can give my kids. Work doesn’t scare me at all. I just need to know that whatever outcome we end up at, the children don’t suffer.

As I said, if we stay where we are, they have a loving network to surround and support them if I.cant because I have a different job. If I have to uproot them to miles away; where we know no-one, new school, new house, no friends, no family, I struggle to see how all of that change - plus being put in childcare, which they’ve never known - would be the best thing for them.

I work almost full-time as it is, so that is not an issue. The issue is stabilising the girls’ lives as much as possible throughout and immediately following this process.

AFAIK the cms amount for that salary for 2 DC is around 1k a month. So it isn't a generous offer of more than the minimum.

He also gets annual bonuses. The 4 yrs he’s been with the company have ranged from £22k-£35k, so that’s been calculated at a ‘conservative’ estimate of £1k additional take home pay each month, averaged out over the year.

OP your thought process is impressive. 😀

Having been through the divorce process myself, which took a total of 2.5 yrs - solicitors, mediation and ended up with me self repping at court, you already seem well equipped from a knowledge POV to do likewise (minimal cost if self repping!). Although it’s not a recommendation due to the stress sides of things, it’s a possibility for you if it comes to it. You do not come across as grasping and you are realistic.

Irrespective of the outcome of a financial order, a court will expect you to have a job and not rely on maintenance. I don’t know about this. I agree partly, however I gave up a highly paid job to move my child to a place where I had more support and then I only worked term time for years and only during school hours.

I believe it made a massive difference to my kids security and wellbeing. I was stressed and tired single handledly raising my child and working in a said high paid job. We aren’t super women and our kids do like is being around if we can.

But this is not an option for STBX as this leaves him with no capital to buy his own place - houses are pricey here, but with house equity and a full time job, I could get a mortgage

If he gets bonuses of £30k and earns £100k then within 2 years he can easily save an £80k deposit which is 20% of a £400k 3 bed house in the area you say.

Stop feeling sorry for him. He’s taking you for an absolute ride. Do not disrupt your girls’ schooling and move areas. You need to look out for them not him.

I’m going to sound really dumb here, but I’ve just had an epiphany! His determination to have capital to put down a deposit means that the girls and I have to sell up, totally upend our lives and move 50miles away! If he was willing to let me have the house equity and he’d have his pension, I could keep my jobs, the girls could stay in the school, we’d be with our friends, our family (can walk to both sets of grandparents) and have a really solid support network. But because he wants a portion of equity, that makes this are out of reach and we will have to move schools, I’ll lose both my jobs (so become financially weak and dependent), we’ll be away from all friends and support... and the only change he’ll make is moving house! His job/friends/life will remain unchanged. So the girls and I are uprooting ourselves and putting ourselves in a weaker position purely to facilitate his desire for capital!! Surely a court would never allow that?! Why is his solicitor not explaining the reality of the situation to him?!? He seems completely blind to the reality of the situation😥.

Have you really only just realised this?

Because he is utterly selfish and self centred and using your desire to remain amicable to fleece you of what is required to house your DDs appropriately in THEIR local area.

You need a SHL.

I'm a bit baffled that you've only just realised this. I posted this, as did other posters.

Just focus on what's best for the children in any discussion, and that is continuity. He's not offering that at all.

Free,

Have you actually seen a solicitor yet?

The option is not agreeing to what he says or court. Once you have both seen solicitors, he will know (roughly) what a court might decide. Given his desire for assets and a full court hearing might waste 20% of your combined assets, he will probably negotiate in a far more reasonable manner.

Your husband wants capital for his new single life. This is a non negotiable for him. He is not your friend. He does not care about you. He only cares about your children if it doesn't not impact on his need for capital. It is all about him.

You need a SHL to do the hard negotiation if you can't.

Please don’t up route your kids or your life. You sound like you are hardworking and have done the best you can for your kids already. If you can’t keep the house try stay local in something smaller. You need all the roots you have built and to be able to keep your kids in school and your job without changing is massive. Kids will also need a happy less stressed mum.

@HollyIvy89 uproot not up route

How are you @Free83?

Thanks, @Disfordarkchocolate. Things are tense - we’ve been keeping out of each other’s way for the past couple of days. I’m definitely going to go back and speak to the solicitor I got initial advice from. I feel like the most important next step is to ensure he is also seeking proper legal advice, as there’ll be no talking to him unless he is properly made aware of what a likely outcome is going to be. He may have had a short telephone chat with someone, but he definitely hasn’t had a sit-down, F2F meeting with a solicitor, which I think will help massively in terms of him facing up to the kind of conversations we need to have and things we need to consider in order the move this forwards.

I’ve done a massive amount of research, so feel ready for the hard conversations, but he tends to be very tunnel-visioned at the best of times, so I need to force the issue to get him to talk to a solicitor and find out what the best case and worst case scenarios are likely to be for him, then realise that his current thinking is way off the mark. If I can get him to see reason, that’s obviously my key aim, in the hope that we can avoid court. We’ll all - especially the girls - lose out if we go down that route, as I think amicability would be our the window 😔.

We had no money to argue over when I got divorced but the legal bills were still scary, the more you can decide without court the better. I think you're right about him needing legal advice though, the courts will focus on the children and keeping their life stable not him. A reality check may be just what he needs, especially when he has such good earning capacity in the future.

Oh OP. I've been where you are now and it's so hard. For me, it was a continuation of the dynamic of the relationship we had- he called the shots, and I did what I could to keep him happy, was so determined to be good and amicable.
It took years for me to face that being amicable meant giving in to his rules and doing things as he said. He is in a huge house (our marital home), I am in a tiny rented house with 2DC. Always, ALWAYS think of your girls when you're in this process. I was so caught up in being amicable, I couldn't see that it was our children who would suffer.

How are things going @Free83? Did you manage Christmas ok?

Only the marital part is divided equally.

There is so much bull shit advice given here it's un-believable.

Literally your entitled to 50% only of what you put in during marriage.

It's an urban myth you get 50% of everything. Your only entitled to 50% of what was earned during marriage. Not 50% of everything.

If you stayed at home 20 years then fine, yes an argument exists. But let's be clear, it isn't 50% of everything.

I got awarded full equity and a pension share when I split with ex. It was then a clean break divorce. Make sure you seek advice and do what's right for you and the girls xxx

You'll need to get this to court ASAP.
Once he wants a divorce he can start to relocate assets. The clock only officially starts (12 months) once the court asks for his official financial declaration. And even with this document he only had to declare the last 12 months. So if he had decided himself that he wanted a divorce say last June, and moved assets and he could draw out getting his papers to the court by June this year. It's all above board.

What I'm saying it's don't delay. Whatever you do, get it to court soon. You've tried mediation which has to be done first, that box is ticked.

The other thing to add is that not having a court ordered division of assets or an agreed division of assets during mediation has the potential to undermine a house sale. Your solicitor has to have agreements in writing before proceeds are released. I've been there and it was difficult.

It's likely he'll delay so you will be forced to agree his terms.

Get it to court quickly!

Your only entitled to 50% of what was earned during marriage.

Time in the relationship before marriage, especially when living together, can also be counted.

Though there is no 50% "entitlement" at all, it's merely a starting point as every marriage is different. Plus, if there are kids, that's another matter altogether.

Legal advice again, and mention his pension.